01-22-2018, 07:21 PM
Maybe they can start doing bobble head giveaways like the other "team" in town to drum up some business. Ah, who am I kidding, Mike Brown ain't going to give anything away for free, except grief.
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Game Attendance = Awful
Game Attendance = Awful
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Game Attendance = Awful
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01-22-2018, 07:23 PM
Well the Fans will Support the team or they wont..
If they wont the team will find a city that will. end the end the only ones that lose are us the local fans. 
01-22-2018, 08:22 PM
(01-22-2018, 07:23 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Well the Fans will Support the team or they wont.. Yep. They can run the team their way (right into the ground) and the point at which they realize they've lost the fan base, they just whine to the NFL that Cincinnati won't support the team and off they go. People here like to say the game is rigged. It is, but not between the lines. 
01-22-2018, 10:19 PM
(01-22-2018, 06:24 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Good. **** Mike Brown. My gf is a Jags fan and was bummed they lost. I told her to cheer up, because when you root for a franchise that at least tries to win there is always hope. ![[Image: 4CV0TeR.png]](https://i.imgur.com/4CV0TeR.png) 
01-22-2018, 10:59 PM
People are fed up with Mike Brown's ineptness and mind numbing refusal to change.
01-22-2018, 11:02 PM
(01-22-2018, 06:01 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I agree with your approach. Is there anything that could be done between now and the start of the season that could change your mind about the outcome of 2018? In my case, I went from die hard to numb to all of it. Sadly, we will give up seat licenses (which is huge scam) and over time it gets resold. So, no my plan is to do things in the fall like go on vacations I have not done for 10 years so I could attend home games. 
01-22-2018, 11:14 PM
(01-22-2018, 04:13 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: With how great watching the game is from home now, I can't imagine attendance ever rising again. I know that, even if we become a great team, I will likely never go to a game except maybe a playoff game. Great point. I’d like to add that a lot of people avoid going because of the drunk idiots and violence. I’ll never bring my kids to a game unless they’re really good seats. The dumbasses can’t afford them 
01-23-2018, 12:54 AM
(01-22-2018, 03:17 PM)CoCoNuT Wrote: Minus the Chargers... which is a different topic of awful attendance if true, Bengals were bad. a bit overblown to me.. most of the years in our playoff runs, we were getting over 90 percent attendance that is what I look at more than where we rank... also apples to oranges when you compare total attendance due to stadium size.. Bengals are in bottom half in capacity plus one of the smallest markets in the NFL. Now with that said, last year for sure was a bad year overall compared to previous years.. but if MB was as cheap as some try to make him out to be.. he would have fired Lewis just for gate receipts but he did not... so you can;t say he keep Lewis to increase attendance that is for sure.... 
01-23-2018, 12:56 AM
Attendance down..OMG OMG OMG! WHATAMIGONNADO? I watch on the teevee or listen on the computer feed of radio broadcast so it's 100% irrelevant to me. I could care less if the stands are full or completely and utterly empty. The camera still gives a better view. Then to be a total prick I kill the sound during commercials.. DAMMIT!
In the immortal words of my old man, "Wait'll you get to be my age!"
Chicago sounds rough to the maker of verse, but the one comfort we have is Cincinnati sounds worse. ~Oliver Wendal Holmes Sr. 
01-23-2018, 01:58 AM
(01-22-2018, 11:14 PM)Captain Happy Pants Wrote: Great point. I’d like to add that a lot of people avoid going because of the drunk idiots and violence. I’ll never bring my kids to a game unless they’re really good seats. The dumbasses can’t afford them Agreed on this. Every week you see videos of huge fights at games which makes it undesirable to go to an actual game. I prefer the college game when it comes to a game day experience.
You can always trust an dishonest man to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you have to look out for.
"Winning makes believers of us all"-Paul Brown 
01-23-2018, 02:14 AM
Expect this year to be worse.
Dropping two of my tickets this year and keeping two. The water tastes funny when you're far from your home, yet it's only the thirsty that hunger to roam. Roam the Jungle ! 
