Head coaching grades for all 32 current HC's (updated)

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-22-2018, 04:13 PM)BenZoo2 Wrote: Mike could give Marvin high school rejects.  It wouldn’t change what is viewed as poorer game management, lack of discipline in his players, especially big games, etc.  Marvin has the coach up what he’s been given too.  


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Precisely.

It is kind of coaches jobs, to you know, coach.

[fredtoast]

(05-22-2018, 03:42 PM)depthchart Wrote: Just admit that there have been seasons where Marvin has had more to work with than at least some other NFL owners were able to provide their Coaches during that particular season.

Every coach gets provided with draft picks.  Mike Brown gets no more credit than any other owner for providing Marvin with draft picks.  In fact he gets LESS because he makes the coaches work with the smallest scouting department in the league.

Every coach gets mid and low level free agents.  Mike Brown gets no more credit than any other owner for providing mid and low level free agents.  In the 15 years that Marvin has been head coach here is EVERY free agent I would consider even close to upper level.

John Thornton
Bobbie Williams
Nate Webster
Tory James
Deltha O'Neal (trade)
Antwan Odom
Lavernous Coles
Terrell Owens
Nate Clements
Cordy Glenn (trade)

Many of those guys were more "middle tier" than "top tier".

That is pathetic.  And that is why EVERYONE HERE complains so loudly about how bad Mike Brown is with free agent spending.  I actually agree with spending most of a teams resources on drafting and keeping your own, but when you get close to a championship caliber you have to take a chance on some outside talent to help the team get over the hump.  And Mike never did that.

[fredtoast]

(05-22-2018, 03:38 PM)TheUberHuber Wrote: Yeah it's an absurd argument imo. There are plenty of worse owners out there.

Making the Mike brown excuse for marvin is well, just that, an excuse. 

This is getting interesting.

This will be a good thread to bookmark.

Anyone else want to go on the record as saying Mike Brown does not make it harder for his head coaches to win?

[Bengalholic]

(05-22-2018, 04:32 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is getting interesting.

This will be a good thread to bookmark.

Anyone else want to go on the record as saying Mike Brown does not make it harder for his head coaches to win?

Marvin knows exactly what working for Mike entails. 

He chose to re-sign multiple times and continue working for Mike.

The 'because Mike' excuse simply doesn't fly anymore, and hasn't for quite awhile.

[WeezyBengal]

(05-22-2018, 04:13 PM)BenZoo2 Wrote: Mike could give Marvin high school rejects.  It wouldn’t change what is viewed as poorer game management, lack of discipline in his players, especially big games, etc.  Marvin has the coach up what he’s been given too.  


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This is so true. It's not like the Bengals haven't had talent over the years. A lot of the failures that this team has endured over the years can be traced back to exactly what you have said.

[depthchart]

(05-22-2018, 04:32 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is getting interesting.

This will be a good thread to bookmark.

Anyone else want to go on the record as saying Mike Brown does not make it harder for his head coaches to win?

So on a scale of 1-10 for this Upcoming 2018 season (10 being best)

How would you rate this 2018 Roster ?

I give it say an 8.5 or maybe even a 9.

If it is say an 8.5 then is Mike Brown a horrible 2018 Owner or is the 2018 Roster good enough that Marvin should be held responsible for the outcome of the 2018 season ?

To me, enough improvements have been made to this 2018 Roster to put the ball of responsibility in Marvin's court for how 2018 plays out.

Can't blame the so called "worst owner" or 32nd best Owner when it comes to this improved 2018 roster.

[BenZoo2]

(05-22-2018, 03:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: All the evidence points to Mike Brown being the worst owner in the league.

All the evidence also points to Marvin being a better than average coach.

I don't know why you think Marvin deserves Mike as an owner.  Don't you agree that Marvin would have been more successful working for a different owner?

Mike could give Marvin high school rejects. It wouldn’t change what is viewed as poorer game management, lack of discipline in his players, especially big games, etc. Marvin has the coach up what he’s been given too.


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[wolfkaosaun]

(05-22-2018, 04:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: In the 15 years that Marvin has been head coach here is EVERY free agent I would consider even close to upper level.

