2018 Reds Season Thread

[fredtoast]

Matt Harvey 5th straight start with 2 or fewer earned runs allowed.

1.86 ERA over that span.

[grampahol]

Beat the lowly Cards 2 in a row.. That's always good news.  8-2 tonight .

[samhain]

(07-10-2018, 11:39 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I'm back and forth regarding Scooter. Maybe if they move him out to LF once Senzel is called up next season (or possibly late this season?  )

But the idea of getting a premium prospect is awfully enticing... But you're right. Our actual position players are ready to compete for a World Series. And our bullpen is pretty damn good.

We really are 1 or 2 starting pitchers away from a playoff team at this point, assuming that these last 60 to 70 games haven't been a fluke.

I love Scooter.  If they keep him, I won't be upset.  I just think that it might not be the best path forward.  

Starting pitching is still the biggest weakness on this roster.  It's going to get worse when Harvey is traded or lost in FA.  Disco is a ticking time bomb in terms of health.  They need more legit starters, more specifically a TOR hammer if they want to compete for a playoff spot next season.  

Senzel is the number 5 prospect in MLB.  He's a second baseman.  So is Scooter.  Why spend a truckload of cash extending Gennett when your best prospect is right there ready to fill his spot?  Spend that cash on a proven major-league starter.  Get something significant for Gennett while you can.  Senzel will be a much better defender than Scooter, to boot. 

[CJD]

(07-15-2018, 12:19 AM)samhain Wrote: I love Scooter.  If they keep him, I won't be upset.  I just think that it might not be the best path forward.  

Starting pitching is still the biggest weakness on this roster.  It's going to get worse when Harvey is traded or lost in FA.  Disco is a ticking time bomb in terms of health.  They need more legit starters, more specifically a TOR hammer if they want to compete for a playoff spot next season.  

Senzel is the number 5 prospect in MLB.  He's a second baseman.  So is Scooter.  Why spend a truckload of cash extending Gennett when your best prospect is right there ready to fill his spot?  Spend that cash on a proven major-league starter.  Get something significant for Gennett while you can.  Senzel will be a much better defender than Scooter, to boot. 

Yea, so here's the question: Can either of these players play any other position? Because if you can create a line up where both of those guys can play at the same time, then you are going to have an extremely potent offense.

I was thinking there's a possibility that Gennett can move into the outfield at some point once his shoulder is healed. Or maybe we can send Senzel out into the outfield. Infield to Outfield is an easier transition that Outfield to Infield, after all (we did it with Hamilton most recently, as well as Trammel, I believe). It lowers Senzel's positional value if you make him a corner OF, but if it allows you to get Scooter's .320 bat and Senzel's potentially .300+ bat in the same line up, I think it'll be worth it.

As for the starting pitching, yea something's gotta give in that regard. We have some talented pitchers on this team, but they all have their warts. If we could just sign or trade for a true #1 or #2 starting pitcher (which will take more than Gennett to get anyway), then I think we should pull that trigger sooner than later. Hell, it may even cost Senzel to get that pitcher (talking a Noah Syndergaard type player, not a prospect at that point), in which case signing Scooter may be the wise thing to do.

The Reds have a lot of options and can go in a number of directions at this year's trade deadline. Hopefully hindsight will not reveal a better path when all's said and done.

[*psychdoctor*]

(07-15-2018, 10:39 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Yea, so here's the question: Can either of these players play any other position? Because if you can create a line up where both of those guys can play at the same time, then you are going to have an extremely potent offense.

I was thinking there's a possibility that Gennett can move into the outfield at some point once his shoulder is healed. Or maybe we can send Senzel out into the outfield. Infield to Outfield is an easier transition that Outfield to Infield, after all (we did it with Hamilton most recently, as well as Trammel, I believe). It lowers Senzel's positional value if you make him a corner OF, but if it allows you to get Scooter's .320 bat and Senzel's potentially .300+ bat in the same line up, I think it'll be worth it.

As for the starting pitching, yea something's gotta give in that regard. We have some talented pitchers on this team, but they all have their warts. If we could just sign or trade for a true #1 or #2 starting pitcher (which will take more than Gennett to get anyway), then I think we should pull that trigger sooner than later. Hell, it may even cost Senzel to get that pitcher (talking a Noah Syndergaard type player, not a prospect at that point), in which case signing Scooter may be the wise thing to do.

The Reds have a lot of options and can go in a number of directions at this year's trade deadline. Hopefully hindsight will not reveal a better path when all's said and done.

