Honestly, how much would your opinion change if Marvin had been 1-7

[Nicomo Cosca]

No. 1-7 would still be abysmal. The only playoff game I give him a pass for was against Indy when we had almost no offensive weapons.

[Shake n Blake]

No...1 playoff win wouldn't have changed many overall opinions of Marvin Lewis. At least not much. 1-7 is still a terrible playoff record. The NFL is all about progressing and winning championships. If you don't progress and get stuck not clearing a certain hurdle, you get slapped with a label.

That's just how it is, and that isn't something exclusive to this message board or Bengals fans. The local/national media and fans of other teams would apply that label as well.

- When Peyton Manning choked in the first round, he was a playoff choker. Until he wasn't.
- Steve Young was ripped for not getting to a SB, until he did.
- LeBron's biggest hurdle in the Jordan debate is his 3-6 record in the Finals. He doesn't have that "killer instinct".

Had Marvin won a single playoff game, the fans and media would've been happy (thrilled in our case) initially, but the longer you stick around and the more you progress, the more people want. That's just the nature of sports. That said, I think the fans and media would've been much more forgiving if his record was something like 3-4 or 5-7. The 0-7 record was just laughably bad. It was a record for futility.

And it wasn't just the record...it was how we performed in those games. We consistently looked like the team vanished and the 90's Bengals took their place.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

Absolutely not. The slide into oblivion which began with the last playoff game was irreversible with Marvin Lewis in charge.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

When was the win? That's the bigger question.

If that one win was in 2005, then no, he needed to be gone.

If the one win was this year after all of the injuries, then he would get more time.

If the one win came in 2015 with McCarron at QB, then no, he needed to be gone.

[*rfaulk34*]

(01-02-2019, 01:41 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote:

Brain fart

lol. Yeah. I replied then confused the hell out of myself so i deleted the post. Then i realized i was right in the first place and replied again, but you had deleted your post, so i deleted my second post. 

[Housh]

He could have a random Super Bowl win thrown in and still i wouldn’t want him. No playoff wins in 16 years is historically bad

[chopperbobby]

(01-01-2019, 04:24 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: I voted "No" because his record against the Steelers is horrendous.

Now if he had been let go a long time ago and had 1 playoff game... then perhaps my historical perception of him would've changed.

He's had much time and opportunities here.

Steelers suck Marvin was there bit@h.

[Bilbo Saggins]

It depends...
Was the win convincing? Against a top team? Did the team at least put up a good fight the next game? The playoff losses themselves aren't the worst part of his 0-7. The way in which those 7 were lost is what stands out the most in my eyes. Palmer's knee and Hill's fumble weren't Lewis's fault, but the other 5 playoff losses? Those weren't games - they were all massacres. They were absolute soul-crushing routs. That can't be a coincidence. Nor can be the primetime record and the record against the Pitt stains. 

[34inXXIII]

(01-01-2019, 04:53 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: No. It would have made me happier as a fan to see that playoff victory but my opinion of Marvin would be the same. “The time has come” would still be my thought.

What an amazing week it would have been (should have been) following that long-awaited playoff win! Big picture, though, it would have little impact on how I feel about him now.

(01-01-2019, 05:46 PM)Destro Wrote: The bare minimum,  ( and I mean excepting no less than ), is we should have 3 playoff wins by now, and I would still likely want him gone after the last three years. People with rings were let go for less.

I have to respectfully disagree. The bare minimum for a coach of 16 years should have been a Super Bowl victory. I'm sure most of us have seen the stat showing this season's longest tenured coaches with every other one listed having won a Super Bowl.

