Chris Carter Over Margus Hunt

[ItsOdellThurman]

(08-30-2015, 01:30 PM)Sweetness Wrote: Mo Sanu has done something in actual games. Not really sure your comparison makes any sense.

True.

Maybe Darqueze Dennard should be considered a cut.  He's never done anything in actual games.

[Luvnit2]

(08-30-2015, 01:27 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Chris Carter and Robert Mathis are the same size. I would say Carter's fine play definitely puts Hunt's roster spot at more risk.

Mathis and his Colts were traditionally one of the worst run defenses in the NFL. The Bengals play in the AFCN where you better be able to stop the run, we are not in the weak AFCS.

I like Carter and hope he makes the team, but we have a weak LB group so in my opinion this is where he belongs and I thought Hunt looked good last night, he last fast and strong and we know he can stop the run and weighs 50 lbs. more than Carter which is huge against power blocking OL's. I see Carter as a 3rd down pass rush specialist and nothing more right now, but he can develop into a well rounded LB hopefully in time.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:27 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: It helps Carter's argument, but it doesn't hurt Hunt.

Mo Sanu did nothing.  Little should pass him on the depth chart.

Sanu is established. He doesn't have to do anything. 

(08-30-2015, 01:28 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I disagree about Hunt.  I thought he has looked very good in the last two games.  That doesn't mean I don't want Carter.  He is a unique talent that the Bengals don't have elsewhere on the roster.  Hunt can rotate with Dunlap at LDE and can also move inside.  They are different players. 

If looking at Hunt not making it, who do you have rotate at LDE?  Clarke?  He hasn't shown anything yet.  I know there is a log jam at DT, but I don't see as many players competing with Hunt. 

Clarke is ahead of Hunt in development. Not saying much but at least he seems durable. 
He hasn't really looked that good. Look at the process not the results. When he gets pressure, how did he get it? Did he make a move or did the OT miss the block? Did he do anything other than just use his strength? Did he show bend and good hands? Or did he just bum rush the OT? 

When he is out there against back ups and guys barely on the roster,  of course he looks good. He's a physical freak 28 year old going against growing 23 year olds. 

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:32 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: True.

Maybe Darqueze Dennard should be considered a cut.  He's never done anything in actual games.

Dennard isn't 28 and shown nothing in 3 years. 

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:34 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Mathis and his Colts were traditionally one of the worst run defenses in the NFL. The Bengals play in the AFCN where you better be able to stop the run, we are not in the weak AFCS.

Don't need him to play the run. Johnson, Gilberry, Dunlap and Clarke can do that. 
Use him strictly in subpackages. 3rd and long. 

[*SHRacerX*]

(08-30-2015, 01:35 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Sanu is established. He doesn't have to do anything. 


Clarke is ahead of Hunt in development. Not saying much but at least he seems durable. 
He hasn't really looked that good. Look at the process not the results. When he gets pressure, how did he get it? Did he make a move or did the OT miss the block? Did he do anything other than just use his strength? Did he show bend and good hands? Or did he just bum rush the OT? 

When he is out there against back ups and guys barely on the roster,  of course he looks good. He's a physical freak 28 year old going against growing 23 year olds. 

Wow.  I really disagree with your assessment of Hunt.  I saw him use his arms, I saw him cut inside, and I saw him rush by on the outside.  I was watching just him for a lot of the snaps and I thought he got more pressure than any player on the defensive line when he was in there.  And I don't believe he only played against backups.  Truck?  Do you have PFF numbers?

[ItsOdellThurman]

This is the beginning of Hunt's 3rd year. He's played football for 5 years. His age is misleading as he was 25 when he was drafted.

I'm again, being somewhat sarcastic. But lets say Dennard fails to earn a starting spot this year, misses half the year off and on with injuries, should there be discussion of cutting him during next year's camp?

I just can't imagine that. And it's too early with Hunt.

[Sweetness]

(08-30-2015, 01:32 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: True.

Maybe Darqueze Dennard should be considered a cut.  He's never done anything in actual games.

Dennard is 23, Margus Hunt is 28 freaking years old. Even if he shows something this year he has what, a year left of his prime?