I hope the Reds bring up Senzel and plays him at 2nd base.  It would strengthen the defense with two All Star players and it would be his best option to start.  I would extend Gennett to a long-term deal and move him to LF.  As much as I like Billy, Trammel is a pretty good defender and hitter in the making.  I say trade Hamilton for a #2 pitcher prospect and hope that Mahle and Castillo step up their game.  Another option that may not seem popular but would definitely rake in prospects would be to trade Igleisias the current closer.  His trade value is quite high as teams would have control for several years.   Hughes could be the closer and Garrett could be a starter.

[samhain]

(07-15-2018, 10:39 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Yea, so here's the question: Can either of these players play any other position? Because if you can create a line up where both of those guys can play at the same time, then you are going to have an extremely potent offense.

I was thinking there's a possibility that Gennett can move into the outfield at some point once his shoulder is healed. Or maybe we can send Senzel out into the outfield. Infield to Outfield is an easier transition that Outfield to Infield, after all (we did it with Hamilton most recently, as well as Trammel, I believe). It lowers Senzel's positional value if you make him a corner OF, but if it allows you to get Scooter's .320 bat and Senzel's potentially .300+ bat in the same line up, I think it'll be worth it.

As for the starting pitching, yea something's gotta give in that regard. We have some talented pitchers on this team, but they all have their warts. If we could just sign or trade for a true #1 or #2 starting pitcher (which will take more than Gennett to get anyway), then I think we should pull that trigger sooner than later. Hell, it may even cost Senzel to get that pitcher (talking a Noah Syndergaard type player, not a prospect at that point), in which case signing Scooter may be the wise thing to do.

The Reds have a lot of options and can go in a number of directions at this year's trade deadline. Hopefully hindsight will not reveal a better path when all's said and done.

I don't know.  I don't see a move to the outfield as a great option for Gennett.  We're talking about a guy who's one-hopped throws to first from second.  How's that going to work when he's trying to make throws from left?  It might just be a question of whether or not the shoulder injury can heal or be fixed.  

[grampahol]

The only real value Gennett brings to the table is his bat and also being a popular hometown draw. He doesn't field worth much at all. He's like the exact opposite of Billy Hamilton who does everything really great except hit..  I say they clone the two together and wait about 20 years for a player who can't hit and can't play defense and probably can't run faster than a little old lady crossing the street.. Heck of a combination those two.  
One thing vastly overlooked by a lot of Reds fans about Scooter is that he's very popular and helps put butts in seats at GABP.. With a small market team you really need players who can get people in the stands.. Tough call  

[CJD]

The small market fan draw argument is definitely there but I don't know if it's that strong of an argument. I mean, attendance this year is down compared to last year and last year we were truly abysmal.

If we were going up in attendance, I'd agree, but I just don't know if that's the case.

[grampahol]

I love the prospect of Senzel, but one fact remains that he's never proven he can hit major league pitching. We don't know what he'll do once he's beyond AAA and right now he's out for the rest of the season so he'll have to rehab his hand once he's back in uniform .
That leaves a problem. Suppose Scooter gets traded, continues to hit. 325 or better and Senzel comes up to the big club and does f-all?
We've seen this movie before you know.. Minor league player looks like the greatest thing since sliced bread only to reach the big leagues and have one injury after another and never reach the potential we all hope for. 
I'm not saying that will be the case ,but I'd rather wait to see just what he can do at the major league level before trading off a known and very popular commodity in Scooter Gennett. 

[CJD]

At this point I agree that keeping Gennett is the better move. Especially after seeing the lackluster haul Baltimore got for Machado. I know that Gennett is under control for 1 more year, but he also isn't as 'renowned' as Machado so I doubt he would get much more. Baltimore got the number 84 prospect in the minors and 4 low end prospects.

I wouldn't trade Gennett for anything less than a top 25 prospect that is at most 1 year away from the majors. And based on the market, that seems to be an unreasonable ask at this point, so I just say let it burn.

I still think we should try to trade Iglesias. If renting Aroldis Chapman was worth a top 5 prospect (Gleybor Torres), then 2.5 years of Iglesias should be worth AT LEAST that much. Imagine if we could pry Francisco Mejia from the Indians or something similar. That's basically the only kind of trade I would consider.

[CJD]

Aaaaaand...damn it. Cleveland traded Mejia to San Diego in exchange for Brad Hand and Adam Cimber.

