Game Attendance = Awful

[CoCoNuT]

Minus the Chargers... which is a different topic of awful attendance if true, Bengals were bad.
81% attendance, 426,207 people total for 2017.

Looking back over the years since Dalton has been here we have been between 25-32 basically in attendance.
Even back in the Palmer days when we had 100%+ attendance we only barely cracked the teens 1 year (19th).


http://www.espn.com/nfl/attendance








Post by Kevin (Page 2)

I will post Bengals attendance from 1968 to now.  Keep in mind they started at small Nippert Stadium, in 1970 moved to larger Riverfront Stadium and in 1990 move to larger Paul Brown Stadium.  There were some strike shortened seasons such as 1982 and 1987. 1982 was only 4 home games and that was sad considering Bengals had just been in Super Bowl and it should have been more of a profit to Paul Brown.  The strike years turn off fans for next few seasons also. In 1978 the NFL went from 14 games to 16 games, so one home game added.  In looking at these numbers not every good attendance year is a good record season and vice versa. Some average to awful years had fans in stands and some good seasons the fans weren't there.  It seems ticket sales have a great deal to do with the seasons leading up to it.  2017 poor ticket sales probably due to how awful Bengals were in 2016.  The lowest turnout in Paul Brown Stadium History is 2011 and I liked that team, but the Carson and Ocho fans sure didn't get behind that team. Of course there was the bad 2008 and bad 2010 seasons and 2011 started with a strike lockout which fans hate, and Carson hold out, Ocho gone as well as one year TO gone. Still, 2011 was a good up and coming play-off team, but they were a surprise as many felt 4 win season or less was coming.  So ADVANCED TICKET SALES are huge. I would guess advanced ticket sales for 2018 will not be very good coming off 2 losing seasons.  The Bengals best attendance was 2006 and of course 2005 brought advanced ticket sales for 2006.   So it very much looks like ticket sales have a great deal to do with the season before, so we can blame 2017 ticket sales on the 2016 season with 2017 not being much better.

The Attendance rounded off in the hundred thousand number :

1968- 180 Nippert AFL EXPANSION TEAM
1969-191 
1970-408 Riverfront, Play-Offs First Year in NFL
1971-415
1972-398
1973-387 Play-Offs
1974-368
1975-360 Play-Offs
1976-363
1977-322
1978-355
1979-330
1980-364
1981-422 Play-Offs, Super Bowl
1982- 215 NFL Strike 4 Home Games, Play-Offs
1983-397
1984-390
1985-425
1986-433
1987-376 NFL Strike With Replacement Player Teams
1988-442, Play-Offs, Super Bowl
1989-440
1990-473, Play-Offs
1991-423
1992-413
1993-353
1994-415
1995-385
1996-382
1997-440
1998-444
1999-405
2000-470 Paul Brown Stadium
2001-455
2002-422
2003-479
2004-524
2005-526 Play-Offs
2006-528
2007-526
2008-517
2009-512 Play-Offs
2010-483
2011-394 Play-Offs
2012-490 Play-Offs
2013-506 Play-Offs
2014-486 Play-Offs , FCC stops TV Black-Outs of Home Games. 
2015-491 Play-Offs
2016-508
2017-425 

Again, as bad as 2016 team was, 508 thousand, so more to do with advanced ticket sales due to year before.  Awful 2016 caused decline in 2017 and look for 2018 to be down. Again 2011 season was down due to 2010. Some awful early 1990's attendance was up from Super Bowl and Play-Offs causing advanced ticket sales. It looks like people bought tickers to see new Riverfront and new Paul Brown Stadiums, wanting to see new stadium. Sadly those first years in Paul Brown Stadium were some of worst Bengals teams ever, yet attendance up at first.  

The Brown Family has urgent need to get 425 figure up as they had in 2002 with 422 figure.  I don't include 2011 because play-offs with rookies Dalton and Green was already a help.  New Coach Lewis and Top Pick Carson Palmer spiked ticket sales quickly after awful 2002.  Bengals are bringing in new coaches after 2017. They need to fix offensive line and such in free agency and draft. If Detroit Defensive Coordinator brings over some of his Detroit Defensive free agents, that could make Bengals a Super Bowl Defense real fast. There will be no Carson Palmer draft type for fans to gush over, but fixing the O Line and Defense could bring play-off wins to increase attendance going into 2020's.  

