Westerman

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-11-2018, 10:29 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: You know I've been in the same thoughts as well.

They should've brought Price back at RG and kept Hopkins at Center.

If Smith can produce at even an average level for RT they would be able to rush a lot better that side.

Keep Redmond, Hart, and Ced O on the frickin' bench where they belong.

Glen at LT and Boling back to LG.

Westerman is your shuffle player.  Unless Glen is injured keep Boling at LT and Westerman at LG.

Holy shit, almost forgot they brought back Andre Rocker. Thanks for reminding me.

I watched the Broncos game and never saw the man even though even in bad shape would be an upgrade
i am sure. Put Andre back at RT or Glenn over Hart no doubt man. Price played RG a lot in college and Hop
is a bad Guard but played decent at Center for some reason. Re-do...

LT - Boling
LG - Westerman
C - Hopkins
RG - Price
RT - Andre Smith

[Fan_in_Kettering]

This offensive line is abysmal. Put them out there in any order and they'll still choke. While the run blocking is marginally improved over 2017, the pass blocking seems worse. The players aren't gaining leverage by keeping their pads low, they still backpedal into the quarterback, and none of them can counter a defensive lineman's spin move. No other NFL team blocks this way.

[Essex Johnson]

(12-11-2018, 09:39 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: This does seem to be the case. Some players can get away with sucking bad, penalties, etc. and nothing is done. Other players spit on the side walk and it's see ya later ! And Merv is the constant in everything mucked up around here.

how about some facts based on performance that you actually know to back this up ?  I have found rare that a player that is clearly outperforming another player on the field has been benched on a constant basis.  You can;t use practice, meetings etc as facts since you or I have no little clue on what goes on there.

For example Westerman has rarely been put on right side in game situation to assume it is because they don;t like him than how did he even get in at LG side.. the more logical answer is he has not performed in practice, meetings etc to justify playing on the right side, plus he was not going to replace Boling at LG, he got his chance to play when Boling moved to LT.  

[Yojimbo]

(12-12-2018, 12:17 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: how about some facts based on performance that you actually know to back this up ?  I have found rare that a player that is clearly outperforming another player on the field has been benched on a constant basis.  You can;t use practice, meetings etc as facts since you or I have no little clue on what goes on there.

For example Westerman has rarely been put on right side in game situation to assume it is because they don;t like him than how did he even get in at LG side.. the more logical answer is he has not performed in practice, meetings etc to justify playing on the right side, plus he was not going to replace Boling at LG, he got his chance to play when Boling moved to LT.  

Terrible philosophy if being good in practice, but bad in games gets you more playing time and bad in practice, but good in games, gets you less playing time.

Basically saying it’s more important to be a good practice team than a winning team.

[fredtoast]

(12-12-2018, 12:45 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Terrible philosophy if being good in practice, but bad in games gets you more playing time and bad in practice, but good in games, gets you less playing time.

Basically saying it’s more important to be a good practice team than a winning team.

Not terrible at all. Every team in the league judges guys by what they do in practice.

[fredtoast]

Westerman has not been perfect and he has played limite snaps. People made a big deal out of it when he played 28 snaps against tamps bay with no pressues, but redmond played 66 snaps that game with no pressures. Westerman has only played 70 snaps all year and he allowed a sack on the crucial ectra point.

[ward4239@icloud.com]

(12-12-2018, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not terrible at all. Every team in the league judges guys by what they do in practice.

Perhaps this has more to do with his illness at the on set of camp, not his fault, and not with practice. He could not compete at that time. I too believe it is coach lewis and not pollock.

[ward4239@icloud.com]

(12-12-2018, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not terrible at all. Every team in the league judges guys by what they do in practice.

Perhaps this has more to do with his illness at the on set of camp, not his fault, and not with practice. He could not compete at that time. I too believe it is coach lewis and not pollock.

[Yojimbo]

(12-12-2018, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not terrible at all. Every team in the league judges guys by what they do in practice.

My point is, if a coach sees that a guy is good in practice, but bad in a game and still keeps trotting the player out there, that’s a losing strategy.

Practices like Tarzan plays like Jane or Practices like Jane and plays like Tarzan. I’ll take the latter every day of the week because you win from playing well in games. Good practices just gets you moral victories if your still losing games.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-11-2018, 11:11 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Bobby Hart must give some great foot rubs and bring donuts.

Dude looks like someone who stole a uniform and ran out onto the field on gameday.

......and he still looks better than Og.

[fredtoast]

(12-12-2018, 05:16 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: My point is, if a coach sees that a guy is good in practice, but bad in a game and still keeps trotting the player out there, that’s a losing strategy.