Zero playoff wins obviously gets a lot of attention for a couple of reasons. First of all, 0-for-anything invites the spotlight. However, that is magnified by the fact that he holds the record for most playoff appearances without a playoff win. Aside from the glaring absurdity of that stat, his legacy is dictated by what that represents - the lowest level of achievement that he could not reach. He won the division and reached the playoffs, but failed to advance. If he had won that one playoff game, the focus would be that he could not even reach the conference championship game. If he gets to the AFC championship game and loses, we focus on how he couldn't get to the Super Bowl. Naturally, if he gets to the Super Bowl & fails, it becomes all about how to couldn't win the big game.

The further he climbs that ladder of accomplishment, the better his legacy, but each step is not treated equally. Going from zero to one playoff win is not going to garner the same respect as going from conference runner-up to conference champion (and that would pale in comparison from going from losing the Super Bowl to winning it). If Marvin Lewis has managed to reach the Super Bowl & lose, then he's likely mentioned with the same reverence as Forrest Gregg & Sam Wyche. Ultimately, a single playoff win would have done little more than tweaked the memory of what was a long, mediocre head coaching career.

[*Synric*]

It wouldn't have mattered even if he made an AFC Championship appearance. Three losing seasons in a row is reason enough to move on from any coach.

[*bengalfan74*]

(01-04-2019, 11:35 AM)34inXXIII Wrote: I have to respectfully disagree. The bare minimum for a coach of 16 years should have been a Super Bowl victory. I'm sure most of us have seen the stat showing this season's longest tenured coaches with every other one listed having won a Super Bowl.

I'd probably go even further than that, two SB victories and 3 or 4 appearances. In a 16 year career with one team in the NFL he should have at least 3 or 4 AFCC's.

[grampahol]

Something that would have changed my feelings towards Marvin would have been if he could have turned the entire team around after the Austin fiasco, lead them into the playoffs and won it all, but of course that didn't happen. Instead they limped off to yet another losing record and the end of an era. 
I don't begrudge Marvin for what he accomplished or didn't accomplish. It's not AS IF head coaches are the guys who win games. They don't throw touchdown passes, they don't tackle running backs and they aren't the guys who miss tackles or throw interceptions. That stuff is on the players themselves and everyone knows it, but according to some all the responsibility falls on the head coach and to some degree that can be correct, but it's really viewing it all in a vacuum. It's kind of like blaming my grandfather for all my failures in life.
Marvin has been hamstrung since day one working for one Mike Brown. Sh*t flows downhill and a coach shouldn't have to absorb all the sh*t a team owner outputs... I seriously doubt any other head coach will find it any different under Brown. Blame grampa Brown.

[*bengalfan74*]

(01-04-2019, 01:06 PM)grampahol Wrote: Something that would have changed my feelings towards Marvin would have been if he could have turned the entire team around after the Austin fiasco, lead them into the playoffs and won it all, but of course that didn't happen. Instead they limped off to yet another losing record and the end of an era. 
I don't begrudge Marvin for what he accomplished or didn't accomplish. It's not AS IF head coaches are the guys who win games. They don't throw touchdown passes, they don't tackle running backs and they aren't the guys who miss tackles or throw interceptions. That stuff is on the players themselves and everyone knows it, but according to some all the responsibility falls on the head coach and to some degree that can be correct, but it's really viewing it all in a vacuum. It's kind of like blaming my grandfather for all my failures in life.
Marvin has been hamstrung since day one working for one Mike Brown. Sh*t flows downhill and a coach shouldn't have to absorb all the sh*t a team owner outputs... I seriously doubt any other head coach will find it any different under Brown. Blame grampa Brown.

I get that but in the same breath Brown isn't the one preparing the team, coming up with game plans, calling the plays, calling the timeouts, throwing the challenge flag, sending in this player, taking out that player, and on and on.

[grampahol]

(01-04-2019, 01:15 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: I get that but in the same breath Brown isn't the one preparing the team, coming up with game plans, calling the plays, calling the timeouts, throwing the challenge flag, sending in this player, taking out that player, and on and on.

It has to start somewhere. The top is usually a good place to start.. We're both right and yes, I DO want it both ways despite claims that I can't.. lol