01-23-2018, 06:02 AM
(01-22-2018, 03:17 PM)CoCoNuT Wrote: Minus the Chargers... which is a different topic of awful attendance if true, Bengals were bad. I will post Bengals attendance from 1968 to now. Keep in mind they started at small Nippert Stadium, in 1970 moved to larger Riverfront Stadium and in 1990 move to larger Paul Brown Stadium. There were some strike shortened seasons such as 1982 and 1987. 1982 was only 4 home games and that was sad considering Bengals had just been in Super Bowl and it should have been more of a profit to Paul Brown. The strike years turn off fans for next few seasons also. In 1978 the NFL went from 14 games to 16 games, so one home game added. In looking at these numbers not every good attendance year is a good record season and vice versa. Some average to awful years had fans in stands and some good seasons the fans weren't there. It seems ticket sales have a great deal to do with the seasons leading up to it. 2017 poor ticket sales probably due to how awful Bengals were in 2016. The lowest turnout in Paul Brown Stadium History is 2011 and I liked that team, but the Carson and Ocho fans sure didn't get behind that team. Of course there was the bad 2008 and bad 2010 seasons and 2011 started with a strike lockout which fans hate, and Carson hold out, Ocho gone as well as one year TO gone. Still, 2011 was a good up and coming play-off team, but they were a surprise as many felt 4 win season or less was coming. So ADVANCED TICKET SALES are huge. I would guess advanced ticket sales for 2018 will not be very good coming off 2 losing seasons. The Bengals best attendance was 2006 and of course 2005 brought advanced ticket sales for 2006. So it very much looks like ticket sales have a great deal to do with the season before, so we can blame 2017 ticket sales on the 2016 season with 2017 not being much better. The Attendance rounded off in the hundred thousand number : 1968- 180 Nippert AFL EXPANSION TEAM 1969-191 1970-408 Riverfront, Play-Offs First Year in NFL 1971-415 1972-398 1973-387 Play-Offs 1974-368 1975-360 Play-Offs 1976-363 1977-322 1978-355 1979-330 1980-364 1981-422 Play-Offs, Super Bowl 1982- 215 NFL Strike 4 Home Games, Play-Offs 1983-397 1984-390 1985-425 1986-433 1987-376 NFL Strike With Replacement Player Teams 1988-442, Play-Offs, Super Bowl 1989-440 1990-473, Play-Offs 1991-423 1992-413 1993-353 1994-415 1995-385 1996-382 1997-440 1998-444 1999-405 2000-470 Paul Brown Stadium 2001-455 2002-422 2003-479 2004-524 2005-526 Play-Offs 2006-528 2007-526 2008-517 2009-512 Play-Offs 2010-483 2011-394 Play-Offs 2012-490 Play-Offs 2013-506 Play-Offs 2014-486 Play-Offs , FCC stops TV Black-Outs of Home Games. 2015-491 Play-Offs 2016-508 2017-425 Again, as bad as 2016 team was, 508 thousand, so more to do with advanced ticket sales due to year before. Awful 2016 caused decline in 2017 and look for 2018 to be down. Again 2011 season was down due to 2010. Some awful early 1990's attendance was up from Super Bowl and Play-Offs causing advanced ticket sales. It looks like people bought tickers to see new Riverfront and new Paul Brown Stadiums, wanting to see new stadium. Sadly those first years in Paul Brown Stadium were some of worst Bengals teams ever, yet attendance up at first. The Brown Family has urgent need to get 425 figure up as they had in 2002 with 422 figure. I don't include 2011 because play-offs with rookies Dalton and Green was already a help. New Coach Lewis and Top Pick Carson Palmer spiked ticket sales quickly after awful 2002. Bengals are bringing in new coaches after 2017. They need to fix offensive line and such in free agency and draft. If Detroit Defensive Coordinator brings over some of his Detroit Defensive free agents, that could make Bengals a Super Bowl Defense real fast. There will be no Carson Palmer draft type for fans to gush over, but fixing the O Line and Defense could bring play-off wins to increase attendance going into 2020's. Those saying hitting 425 number as in 2002 doesn't bother Brown Family, I disagree and this is hitting them in their bank account hard. Brown Family wants back up around the 500 figure ASAP, you can count on that. To be around 400 instead of 500 is a lot of empty seats and 1/5 less home game money. A 20 % loss in home game money hurts and there is no way they can be happy. Even with TV profit sharing it is still a 20 % loss on home games to Brown Family. The good news is it was just one year. If they can get back up to around 500 fast, it will just be an off year. Still, they need wins to climb back up the ladder. Trust me, The Brown Family is hurting big time from 100 thousand missing fans. That is a ton of money and they want those 100 thousand fans and their money back. THIS IS WHY MIKE BROWN IS NOW GIVING RARE MEDIA INTERVIEWS. LAST TIME HE GAVE INTERVIEWS HE WANTED A NEW STADIUM. WHEN MIKE BROWN GIVES INTERVIEWS, HE WANTS MONEY. IN THIS CASE HE HAS LOST 20 % OF HIS HOME GAME MONEY AND HE NEEDS TO GET FANNIES IN THE SEATS AGAIN. Some of his free agency moves and draft picks have not worked out at all, and he is losing money big time at a 20 % loss in home game revenue. Even he knows that he can't stay in business long at a 20 % loss each year. To the fans it's about wins and losses, but to Mike Brown it now becomes about a 20 % loss in revenue and how does he get ticket sales back up ??? MONEY BALL. ...EMPTY SEATS ARE HIS ENEMY. EMPTY SEATS TEAMS CAN'T COMPETE.