John Thornton
Bobbie Williams
Nate Webster
Tory James
Deltha O'Neal (trade)
Antwan Odom
Lavernous Coles
Terrell Owens
Nate Clements
Cordy Glenn (trade)

Reggie Nelson
Mike Nugent
Chris Crocker
Terence Newman
Adam Jones
Reggie Kelly
Dhani Jones
Cedric Benson
Thomas Howard

While they may not have been elite coming here, they all played at high levels while here. Cedric Benson had arguably the BEST performance of any Bengals player under Marvin Lewis.
Heck, dude had more rushing yards that game than the Bengals did passing yards.
Mike Brown has signed numerous first round draft picks as well.
And many of those players are a big reason why the Bengals had successful seasons.

[fredtoast]

(05-22-2018, 06:24 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Reggie Nelson
Mike Nugent
Chris Crocker
Terence Newman
Adam Jones
Reggie Kelly
Dhani Jones
Cedric Benson
Thomas Howard

While they may not have been elite coming here, they all played at high levels while here. Cedric Benson had arguably the BEST performance of any Bengals player under Marvin Lewis.
Heck, dude had more rushing yards that game than the Bengals did passing yards.
Mike Brown has signed numerous first round draft picks as well.
And many of those players are a big reason why the Bengals had successful seasons.

Almost none of those players were producing under other head coaches.  Marvin ( and his staff) get all the credit for turning Mike Browns cheap free agents into good players.

Nelson we got in trade for a fifth round nobody.

Crocker, Dhani, Benson, Pac, and Newman had all been cut and were street free agents.

[Socal Bengals fan]

Marvin Lewis is above average , Dalton is above average but yet it's been 28 years since winning a playoff game. imagine how shitty their playoff record will be if they were below average.

[wolfkaosaun]

(05-22-2018, 06:33 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Almost none of those players were producing under other head coaches.  Marvin ( and his staff) get all the credit for turning Mike Browns cheap free agents into good players.

Nelson we got in trade for a fifth round nobody.

Crocker, Dhani, Benson, Pac, and Newman had all been cut and were street free agents.

So shouldn't Mike Brown get credit for putting together those staffs for Marvin as well?

I mean, he brought in Jay Gruden. Brought in Mike Zimmer. Brought over Hue Jackson.

The Bengals have had talented players and assistant coaches.

But yet people forget how many rumors were circulating about unhappiness with Marvin. Coaches wanted to leave. Lazor even threw Marvin under the bus when talking about playing time that that goes to Marvin.

A coach TODAY brought up that Lawson and Willis should have been used more than they were (Katherine Herrell reported this).

So while Mike Brown deserves criticism, so does Marvin. I mean, Marvin even said that halftime adjustments is jargon made up by journalists.

Then you have guys like Belichek showing McDaniels doing a halftime adjustment in a game.

Marvin Lewis is an awful halftime adjuster and always has been.

Proof: https://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2018/01/07/mike-brown-marvin-lewis-fact-fiction-cincinnati-bengals-lacking-halftime-adjustments/1007231001/

No matter the era, the Bengals finished in the bottom half of the NFL under Marvin Lewis.

[TKUHL]

(05-22-2018, 12:30 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Mike provided nothing but draft picks, and every coach in the league gets those.  Only difference is our coaches do more scouting.  The free agents and trades were all bargain basement moves.

The credit goes to the coaches for developing that talent to create a good roster.  What were Reggie Nelson and Adam Jones doing under other NFL coaches?

You can't say Mike provided nothing but draft picks then use Nelson and Jones as an example of great coaching up? They were fine pickups by Mike Brown, sure they may not have played as well with their previous team but a lot of that can be attributed to the system they were playing in. Both Mike and Marvin suck, but when the team comes out flat and unprepared every time the lights are on, or after a by week, Haltime, coin toss etc. that's on Marvin. Sure some years Mike has been pathetically cheaper than others, it's still Marvin's job to at least get the players to act like they want to win. So shame on Marvin for sticking around knowing he will never be givin the tools to win a title and shame on Mike Brown for keeping him employed.

[wolfkaosaun]

(05-22-2018, 07:33 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Marvin Lewis is above average , Dalton is above average but yet it's been 28 years since winning a playoff game.  imagine how shitty their playoff record will be if they were below average.

Probably not as bad as 0-7 since they wouldn't make it as often