I predict Jay Gruden is our HC next year if it's not Marvin

[McC]

(12-15-2018, 02:36 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I think you’re overrating what he did in Minnesota. 3500 YDS and 22 TD is the definition of game manager.

13-3.  End of story.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-15-2018, 02:31 PM)McC Wrote: Keenum was most certainly a reason the Vikes won last year.

He was also probably the reason they lost in the playoffs.

Last year he threw for about 3500 yards and 22 TD and 7 Int's. 98 rating.

Nothing really spectacular in those numbers.

[McC]

(12-15-2018, 02:53 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: He was also probably the reason they lost in the playoffs.

Last year he threw for about 3500 yards and 22 TD and 7 Int's. 98 rating.

Nothing really spectacular in those numbers.

But you're only looking at the surface.  They had a chemistry, a little magic going that they absolutely do not have now. 

And what number is really the one that matters most, the numbers you quoted or the one I quoted?

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-15-2018, 02:38 PM)McC Wrote: 13-3.  End of story.

But the story doesn’t end there...

1 TD 2 INT 63.8 PR for a total of 7 points in the NFCC. The Vikings knew Case Keenum was not going to win them to a SB. Hence wanting to upgrade.

[McC]

(12-15-2018, 03:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But the story doesn’t end there...

1 TD 2 INT 63.8 PR for a total of 7 points in the NFCC. The Vikings knew Case Keenum was not going to win them to a SB. Hence wanting to upgrade.

And how brilliant the move has turned out to be. 

How many times was he sacked in that game?  Would Cousins, who, imo, is the opposite of underrated, have won that game?  In fact, what has Cousins ever won?

They lost to the eventual SB champs.  What a disgrace. 

Again, they ****** with the mojo and now they are paying for it.

[fredtoast]

(12-15-2018, 01:24 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Cousins is a far better QB than Keenum. It was not a moronic move at all.

It was moronic for the amount of money they spent.

[fredtoast]

(12-15-2018, 03:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: 1 TD 2 INT 63.8 PR for a total of 7 points in the NFCC. The Vikings knew Case Keenum was not going to win them to a SB. Hence wanting to upgrade.

Actually, no they didn't.

I can give a ton of examples of QBs who had a bad playoff game who went on to win a Super Bowl.

People who think the only QBs who ever win Super Bowls are the ones who have played great in every postseason game are clueless.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-15-2018, 03:12 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It was moronic for the amount of money they spent.

Eh, they felt they were extremely close, and a better QB could put them over the top. If he ends up winning them a SB it will have been worth it.

But yes, that is A LOT of money if he doesn’t. At least it’s a short deal at only 3 years.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-15-2018, 03:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Actually, no they didn't.

I can give a ton of examples of QBs who had a bad playoff game who went on to win a Super Bowl.

People who think the only QBs who ever win Super Bowls are the ones who have played great in every postseason game are clueless.

Ok master of semantics, they THOUGHT they probably weren’t going to win with Case. Better?

[fredtoast]

(12-15-2018, 03:18 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Ok master of semantics, they THOUGHT they probably weren’t going to win with Case.  Better?

Its not just semantic.  The Vikings busted their salary cap to go from 13-3 to 6-6-1.

But, of course, the "get rid of Andy" crowd always ignore these types of outcomes.  

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-15-2018, 03:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Its not just semantic.  The Vikings busted their salary cap to go from 13-3 to 6-6-1.

But, of course, the "get rid of Andy" crowd always ignore these types of outcomes.  

And the “keep Andy forever” crowd ignores the fact that most teams strive to have the absolute best chance of winning a SB possible.

[Bronze Bengal]

(12-11-2018, 04:01 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The Redskins atleast spend money.

Except in Kirk Cousins case.   Thats come back to bite them in the bum.  

[*Nately120*]

(12-15-2018, 03:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Its not just semantic.  The Vikings busted their salary cap to go from 13-3 to 6-6-1.

But, of course, the "get rid of Andy" crowd always ignore these types of outcomes.  

I thought the Cousins grab was a potential franchise-buster, to be sure.  Wit that being said, every year in the playoffs you see the usual teams that make it, plus a handful of teams that are on some magical one-year pushes, often bolstered by a QB who is playing beyond his usual resume.  Keenum was quite likely to be a one-year wonder as a QB (and he's not even outplaying the disappointing Cousins this year, anyways) so standing pat with him and giving him a long-term contract would almost certainly be seen as a blunder this season.  

Look at the Jaguars...they won their division (no huge feat there) and went on the road to beat the Steelers and then went to the wire with the Patriots.  They gave Bortles what looked like a stupid extension because there was a good chance this outlier of a season wasn't going to last.  Blunder, right there.

