This roster lacks true playmakers on defense.I

[impactplaya]

i hope.next year this team can land impact defensive player or 2 in the draft next year.
this franchise has really swung and miss in the last couple 4 5 drafts on defense.
my eyes tell me the LBers need a.complete overhaul.
the dline doesnt have anyone that consistantly put heat on the qb and put him on
the ground.
every year we hear the same story from Carlos Dunlap.hes gonna try to get 20 sacks blah
blah.
guess what he got paid. hes not hungry anymore. hes not going all out anymore.
one man can block.him.with ease.
we lack a shutdown CB like Denzel Ward.
Vontaze his best days are gone. hes out of shape.hes a 3rd rate Jamie Collins now.
his passion has withered.
Vigil Rey Brown Burfict need to.go.
Jordan Willis is a bust. great high motor at KSU. you need more than a motor at the NFL level son.
nobody on this defense has a knack to make a big play when needed.

[kalibengal]

(12-02-2018, 09:09 PM)impactplaya Wrote: i hope.next year this team can land impact defensive player or 2 in the draft next year.
this franchise has really swung and miss in the last couple 4 5 drafts on defense.
my eyes tell me the LBers need a.complete overhaul.
the dline doesnt have anyone that consistantly put heat on the qb and put him on
the ground.
every year we hear the same story from Carlos Dunlap.hes gonna try to get 20 sacks blah
blah.
guess what he got paid. hes not hungry anymore. hes not going all out anymore.
one man can block.him.with ease.
we lack a shutdown CB like Denzel Ward.
Vontaze his best days are gone. hes out of shape.hes a 3rd rate Jamie Collins now.
his passion has withered.
Vigil Rey Brown Burfict need to.go.
Jordan Willis is a bust. great high motor at KSU. you need more than a motor at the NFL level son.
nobody on this defense has a knack to make a big play when needed.

[kalibengal]

agreed,,,its really hard to watch other teams hit big on guys like Bradley Chubb , Ward etc.
We need an overhaul and with guys with PASSION for the game. The only guys I see on D that have that are Williams, and Vigil the rest look semi retired out there (I,e Dunlap, Atkins and co) what a joke it is to sign these 2 for the $ they make!? There are a lot of underpaid players out there that are kicking ass weekly and making a fraction of what these 2  make. Its time for a change.   We need to get younger and hungrier 

[*ochocincos*]

(12-02-2018, 09:09 PM)impactplaya Wrote: i hope.next year this team can land impact defensive player or 2 in the draft next year.
this franchise has really swung and miss in the last couple 4 5 drafts on defense.
my eyes tell me the LBers need a.complete overhaul.
the dline doesnt have anyone that consistantly put heat on the qb and put him on
the ground.
every year we hear the same story from Carlos Dunlap.hes gonna try to get 20 sacks blah
blah.
guess what he got paid. hes not hungry anymore. hes not going all out anymore.
one man can block.him.with ease.
we lack a shutdown CB like Denzel Ward.
Vontaze his best days are gone. hes out of shape.hes a 3rd rate Jamie Collins now.
his passion has withered.
Vigil Rey Brown Burfict need to.go.
Jordan Willis is a bust. great high motor at KSU. you need more than a motor at the NFL level son.
nobody on this defense has a knack to make a big play when needed.

Carlos Dunlap and Geno Atkins each have 7 sacks with 4 games left. They are fine.
Just last year, WJ3 was that “shutdown” CB that you speak of the team needs.
Carl Lawson was a great playmaker last year that unfortunately got hurt early. While he didn’t have as many sacks as last year, he was getting constant pressure.
Jessie Bates has been a welcome addition to the secondary.
All that the Bengals really need is a LB or two.


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[impactplaya]

(12-02-2018, 09:50 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Carlos Dunlap and Geno Atkins each have 7 sacks with 4 games left. They are fine.
Just last year, WJ3 was that “shutdown” CB that you speak of the team needs.
Carl Lawson was a great playmaker last year that unfortunately got hurt early. While he didn’t have as many sacks as last year, he was getting constant pressure.
Jessie Bates has been a welcome addition to the secondary.
All that the Bengals really need is a LB or two.


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I apologize. but Dunlap and Atkins are not fine.
Dunlap doesnt have very many batted passes.
Geno isnt finishing.
where was Dunlap and Atkins when we needed a stop vs the Steelers? when Ben started inside the 20 I think. 
where was those 2 when the Ravens ran the ball.down our throats?
yeah I get it....its.a team.game.but when you give out extensions the next step is take your game to another level.
7.sacks dont impress me at all. especially when QBs are getting it done on 3rd down.
I watched Wallace Gilberry get.6.5 sacks in less snaps 4 years ago.