Hand is not as good as Iglesias and Cimber is a decent middle reliever probably akin to a Jared Hughes or Amir Garrett level of production.

I think the Reds could have swung Hughes and Iglesias for Mejia and another decent prospect.

That's a shame...

[samhain]

(07-19-2018, 01:57 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Aaaaaand...damn it. Cleveland traded Mejia to San Diego in exchange for Brad Hand and Adam Cimber.

Hand is not as good as Iglesias and Cimber is a decent middle reliever probably akin to a Jared Hughes or Amir Garrett level of production.

I think the Reds could have swung Hughes and Iglesias for Mejia and another decent prospect.

That's a shame...

I don't know.  I'm starting to get the feeling that perhaps this team isn't looking to trade any major pieces at the moment.  I'm not sure that's the right path, but it could be THE path.

It looks like this offense is for real, and could be for awhile.  If their plan is to increase payroll and sign a couple of legit starters (or maybe one TOR hammer) in the offseason, then I'm on board with it.  I've heard Williams say that payroll will go up, but just how much is the question.  Take the current pen and add some decent SPs, and you're in business.

It doesn't even have to be an ace type of guy.  Just get a couple of veterans that can go deep into games and keep the pen strong throughout the year.  That alone would go a really long way for this team.  

I view this team like the Brewers last year.  They may not have gone into 2017 thinking they'd be buyers in the offseason, but the team played so far above expectations that they were.  If the Reds continue on their current path, it would be hard to deny that they, with a very lean current payroll, should go out and try to make the major league roster better by spending now.  I hope this is what they are thinking.

[grampahol]

2nd half off to a not so spiffy start.. 11-1 bottom of the 8th.. It'll take a monumental comeback.. I'm not so overly positive. 

So now short of a 10 run 9th to tie it this one ain't going down as a thriller for Reds fans..  

At least the Reds didn't cough up 18 like the Cubs did tonigh .. yet..

[*wildcats forever*]

(07-19-2018, 03:36 PM)samhain Wrote: I don't know.  I'm starting to get the feeling that perhaps this team isn't looking to trade any major pieces at the moment.  I'm not sure that's the right path, but it could be THE path.

It looks like this offense is for real, and could be for awhile.  If their plan is to increase payroll and sign a couple of legit starters (or maybe one TOR hammer) in the offseason, then I'm on board with it.  I've heard Williams say that payroll will go up, but just how much is the question.  Take the current pen and add some decent SPs, and you're in business.

It doesn't even have to be an ace type of guy.  Just get a couple of veterans that can go deep into games and keep the pen strong throughout the year.  That alone would go a really long way for this team.  

I view this team like the Brewers last year.  They may not have gone into 2017 thinking they'd be buyers in the offseason, but the team played so far above expectations that they were.  If the Reds continue on their current path, it would be hard to deny that they, with a very lean current payroll, should go out and try to make the major league roster better by spending now.  I hope this is what they are thinking.

Pitching of even modest consistency would do the trick if the offense remains productive. I'm one who remembers the mid-70's well, and as great as the offense on those teams were, it was the pitching that fed all of those wins. The collective ERA's were low to mid 3's! 6 pitchers with double-digit wins in '75, and 7 in '76! That's how to win a 100+ games/season. Give us a chance, Front Office - get us some pitching!

https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CIN/1975.shtml
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CIN/1976.shtml

[Yojimbo]

The team just can’t let a good thing keep rolling. They are planning on putting Bailey back in the rotation next week.

[samhain]

(07-21-2018, 12:19 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: The team just can’t let a good thing keep rolling. They are planning on putting Bailey back in the rotation next week.

They need to accept him for being the sunken cost that he is.

[grampahol]

You never really know though.. I've been ready to cut bait with Bailey for awhile now, but it's still possible he could come up and have a great 2nd half . I'm not holding my breath about it happening, but so far the 2nd half isn't looking too promising Homer or not. He'll apparently get his chance for redemption and you'll never see me root against any player in a Reds nor Bengals uniform . If they're on the team I hope they play great ball regardless of past records.  

[CJD]

DeSclafani got knocked around again tonight. That's 3 rough outings in his last 4. He definitely seems to still be recovering. Hopefully he starts the upward swing soon.

[Yojimbo]

The all-star break, broke the team. Looking like the April Reds against the Pirates.

Harvey just lost a ton of trade value.

[CJD]

Yep, the Harvey bubble burst.