1968 Bengal Fan
01-23-2018, 09:53 AM
(01-22-2018, 03:17 PM)CoCoNuT Wrote: Minus the Chargers... which is a different topic of awful attendance if true, Bengals were bad. This year, there were people trying to sell $60 seats for $15 and not getting it. If you think the attendance was bad this year, wait until next year. I know a TON of people not renewing season tickets. If I am being completely honest, it is more my father's knee problems that is forcing me to not renew my four seats that I have had since day 1. My son could care less. So, I am not beating my chest that I am taking a stand, but I am not renewing. I never thought that day would come.
01-23-2018, 10:57 AM
01-23-2018, 12:36 PM
Give it time and all games will be played on a sound stage with actors and the stands added via cgi..Heck, they won't really even need actors.. Stadiums will be holograms ,but seat prices so high nobody could afford them even if they were actually there.. they might even have holograms of people actually building stadiums to make people think they're really building them..
You'll be driving down I-75 and think the stadium just vanished for a split second, but chalk it up to senility.. I'm not cynical..I'm MEGAcynical..
In the immortal words of my old man, "Wait'll you get to be my age!"
Chicago sounds rough to the maker of verse, but the one comfort we have is Cincinnati sounds worse. ~Oliver Wendal Holmes Sr.
01-23-2018, 12:53 PM
01-23-2018, 01:13 PM
(01-23-2018, 06:02 AM)kevin Wrote: I will post Bengals attendance from 1968 to now. Keep in mind they started at small Nippert Stadium, in 1970 moved to larger Riverfront Stadium and in 1990 move to larger Paul Brown Stadium. There were some strike shortened seasons such as 1982 and 1987. 1982 was only 4 home games and that was sad considering Bengals had just been in Super Bowl and it should have been more of a profit to Paul Brown. The strike years turn off fans for next few seasons also. In 1978 the NFL went from 14 games to 16 games, so one home game added. In looking at these numbers not every good attendance year is a good record season and vice versa. Some average to awful years had fans in stands and some good seasons the fans weren't there. It seems ticket sales have a great deal to do with the seasons leading up to it. 2017 poor ticket sales probably due to how awful Bengals were in 2016. The lowest turnout in Paul Brown Stadium History is 2011 and I liked that team, but the Carson and Ocho fans sure didn't get behind that team. Of course there was the bad 2008 and bad 2010 seasons and 2011 started with a strike lockout which fans hate, and Carson hold out, Ocho gone as well as one year TO gone. Still, 2011 was a good up and coming play-off team, but they were a surprise as many felt 4 win season or less was coming. So ADVANCED TICKET SALES are huge. I would guess advanced ticket sales for 2018 will not be very good coming off 2 losing seasons. The Bengals best attendance was 2006 and of course 2005 brought advanced ticket sales for 2006. So it very much looks like ticket sales have a great deal to do with the season before, so we can blame 2017 ticket sales on the 2016 season with 2017 not being much better. The outlook for the team in 2018 filling seats is stormy at best. At 425,000 in 2017, another 10% decrease (very possible) now put them down to 383,000 which would be lowest number since 1996. Does anyone have access to number of season tickets sold the past 20 years? The season tickets give them cash to operate prior to the season, a huge decline hurts their ability to have money to spend on free agents, renovations or frankly anything. They will never go broke due to the CBA, but their income has to take a huge hit losing this many paying guests.
01-23-2018, 02:23 PM
(01-22-2018, 11:14 PM)Captain Happy Pants Wrote: Great point. I’d like to add that a lot of people avoid going because of the drunk idiots and violence. I’ll never bring my kids to a game unless they’re really good seats. The dumbasses can’t afford them Even if you have good seats the only thing that stops a drunk dumbass from coming to your section is some minimum wage security staff.
01-23-2018, 02:23 PM
Keep in mind that as part of the revenue sharing model of the NFL, the home team only gets 60% of the gate of each game. The visiting team / NFL gets 40%. The home team does not share revenue from concessions, club and private boxes, seat licenses, parking, etc. The home team keeps their share of those profits (or in the case of concessions and parking, their cut of the profits).