[*ochocincos*]

(12-02-2018, 10:42 PM)impactplaya Wrote: I apologize. but Dunlap and Atkins are not fine.
Dunlap doesnt have very many batted passes.
Geno isnt finishing.
where was Dunlap and Atkins when we needed a stop vs the Steelers? when Ben started inside the 20 I think. 
where was those 2 when the Ravens ran the ball.down our throats?
yeah I get it....its.a team.game.but when you give out extensions the next step is take your game to another level.
7.sacks dont impress me at all. especially when QBs are getting it done on 3rd down.
I watched Wallace Gilberry get.6.5 sacks in less snaps 4 years ago.

Dunlap has 5 PDs which is more than any LB or DL on the team and tied for third on the team. 5 is tied for his third most in a season (15 in 2016, 7 last year) and there are still 4 games left.
Atkins is 2nd Best DT when it comes to sacks.
What exactly are you basing their “poor” performance on? The fact they aren’t single-handedly winning a game like Khalil Mack or Aaron Donald have? If that’s the case, Mack and Donald are the two highest paid defensive players in the league and are the best. Dunlap and Atkins aren’t the best but they are pretty damn good.
The Bengals can’t just magically snap their fingers and have a Mack or Donald.


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[*jason*]

(12-02-2018, 09:50 PM)kalibengal Wrote: agreed,,,its really hard to watch other teams hit big on guys like Bradley Chubb , Ward etc.
We need an overhaul and with guys with PASSION for the game. The only guys I see on D that have that are Williams, and Vigil the rest look semi retired out there (I,e Dunlap, Atkins and co) what a joke it is to sign these 2 for the $ they make!? There are a lot of underpaid players out there that are kicking ass weekly and making a fraction of what these 2  make. Its time for a change.   We need to get younger and hungrier 

Well if we'd ever draft in the top five again we could get guys like that...

It's tough watching the Colts hit on Andrew Luck too.

[impactplaya]

(12-02-2018, 11:33 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Dunlap has 5 PDs which is more than any LB or DL on the team and tied for third on the team. 5 is tied for his third most in a season (15 in 2016, 7 last year) and there are still 4 games left.
Atkins is 2nd Best DT when it comes to sacks.
What exactly are you basing their “poor” performance on? The fact they aren’t single-handedly winning a game like Khalil Mack or Aaron Donald have? If that’s the case, Mack and Donald are the two highest paid defensive players in the league and are the best. Dunlap and Atkins aren’t the best but they are pretty damn good.
The Bengals can’t just magically snap their fingers and have a Mack or Donald.


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there was a time ago.when Atkins would knife between the C and G and just stop.a RB in his tracks for a 2 yd loss. 
or Geno.walk a linemen back into.the pocket.
Carlos is on pace to.yet finish with less than 10 sacks.
in a 43 defense your DT and DE have to be absolute terrors upfront so the QB cant get comfy and he has to checkdown to a 3rd or 4th read. 
Carlos and Geno simply arent doing enough.
we need dominant players like Mack and Donald on this defense.
if you are ok with average defensive output
thats up to.you.
both have disapeared since that Steelers meltdown 

[THE PISTONS]

Derwin James is amazing for the Chargers. He covers TE's. He can play LB or Safety. He covers WR's. He gets sacks.

Vander Esch looks like a dominant LB too.

We have Billy Price who gets dominated at Center.

[BengalChris]

(12-02-2018, 09:50 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Carlos Dunlap and Geno Atkins each have 7 sacks with 4 games left. They are fine.
Just last year, WJ3 was that “shutdown” CB that you speak of the team needs.
Carl Lawson was a great playmaker last year that unfortunately got hurt early. While he didn’t have as many sacks as last year, he was getting constant pressure.
Jessie Bates has been a welcome addition to the secondary.
All that the Bengals really need is a LB or two.


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And a brand new set of coaches to go around.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-03-2018, 12:36 AM)impactplaya Wrote: there was a time ago.when Atkins would knife between the C and G and just stop.a RB in his tracks for a 2 yd loss. 
or Geno.walk a linemen back into.the pocket.
Carlos is on pace to.yet finish with less than 10 sacks.
in a 43 defense your DT and DE have to be absolute terrors upfront so the QB cant get comfy and he has to checkdown to a 3rd or 4th read. 
Carlos and Geno simply arent doing enough.
we need dominant players like Mack and Donald on this defense.
if you are ok with average defensive output
thats up to.you.
both have disapeared since that Steelers meltdown 

Honestly, when you have a coach who hasn't won a playoff game in 16+ years and he's 0-7 in the playoffs and you retain him...it makes the players not care as much as they know their play won't matter.

Geno is still good, but the last 4-5 games, he's definitely not performed at his normal HOF level.

