I think we need a linebacker

[J24]

(03-24-2018, 08:17 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: So that's 2 teams in the last 6 years (Pats and Seahawks). Maybe those 2 teams had solid LBs, but nobody looked at those teams and said "boy those LBs are what got them to championships". I don't think that was ignorance on everyone's part. There was legitimately many players that played bigger roles to get to those titles. 

Wilson, Lynch and the Legion of Boom were bigger reasons for that title than Wagner. I don't think many would argue otherwise.

I know about all those other things, but Lewis was a liability physically. You balance those things out and he was average at best. He was getting exposed a lot. It was kinda sad to watch if you saw his prime.

Maybe our history with LBs makes me a little more jaded, but still, I think 4-3 LB is pretty far down the list of important positions on a championship team. I'd put QB, o-line, RB/run game, d-line and CBs above LBs. Maybe other positions if the player is capable of being an x-factor (think Eifert when healthy, although I know you disagree there).

If you talk to people that Follow the Seahawks they would say Wagner is the Key to the Defense. Him and KJ Wright are beasts.

[J24]

I think we need two LBers early in this draft.

[Joelist]

I can’t agree here. We absolutely need to finish the rebuild of the Offensive Line. If we grab a RT and C and Pollack does what we hope he does the effect on the team will be bigger than a LB would be. Just imagine if we can actually run the ball effectively and form actual pockets with noses. If we get to an OL that can control the LOS and let us consistently pickup those short yardage downs and such it will mitigate our second half coaching weirdness a lot.

[bengalsturntup926]

(03-25-2018, 01:44 AM)Joelist Wrote: I can’t agree here. We absolutely need to finish the rebuild of the Offensive Line. If we grab a RT and C and Pollack does what we hope he does the effect on the team will be bigger than a LB would be. Just imagine if we can actually run the ball effectively and form actual pockets with noses. If we get to an OL that can control the LOS and let us consistently pickup those short yardage downs and such it will mitigate our second half coaching weirdness a lot.

Well we were running the ball good at the end of the year anyway. Now we got Glenn. And the addition by subtraction getting rid of bodine,and if they keep ced out the o line. They could be using Fisher at right tackle any way he was a high pick. I'm all for drafting a center and tackle,but I'm also concerned for Vontaze being out or being thrown out. I just feel it's going to ruin our year. Something always does. I think it's going to be that or Andy getting injured.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-25-2018, 12:42 AM)Jakeypoo Wrote: If you talk to people that Follow the Seahawks they would say Wagner is the Key to the Defense. Him and KJ Wright are beasts.

Bobby Wagner was not the key to that championship. Period. He was not what held opponents to a 63.4 passer rating and 28 INT's. He was not why Seattle was 4th in rushing and 7th in passer rating. Guess we'll just have to disagree. 

In the playoffs that year, Wagner had 34 tackles (only 17 solo) and no big plays. Meanwhile, LoB held Brees, Kaepernick and Peyton Manning to a combined 74.7 rating in what was probably the prime of each player (Peyton and Kaep had career years). Lynch finished 6th in the NFL in rushing and 1st in TD's. He continued this in the playoffs, rushing for 288 yards and 4 TD's in 3 games.

If you want a LB and value them more than I do, fine. I get that, but I'm not sure how anyone could objectively look at these facts and come out saying Wagner was the key to that championship or even that defense. Maybe now he is (now that they're not really title contenders) or maybe he was an "x-factor" back then. They key though? No.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-24-2018, 03:08 AM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: Guys I get your point you don't need all great linebackers . But our situation is different. Every team usually has a main guy like falcons with that fast guy they have he's a stud. Panthers have kuechly . Yeah Vontaze is our Superbowl worthy linebacker,but I feel the league takes him out of it too much. Which really hurts our defense . He's only there half the time that we can count on and I bet he can tackle juju and get suspended for the year,so we need another good linebacker not named Preston Brown. Preston is alright but like goodberry said he's like v Rey and Kevin minter put together .he got the highest tackles because the playing time he had.

Don't take everything Goodberry says as gospel man, Preston Brown is a lot better than Vinny Rey and Minter.

Great tackler that can put a RB on his back. No Linebacker besides Burfict can do this on this team.

(03-24-2018, 10:54 PM)XsandOs Wrote: With Geno and Dunlap nearing 30 and MJ now 31 years old, the D-line needs to be addressed now. Its the reality of the game. Need long term solutions other than Billings, Glasgow and Willis. 

The Ogbuehi and Fisher draft set this Team back terribly. Coupled with the loss of Whitworth and Zeitler, the OL also needs to be addressed. Glenn and Hart alone don't solve the problem. Still need a center and possibly RT.

Defensive secondary has lost Freeman, Jones, Hall and Nelson. Need bodies there.

So with 4 picks in top 100, I think defense will get three of those. A big DE, stout C, natural FS and a cover LB would be great. The order I guess depends on who is available and how they rank.  

 

It is just a bad Draft for Ends this year man. Rasheem Green in the 3rd sure would be nice though.

[3wt]

(03-25-2018, 12:34 AM)PikesPeakUC Wrote: I'm in the camp of if one of Edmunds, Smith, or Evans happens to be there at 21, I'd like to take a long look at them.