So let's see...playoff teams/QBs having inordinately successful years before reverting back to the pack the following year or soon after...

2017
Vikings and Keenum (to be determined, long term)
Eagles and Foles (to be determined, long term)
Jaguars and Bortles (both back to their losing ways)
Buffalo Bills (the 2017 team that didn't even seem like a playoff team, but made it anyways)

2016
Chiefs and the resurgent Alex Smith (end of the road for Smith whom they jettisoned for a new guy despite his success and the team's)
Raiders and Carr (one year wonders)
Dolphins and Tannehill (one year wonders)
Falcons and Matt Ryan
Giants and Eli "wish he weren't still here" Manning
Lions and Stafford (one year wonders)

2015
Bengals and Dalton (end of the road for winning ways?)
Panthers (15-1) and Newton (the MVP)
Cardinals and Palmer (one year wonders, reverted back to ho-hum after 2015)

2014
Colts and Luck (mostly Luck being injured, but they haven't had a winning season since and they are .500 so far this year)
Broncos and Manning (who was done in more than one way, but hell he got another ring)
Ravens and Flacco (haven't made the playoffs since)


That's the short of it.  At any rate, these are cases where a team that made the playoffs (some of which made significant pushes) followed up by reverting back to their true selves (Jaguars, Raiders, Giants, Lions, Bengals, Panthers, Vikings?, Eagles?) or just running out of gas (Palmer, Flacco, Luck via injuries, Broncos).  The short of it is that the Vikings going all-in on Cousins isn't something I'm defending, but the Vikings going all-in on Keenum after watching a bunch of teams and QBs do the one-year-wonder thing wasn't going to be a great move, either.

The 2017 had some 13-3 magic, but where has that magic gone?  The Vikings don't still have it, and Keenum didn't seem to take it to Denver with him.  There is no denying Keenum looked great last year (like Palmer and Newton looked great in 2015 before positing losing seasons the year after), but at the moment he looks like yet another late-round fill in the Broncos are playing because they busted on Paxton Lynch. Thus far, 2018 Keenum fits in fairly well with Osweiler and Siemian.

[Yojimbo]

Report that Joseph is out in Denver. So, another former Bengal coach that could return to replace Marv.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/12/20/new-coach-is-expected-in-denver/

[Sled21]

Of l the head coaches fired by other teams, I feel like we would just be getting someone else's loser...except for Zimmer. I don't think Minny will fire him, but it broke my heart when MB let him go and I would love to have him back. Someone asked if he would even want to come back. Why not, he has (or had) family in the area, and he owns a farm where he hunts here in Kentucky. It would be like coming home. Sure, he didn't light it up in Minny, but also don't forget he lost Bridgewater and won with Case Keenum. Bring him here and let him whip this defense into shape, and have Dalton, Green, Boyd and a healthy Eifert, and I think he could take us all the way. Gruden, while I think he would win here, I don't think would take us deep into the playoffs.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-15-2018, 02:58 PM)McC Wrote: But you're only looking at the surface.  They had a chemistry, a little magic going that they absolutely do not have now. 

And what number is really the one that matters most, the numbers you quoted or the one I quoted?

By that logic the Eagles should trade Wentz and start Foles.

[bengaloo]

Kind of off topic from where the thread is at now, but regarding former OC's vs former DC's becoming head coach I watched an interesting clip from Bill Cowher on that topic. He said people always say bring in an OC minded HC to bring more offense, or bring in a DC to put emphasis on defense. He said a good HC it wouldnt matter because its all about their master plan. They cant just come in and focus on their side of the ball. A good HC brings an attitude, a set of strict expectations and a mindset that he instills in the team top to bottom and builds a staff that helps install that.

It was a good clip. Made me remember hiring Shula instead of Cowher when the chance was there. That was about as bad as drafting Akili over a bunch of other legit players in that draft, and the list goes on. Bengal Blunders by Mike Brown would be a #1 selling sports comedy if published.

[I_C_DeadPeople]

"A good HC brings an attitude, a set of strict expectations and a mindset that he instills in the team top to bottom and builds a staff that helps install that"

Yup, that sounds like Merv..LOL

Think about what Cowher said (or spat) there, any good HC who thinks in this manner can't work for the Tree Sloth.

[McC]

(12-20-2018, 03:36 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Report that Joseph is out in Denver. So, another former Bengal coach that could return to replace Marv.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/12/20/new-coach-is-expected-in-denver/

The Bengals really liked him too.  I'd rather have him than Hue.  Or Marv.

[*Nately120*]

There is something amusingly sad about the notion that our HC will either be Marvin Lewis OR a number of HCs who were fired by other teams.  We're like that guy who stays with the same lousy gf until he gets a shot at one of his buddy's exes...or something.