I think the only misleading part about saying he's only in his 3rd year is ignoring how old he already is.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:39 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Wow.  I really disagree with your assessment of Hunt.  I saw him use his arms, I saw him cut inside, and I saw him rush by on the outside.  I was watching just him for a lot of the snaps and I thought he got more pressure than any player on the defensive line when he was in there.  And I don't believe he only played against backups.  Truck?  Do you have PFF numbers?

I saw him flail a lot but every time it comes back to whether or not he can just out muscle guys. Chris Carter played on the line with him so 0 chance he was getting more pressure. 

(08-30-2015, 01:39 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: This is the beginning of Hunt's 3rd year.  He's played football for 5 years.  His age is misleading as he was 25 when he was drafted.

I'm again, being somewhat sarcastic.  But lets say Dennard fails to earn a starting spot this year, misses half the year off and on with injuries, should there be discussion of cutting him during next year's camp?

I just can't imagine that.  And it's too early with Hunt.

He's played for 7. 
He's 28.
Dennard is 23.
Kirk and Pacman are very good. 
The talent ahead of Hunt is not as deep. Especially given it's a position you rotate often. 

[GreenCornBengal]

If we don't find some way to keep Chris Carter I am going to pull my hair out...

and whoever brought up Dennard is silly. Dennard was the best corner in college when he was drafted... Margus blocked a few kicks....

[ItsOdellThurman]

Does age really matter given the lack of experience? Is potential directly correlated with age?

All I'm saying is it's too early to consider cutting him completely.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:45 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: If we don't find some way to keep Chris Carter I am going to pull my hair out...

and whoever brought up Dennard is silly. Dennard was the best corner in college when he was drafted... Margus blocked a few kicks....

And had a great bowl game vs a 19 year old. 

[ItsOdellThurman]

The Dennard suggestion was in-jest. Of course he shouldn't be considered a cut...ever.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(08-30-2015, 01:45 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: Does age really matter given the lack of experience?  Is potential directly correlated with age?

All I'm saying is it's too early to consider cutting him completely.

Yes. 
He's 28. How many players play beyond their 30s at a high level?
How many can learn whole new skill sets into their 30s? 

[*SHRacerX*]

(08-30-2015, 01:43 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: I saw him flail a lot but every time it comes back to whether or not he can just out muscle guys. Chris Carter played on the line with him so 0 chance he was getting more pressure. 

Not true at all.  Carter had two very good rushes, but also got tied up and completely washed out many other snaps.  Hunt had continual pressure.  And I want Carter, too, but you are missing what happened at the game in terms of Hunt

[ItsOdellThurman]

Most 28 year olds have 14 years of football wear under their belts. You can't necessarily compare him to every other player his age.

[Stormborn]

(08-30-2015, 01:48 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Not true at all.  Carter had two very good rushes, but also got tied up and completely washed out many other snaps.  Hunt had continual pressure.  And I want Carter, too, but you are missing what happened at the game in terms of Hunt

He had 2 pressures in 24 pass rushing snaps, both were just him running into a gap and out muscling a backup.

Nothing new to report here.

[GreenCornBengal]

(08-30-2015, 01:48 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: Most 28 year olds have 14 years of football wear under their belts.  You can't necessarily compare him to every other player his age.

Like many track atheletes who convert to football, he has the intangibles but doesn't have the football fluidity that is needed to play at this level.

There are plenty of guys who can run faster than lightening but can't play WR because football is different.

I was HUGE on Margus when we drafted him.. thought he was going to be the next big thing.. but he is a track athelete lost in a football world. If the guy could choose track or football he would choose track, track is his true passion. It was a nice experiment, and wasn't a wasted pick, but unless the coaches know something we don't, its time to move on.

[McC]

Marvin has shown a tendency to stay with his pet projects for a long time. If history is any indication, Hunt gets another year.

[jj22]

Carter is in a battle with Flowers for the final LB spot. Frankly I'd sacrifice Lamur to keep both of them. Hunt is on the outs only if they keep Williams. Assuming they keep Sims. You never have enough pass rushers, but it does feel like the Hunt experiment has run it's course.