Those saying hitting 425 number as in 2002 doesn't bother Brown Family, I disagree and this is hitting them in their bank account hard. Brown Family wants back up around the 500 figure ASAP, you can count on that. To be around 400 instead of 500 is a lot of empty seats and 1/5 less home game money. A 20 % loss in home game money hurts and there is no way they can be happy. Even with TV profit sharing it is still a 20 % loss on home games to Brown Family. The good news is it was just one year. If they can get back up to around 500 fast, it will just be an off year. Still, they need wins to climb back up the ladder. Trust me, The Brown Family is hurting big time from 100 thousand missing fans. That is a ton of money and they want those 100 thousand fans and their money back. THIS IS WHY MIKE BROWN IS NOW GIVING RARE MEDIA INTERVIEWS. LAST TIME HE GAVE INTERVIEWS HE WANTED A NEW STADIUM. WHEN MIKE BROWN GIVES INTERVIEWS, HE WANTS MONEY. IN THIS CASE HE HAS LOST 20 % OF HIS HOME GAME MONEY AND HE NEEDS TO GET FANNIES IN THE SEATS AGAIN. Some of his free agency moves and draft picks have not worked out at all, and he is losing money big time at a 20 % loss in home game revenue. Even he knows that he can't stay in business long at a 20 % loss each year. To the fans it's about wins and losses, but to Mike Brown it now becomes about a 20 % loss in revenue and how does he get ticket sales back up ??? MONEY BALL. ...EMPTY SEATS ARE HIS ENEMY. EMPTY SEATS TEAMS CAN'T COMPETE.

1968 Bengal Fan

[Gohards]

Ownership = Awful
Management = Awful
Coaching = Awful

you get the point, its a domino effect.

[HarleyDog]

Typically you would think this would get an owners attention. With revenue sharing, Mike doesnt really care.

[CJD]

With how great watching the game is from home now, I can't imagine attendance ever rising again. I know that, even if we become a great team, I will likely never go to a game except maybe a playoff game.

The price and convenience are just so...insane from home to going, it's hard to ever justify going unless you have been for the last 10 to 15 years.

That is, of course, just my opinion. Your opinion may be very different.

[sandwedge]

Sadly this doesn't effect MB. It effects the downtown merchants, parking people and the concession people.

[HarleyDog]

(01-22-2018, 04:13 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: With how great watching the game is from home now, I can't imagine attendance ever rising again. I know that, even if we become a great team, I will likely never go to a game except maybe a playoff game.

The price and convenience are just so...insane from home to going, it's hard to ever justify going unless you have been for the last 10 to 15 years.

That is, of course, just my opinion. Your opinion may be very different.

Agree. Such a waste of money for an organization who don't care about me, only my money.

[*Nately120*]

(01-22-2018, 04:13 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: With how great watching the game is from home now, I can't imagine attendance ever rising again. I know that, even if we become a great team, I will likely never go to a game except maybe a playoff game.

The price and convenience are just so...insane from home to going, it's hard to ever justify going unless you have been for the last 10 to 15 years.

That is, of course, just my opinion. Your opinion may be very different.

I'm a big fan of not leaving the house when I can avoid it, but it all comes down to the product on the field.  I really doubt anyone of the Vikings fans who saw that Diggs miracle TD from the stands were thinking "Damn, I wish I were sitting at home right now."  

[Au165]

(01-22-2018, 04:08 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Typically you would think this would get an owners attention. With revenue sharing, Mike doesnt really care.

I feel the opposite. The fact when they are good it really doesn't move the needle much tells me the owner it makes little difference either way.

[*ochocincos*]

Bengals fans are showing they won't settle for a crappy product, as they should.
No longer will the fans show up to games simply because it's local football.
Win more or people stop coming.

[*Nately120*]

(01-22-2018, 04:19 PM)Au165 Wrote: I feel the opposite. The fact when they are good it really doesn't move the needle much tells me the owner it makes little difference either way.

Yes, but most teams that aren't great on the field make marketing decisions to bolster the value of their brand.  The Cowboys haven't won a SB in quite a while, but they have a marketing hold akin to Coca "gotta have it because that's just the way it is "Cola.  Other teams have history and rings of honor and other things to divert attention away from the W-L record and onto other aspects of the brand's value.  The Bengals don't do that.  We are good or not good and we're just sort of here.  We have no noteworthy history, 1 guy in the HOF, and the only thing noteworthy about us in the past decade is how little we change.