I honestly don't even know at this point. The O-Line needs to get better, DT could use some help. LB needs someone because I doubt Brown will be around for more than a year. The secondary could use some bolstering, and we also possibly need another TE. That's a lot of needs.

We have a lot of holes.  There's no doubt we need a center.  Losing Bodine (whatever we thought of him) puts this at a critical level.   Johnson did not play as well as Bodine - none of his replacements are even adequate, so this is a critical need.

Then we have significant needs at right tackle, defensive tackle, defensive end and linebacker.   We really need a 3 down backer to go with Burfict.   The truth is that we have struggled at that position in the middle for a while now.  I think Brown is going to be an upgrade, which makes it less critical.  But he's on a one year contract.

I like Evans a lot, because I think he can play SAM or Mike and can stay in the game on 3rd down - long or short.   We haven't had that since Howard's brief tenure.

But it knocks out one of our bigger needs - and I think we can get Ragnow in the 2nd which knocks out 2.   I don't know that we're going to get more than two in the first 2 rounds this year just because the quality linebackers, tackles and centers will be gone after 46

So then I'm looking for the best two players who can take care of 2 of our more critical needs. 

For me that's Evans and Ragnow.

But it may be a moot point.   I don't think that McGlinchey or Evans will be there at 21 - especially Evans.

I see us taking the best defensive player available at 21 - like Hobson says.  That will not be a reason for rejoicing in my opinion.   If we don't get one of those two players, I'd feel much safer taking Price or Daniels and seeing what shakes out at 46.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-26-2018, 12:01 PM)3wt Wrote: We have a lot of holes.  There's no doubt we need a center.  Losing Bodine (whatever we thought of him) puts this at a critical level.   Johnson did not play as well as Bodine - none of his replacements are even adequate, so this is a critical need.

Then we have significant needs at right tackle, defensive tackle, defensive end and linebacker.   We really need a 3 down backer to go with Burfict.   The truth is that we have struggled at that position in the middle for a while now.  I think Brown is going to be an upgrade, which makes it less critical.  But he's on a one year contract.

I like Evans a lot, because I think he can play SAM or Mike and can stay in the game on 3rd down - long or short.   We haven't had that since Howard's brief tenure.

But it knocks out one of our bigger needs - and I think we can get Ragnow in the 2nd which knocks out 2.   I don't know that we're going to get more than two in the first 2 rounds this year just because the quality linebackers, tackles and centers will be gone after 46

So then I'm looking for the best two players who can take care of 2 of our more critical needs. 

For me that's Evans and Ragnow.

But it may be a moot point.   I don't think that McGlinchey or Evans will be there at 21 - especially Evans.

I see us taking the best defensive player available at 21 - like Hobson says.  That will not be a reason for rejoicing in my opinion.   If we don't get one of those two players, I'd feel much safer taking Price or Daniels and seeing what shakes out at 46.

A lot of interesting thoughts here 3wt. Like you said, Center is critical, i expect one with one of the first two picks.

Price or Ragnow fit what Pollack likes in his guys. One of these guys could be the next Travis Frederick, they should be good.

I think we will get a long term contract with Preston after we re-sign Geno and Dunlap. This is Preston's home he will want to
stay here, his family loves that he came back. I agree on Rashaan Evans, he can play SAM or MIKE and can shed blocks, stop
the run and rush the passer with a vengeance. No LB stands out in this Draft more to me but Edmunds.

Jim O says we are not looking at LB until the middle rounds though and Evans might not be there anyways. Which is why my
Mock has us taking Price at 21. Vander Esche is definately a thought in the 2nd afterwards but who knows if we go End there.

With the signing of Baker i think the team is okay with what they have at DT. Billings and Glasgow should really improve this
year, we will re-sign Geno. If we Draft a DT early it would kind of scare me, especially if it is a 3-tech.

[pdub2005]

(03-21-2018, 01:37 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Marvin fancies himself the LB whisperer and likes to take mid to late round players with raw talent. Look for somebody like Matthew Thomas out of FSU or the kid from Central Florida

Griffin out of UCF is a beast, one hand or both hands, the man can tackle.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-29-2018, 11:18 AM)pdub2005 Wrote: Griffin out of UCF is a beast, one hand or both hands, the man can tackle.

I agree, all for Shaqueem in the mid rounds. Dude has mad heart and athletically is as good as it gets.

[Lawless_1]

Oren Burks in the 6th round

Converted safety played junior and senior seasons at LB. In his first year he started 10 of 13 games played, racking up 59 stops, 6.5 for loss, 3.5 sacks, an interception and six pass breakups. He followied up that season with a strong senior campaign, making 82 tackles, seven for loss, one interception, and three pass breakups.

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-21-2018, 01:37 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Marvin fancies himself the LB whisperer and likes to take mid to late round players with raw talent. Look for somebody like Matthew Thomas out of FSU or the kid from Central Florida

In really want Griffin. If people think he is just a great story, you need to watch his game films. Not just highlights, but every game. Dude has a non-stop motor, speed to burn, great instincts, and the foreshadowing of a twin that played safety for Seattle last year as a rookie (3rd rounder) with 75 tackles and 15 PBUs.