Practices like Tarzan plays like Jane or Practices like Jane and plays like Tarzan. I’ll take the latter every day of the week because you win from playing well in games. Good practices just gets you moral victories if your still losing games.

Except not one single team in the league benches a guy for a guy who looks worse in practice.

And maybe Westerman just does not look that good in games either.  Fans seem to pick a favorite player then they always think that player looks good even we he is not doing anything special.

[*Synric*]

Mixon ran 13 times for 25 yards behind the middle to right side of the line (Price, Redmond, Hart). He ran 13 times for 86 yards from middle to left (Price, Westerman, Boling). All 3 of Mixon's 10+ yard runs came directly behind Westerman.

Westerman had arguably the best game of any of the Bengals linemen this season.

[fredtoast]

(12-12-2018, 06:12 PM)Synric Wrote: Mixon ran 13 times for 25 yards behind the middle to right side of the line (Price, Redmond, Hart). He ran 13 times for 86 yards from middle to left (Price, Westerman, Boling). All  3 of Mixon's 10+ yard runs came directly behind Westerman.

That is not what Profootballreference.com said.

They have Mixon with 16 carries for 92 yards up the middle, and only 1 carry for 5 yards behind the LG.  And even then I don't know which LG because Westerman only played 63% of the snaps.

What is the source for your numbers?

[*Synric*]

(12-12-2018, 06:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: That is not what Profootballreference.com said.

They have Mixon with 16 carries for 92 yards up the middle, and only 1 carry for 5 yards behind the LG.  And even then I don't know which LG because Westerman only played 63% of the snaps.

What is the source for your numbers?

PFF. It's on Tuesdays BBP with Paul Dehner and Austin Gayle from PFF at around 25 minutes in to 35 minutes in the talk about it. 

https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/paul-dehner/enquirer-sports-bengals-beat-podcast/e/57671257


PS: Up the center is very vague...is that center left or center right? They are different gaps.

[fredtoast]

(12-12-2018, 06:40 PM)Synric Wrote: PFF. It's on Tuesdays BBP with Paul Dehner and Austin Gayle from PFF at around 25 minutes in to 35 minutes in the talk about it. 

https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/paul-dehner/enquirer-sports-bengals-beat-podcast/e/57671257


PS: Up the center is very vague...is that center left or center right? They are different gaps.

Do they separate the snaps that Westerman played at LG from the others because he was not in there the entire game.

Plus a missed block by the LG can lead to a RB getting stuffed on a run to the right side.

[*Synric*]

(12-12-2018, 07:07 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Do they separate the snaps that Westerman played at LG from the others because he was not in there the entire game.

No I forgot he came in later but they do credit all 3 of the big Mixon runs behind Westerman. 

They even mentioned when they talked to Westerman after the game how he knew he was going to get a shot in the game Sunday and wanted to make the most of it...well he did just that. I'd say he gets the LG spot to start next week.


PS: For everyone that doesn't listen to the BBP it's every week on Tuesdays and most Thursdays. It's Paul Dehner and Fletcher Page and they bring in Austin Gayle every Tuesday for his PFF analysis. I always enjoy listening.

[McC]

(12-12-2018, 12:45 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Terrible philosophy if being good in practice, but bad in games gets you more playing time and bad in practice, but good in games, gets you less playing time.

Basically saying it’s more important to be a good practice team than a winning team.

Not to mention, how can you tell in a non contact practice how a lineman is performing?  The fact that he performs well every time he plays should speak for itself.

[McC]

(12-12-2018, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not terrible at all. Every team in the league judges guys by what they do in practice.

Yeah, because a non hitting practice can really say it all about an OLineman.  Makes perfect sense why his good game play means less than practice.  This is loser philosophy, which is why we keep losing again and again.

[fredtoast]

(12-12-2018, 07:33 PM)McC Wrote: Yeah, because a non hitting practice can really say it all about an OLineman.  Makes perfect sense why his good game play means less than practice.  This is loser philosophy, which is why we keep losing again and again.

He made a huge mistake on the crucial extra point.  he probably messed up other times also.  You guys just block anything negative from your view.  You say he is playing well because that is what you want to believe.  

Reminds me of when you all were convinced that Peko was getting blown five yards off the ball every snap.  It was so wrong it was ridiculous, yet many of you all claimed it was true.

You just see what you want to see,

[McC]

(12-12-2018, 08:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: He made a huge mistake on the crucial extra point.  he probably messed up other times also.  You guys just block anything negative from your view.  You say he is playing well because that is what you want to believe.  

Reminds me of when you all were convinced that Peko was getting blown five yards off the ball every snap.  It was so wrong it was ridiculous, yet many of you all claimed it was true.

You just see what you want to see,

Okay, Oppo.  Whatever you say.