Mike Brown is lucky to be in a fail-free business, because no brand that has so little relevance to consumers for so long would be able to remain this stagnant without being overtaken by a number of new competitors.

[Au165]

(01-22-2018, 04:30 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Yes, but most teams that aren't great on the field make marketing decisions to bolster the value of their brand.  The Cowboys haven't won a SB in quite a while, but they have a marketing hold akin to Coca "gotta have it because that's just the way it is "Cola.  Other teams have history and rings of honor and other things to divert attention away from the W-L record and onto other aspects of the brand's value.  The Bengals don't do that.  We are good or not good and we're just sort of here.  We have no noteworthy history, 1 guy in the HOF, and the only thing noteworthy about us in the past decade is how little we change.

Mike Brown is lucky to be in a fail-free business, because no brand that has so little relevance to consumers for so long would be able to remain this stagnant without being overtaken by a number of new competitors.

...but he is in a no lose situation because of revenue sharing, so actual in stadium attendance doesn't really matter to him.

[*Nately120*]

(01-22-2018, 04:51 PM)Au165 Wrote: ...but he is in a no lose situation because of revenue sharing, so actual in stadium attendance doesn't really matter to him.

Right, the NFL is a monopolistic oligopoly, so there is virtually no chance of someone with a better business plan than you showing up and sniping your consumer base.

[*ochocincos*]

Related note - Browns fans are stupid. Averaging 63k per game (87.3% capacity) for a team that has gone 1-31 the past two seasons.

[NKYRob]

I think even if they start putting up wins in the regular season it won't change until they win a playoff game. It's long been the argument (a valid one to this point) that it doesn't matter how many regular season wins they stack up because Marvin Lewis/Andy Dalton can't win a playoff game. Until that narrative changes, I doubt attendance will.

[*Nately120*]

(01-22-2018, 05:02 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Related note - Browns fans are stupid. Averaging 63k per game (87.3% capacity) for a team that has gone 1-31 the past two seasons.

Much like Pittsburgh Pirates games for the better part of the past 25 years, Browns games are a great place to go to watch the other team.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-22-2018, 05:05 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Much like Pittsburgh Pirates games for the better part of the past 25 years, Browns games are a great place to go to watch the other team.

That's a good point that I didn't consider, but is it true? Are there a lot of opposing teams' fans showing up to Browns games?

[Luvnit2]

(01-22-2018, 04:13 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: With how great watching the game is from home now, I can't imagine attendance ever rising again. I know that, even if we become a great team, I will likely never go to a game except maybe a playoff game.

The price and convenience are just so...insane from home to going, it's hard to ever justify going unless you have been for the last 10 to 15 years.

That is, of course, just my opinion. Your opinion may be very different.

I don't know other sports numbers, but no doubt greatly enhanced watching sports at home. The question becomes what is happening to other pro or college events televised. Are they also sharply declining, if not it is the product (brand) of the team and the NFL to blame.

The NFL lifted the no black out rule which also hurts home attendance. 

My group of 7 has made our decision, we are dumping our club seats for $1500 a seat in 2018. I bring it up as I think 2018 will only get worse. Why buy season tickets for full value when you can buy them from scalpers on game day for over 70% less.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-22-2018, 05:12 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I don't know other sports numbers, but no doubt greatly enhanced watching sports at home. The question becomes what is happening to other pro or college events televised. Are they also sharply declining, if not it is the product (brand) of the team and the NFL to blame.

The NFL lifted the no black out rule which also hurts home attendance. 

Mt group of 7 has made our decision, we are dumping our club seats for $1500 a seat in 2018. I bring it up as I think 2018 will only get worse. Why buy season tickets for full value when you can buy them from scalpers on game day for over 70% less.

I agree with your approach. Is there anything that could be done between now and the start of the season that could change your mind about the outcome of 2018?

[Pat5775]

Good. **** Mike Brown.

Look no further than him, his lackadaisical/delusional approach to running an NFL franchise is what's keeping fans away

[masonbengals fan]

I won’t be attending my normal 2-4 games this year. Only way I have to show my displeasure in bringing Marvin back.