[impactplaya]

(12-03-2018, 12:50 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Derwin James is amazing for the Chargers. He covers TE's. He can play LB or Safety. He covers WR's. He gets sacks.

Vander Esch looks like a dominant LB too.

We have Billy Price who gets dominated at Center.

I wanted James to be a Bengal..hes a do it all.safety.and do it well.
Biĺly Price looks to.get over matched at times

[J24]

We need sideline to sideline players at LB. The saddest thing about this season has been Vontaz.

[Sled21]

(12-03-2018, 12:36 AM)impactplaya Wrote: there was a time ago.when Atkins would knife between the C and G and just stop.a RB in his tracks for a 2 yd loss. 
or Geno.walk a linemen back into.the pocket.

Yeah, that was when he had Peko beside him taking on the double teams. But,if you remember,  the message board coaches did not want Peko here anymore, because he was just a pile jumper.....

[MentalRage]

Losing Carl Lawson hurt more than anyone really knows. Teams need at least 3 good pass rushers. The Bengals only have 2.

Also I'd argue Carlos is playing like he has his whole career. People might be surprised to hear he has only had more than 10 sacks once in his career and that was back in 2015 with 13.5. Dunlap is an above average DE, but he isn't a super star like some people make him out to be.

Here are his sack numbers the last 5 years.

2013 - 7.5
2014 - 8.0
2015 - 13.5
2016 - 8.0
2017 - 7.5

I'll also say that the linebackers aren't doing the d-line any favors. Other teams know that they can get the ball out quickly over the middle because the coverage is non existent.

Next year they need Carl Lawson/Ryan Glasgow to get healthy and draft a stud linebacker.

[*ochocincos*]

(12-03-2018, 12:36 AM)impactplaya Wrote: there was a time ago.when Atkins would knife between the C and G and just stop.a RB in his tracks for a 2 yd loss. 
or Geno.walk a linemen back into.the pocket.
Carlos is on pace to.yet finish with less than 10 sacks.
in a 43 defense your DT and DE have to be absolute terrors upfront so the QB cant get comfy and he has to checkdown to a 3rd or 4th read. 
Carlos and Geno simply arent doing enough.
we need dominant players like Mack and Donald on this defense.
if you are ok with average defensive output
thats up to.you.
both have disapeared since that Steelers meltdown 

I'm not "ok" with average defensive output, I just think you are targeting the wrong individuals. Critique the players who are doing poor first.
MJ, Willis, and Hubbard all could also be getting (a lot ) more pressure but aren't.
The LBs can (and should) be factoring a lot into the run stuffing but aren't. They have practically all been terrible.

Why is it some people expect the good players to go completely above and beyond to compensate for the poor performers? It's each individual's job to play at least solid or better.

Plus, I think you'd see Dunlap and Atkins actually do more if they got to pin their ears back and get after the QB. The defense doesn't get to do that when they're playing from behind most of the game.

[Daddy-O]

(12-03-2018, 02:47 AM)Jakeypoo Wrote: We need sideline to sideline players at LB. The saddest thing about this season has been Vontaz.

Agree.  Burfict looks very slow and ineffective.  He's never had great speed but great instincts to anticipate where to be, and when he got there always made solid tackles.  Those days appear to be in the rear view mirror.

[THE PISTONS]

On offense, we do have some playmakers but the line is so bad that Mixon can't be a playmaker.

The numbers he is putting up behind this bad line are really good.

[McC]

Honestly, the roster is almost irrelevant at this point. There are so many management ans coaching disasters going on that the players are way too handcuffed to have a chance to win.

[fortyyearfan]

(12-02-2018, 09:50 PM)kalibengal Wrote: agreed,,,its really hard to watch other teams hit big on guys like Bradley Chubb , Ward etc.
We need an overhaul and with guys with PASSION for the game. The only guys I see on D that have that are Williams, and Vigil the rest look semi retired out there (I,e Dunlap, Atkins and co) what a joke it is to sign these 2 for the $ they make!? There are a lot of underpaid players out there that are kicking ass weekly and making a fraction of what these 2  make. Its time for a change.   We need to get younger and hungrier 

Duke Tobin picks losers, all these guys are trash players.No one on here is good enough to make Shaun Peytons Saints team.He would not pick any of these guys.And Jeff Driskel is a bust,he THINKS he can play and he is a back up for a reason.Billy Price is a bust,Dude is too short and gets hammered all game.He thinks he is better than he is.He has a cocky attitude and other players are not happy with this dude.This O-line needs all new players and Duke Tobin should not be picking them.Until this franchise is sold,we will NEVER see a winning team in the nati.As long as the Brown family is in charge,it will never change.Believe that.