That's why they can build a billion dollar stadium in LA....the slew of corporate boxes alone will offset a good chunk of the cost, not to mention all the other amenities. The reality is that game day ticket sales / attendance doesn't drastically affect the bottom line. Since the lifting of home blackouts, for some teams, like the Bengals, the attendance per game is pretty much just a studio audience for the telecast. As a STH, I don't get the sense that the organization gives a crap about us.....almost as if they're doing us a favor by letting us buy tickets. Other teams, like PGH, have a rotating 'council' of around 10 to 15 season ticket holders that meet in a conference room in the front office 4 times a year and brainstorm how to make the game day experience better for those attending the games. Each ticket holder on the council has a 2 year 'term' and any ST holder can apply to be on it. Everything from prices, music, security , whatever, as well as year round events are discussed and implemented. I believe a few other teams do the same thing, though it doesn't sound like anything Mike Brown would be interested in. I personally enjoy going to the games at PBS. We have a great group of people in our section and have a good time before and after the game. If the Bengals win, great! That's a plus. If they don't, it doesn't ruin the day. I'm there for the camaraderie, tailgate food and fun, the sights and sounds, all that. It's a nice way to get out and spend some Sunday afternoons...I can sit and veg in front of a TV any time. That said, one time I donated my tickets to a fundraiser and sat with a buddy in a different section and hated it. Drunk and obnoxious fans...it's like their ticket gives them justification to be drunk a-holes. So I understand other fan's POV. I think the NFL has a real and growing challenge attracting more fans into the stadiums, while technology keeps making it more interesting and immersive to watch the game on TV. The other part of that challenge is that the coveted viewer demographic (18- 45) has grown up with , and very comfortable, getting most all their information and entertainment off a screen. So as the older fans age out of their ability to attend games, the pool of younger fans willing to actually go to the games to take their place is dwindling. It'll be interesting moving forward. 
01-23-2018, 02:31 PM
(01-23-2018, 06:02 AM)kevin Wrote: I will post Bengals attendance from 1968 to now. Keep in mind they started at small Nippert Stadium, in 1970 moved to larger Riverfront Stadium and in 1990 move to larger Paul Brown Stadium. There were some strike shortened seasons such as 1982 and 1987. 1982 was only 4 home games and that was sad considering Bengals had just been in Super Bowl and it should have been more of a profit to Paul Brown. The strike years turn off fans for next few seasons also. In 1978 the NFL went from 14 games to 16 games, so one home game added. In looking at these numbers not every good attendance year is a good record season and vice versa. Some average to awful years had fans in stands and some good seasons the fans weren't there. It seems ticket sales have a great deal to do with the seasons leading up to it. 2017 poor ticket sales probably due to how awful Bengals were in 2016. The lowest turnout in Paul Brown Stadium History is 2011 and I liked that team, but the Carson and Ocho fans sure didn't get behind that team. Of course there was the bad 2008 and bad 2010 seasons and 2011 started with a strike lockout which fans hate, and Carson hold out, Ocho gone as well as one year TO gone. Still, 2011 was a good up and coming play-off team, but they were a surprise as many felt 4 win season or less was coming. So ADVANCED TICKET SALES are huge. I would guess advanced ticket sales for 2018 will not be very good coming off 2 losing seasons. The Bengals best attendance was 2006 and of course 2005 brought advanced ticket sales for 2006. So it very much looks like ticket sales have a great deal to do with the season before, so we can blame 2017 ticket sales on the 2016 season with 2017 not being much better. (01-23-2018, 01:13 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: The outlook for the team in 2018 filling seats is stormy at best. At 425,000 in 2017, another 10% decrease (very possible) now put them down to 383,000 which would be lowest number since 1996. Does anyone have access to number of season tickets sold the past 20 years? The season tickets give them cash to operate prior to the season, a huge decline hurts their ability to have money to spend on free agents, renovations or frankly anything. Team attendance is an irrelevant figure when it comes to the bottom line. Believing such shows a complete lack of knowledge of how NFL economics work. Ticket revenues (minus club and suites) are pooled and shared evenly amongst the 32 teams. As you will see below, NFL attendance has been very consistent the last 10 seasons....... Year Total League Attendance 2008 17.33 million 2009 17.15 million 2010 17.01 million 2011 17.12 million 2012 17.18 million 2013 17.3 million 2014 17.36 million 2015 17.26 million 2016 17.79 million 2017 17.26 million So, even if the Bengals experience a significant dip in attendance (they won't BTW), that dip would not even register as a blip on the financials. The system is setup to basically guarantee revenue - the theory that Cincinnati, for example, will take a hit due to poor performance but it will be made up when a team like Jacksonville experiences a spike due to their surprising success has been proven correct time and time again. This is why I laugh at those who think a boycott of PBS is somehow going to "hit MB where it hurts." Staying home and watching on TV actually makes him more because the NFL ratings go up which means that the TV contract values, the most important revenue stream in NFL economics, skyrocket. Stay home, be bitter. MB will probably thank you. |
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