$87,656,000 in Cap Space for 2019

[TrevBengal]

(01-13-2019, 04:15 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Again with the Huber talk...…. WTF?

Kevin Huber was awful last year and he’s not worth 2.5 million

[BengalChris]

(01-13-2019, 03:04 PM)TrevBengal Wrote: Once they jettison Tez, Dalton, Huber and Glenn

That's a lot of money to rebuild the team with new OL, LB and a upgrade at QB via the draft

Dee Ford
CJ Mosely
Frank Clark

Daryl Williams
JuWuan James

Sheldon Richardson

Lot of players out there this money can go to, and also extend Boyd.

Draft: QB, OG, TE, LB top needs.

This team is going to be fun to watch once we have fully flipped the mediocre re-treads

I'd be shocked if the team cut or traded Dalton.

[Sled21]

(01-13-2019, 04:18 PM)TrevBengal Wrote: Kevin Huber was awful last year and he’s not worth 2.5 million

Oh, ok....

[THE PISTONS]

(01-13-2019, 04:18 PM)TrevBengal Wrote: Kevin Huber was awful last year and he’s not worth 2.5 million

Was he? His career net average is 39.9. Last year it was 39.0.

Also his punting average for his career is 45.1. Last year it was 43.7.

I'd say he was under career averages, but part of that was probably how many times he was forced to punt.

I wouldn't say he was terrible though.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-13-2019, 04:32 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Was he? His career net average is 39.9. Last year it was 39.0.

Also his punting average for his career is 45.1. Last year it was 43.7.

I'd say he was under career averages, but part of that was probably how many times he was forced to punt.

I wouldn't say he was terrible though.

It also doesn't account for punts strategically kicked short and out of bounds to avoid a touchback.

[Sled21]

(01-13-2019, 04:32 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Was he? His career net average is 39.9. Last year it was 39.0.

Also his punting average for his career is 45.1. Last year it was 43.7.

I'd say he was under career averages, but part of that was probably how many times he was forced to punt.

I wouldn't say he was terrible though.

He wasn't... punters stats are greatly affected by the other ST players and how many yards of runback they allow.

[THE PISTONS]

(01-13-2019, 04:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: It also doesn't account for punts strategically kicked short and out of bounds to avoid a touchback.

Yep. All things considered...he was probably out most visible player too unfortunately...just because our offense was so bad for most of the season.

Thus, some people think he was bad.

[Whodey614]

(01-13-2019, 03:32 PM)Big Boss Wrote: If we tailor the offense around Dalton's strengths (up-tempo, no huddle)?  Sure.

How many times did the Chiefs try to tailor their offense around Alex Smith's strengths before they realized that he just wasn't the guy? Then they got lucky and took a guy that catapulted the offense to levels they couldn't have imagined. I'm not saying that would happen if the Bengals took Haskins, Murray, Lock, etc but are we gonna be replacing the scheme every year hoping that it will finally be the one that'll turn Dalton into an amazing QB?? This will be his 5th OC in 9 years.

I'm fine with Dalton being the starter cause I don't expect the Bengals to pick a QB and Dalton is a very capable QB but every offseason we have this discussion trying to revive 2015 Dalton.. while the OL is still a mess, the "weapons" are either underperforming (Ross) or being used incorrectly (Ross, Mixon at times), injuries taking a toll (Eifert, AJ). Elite QBs are capable of surviving without their top targets while Dalton without AJ is terrible. Dalton is not elite, everything around him has to absolutely be perfect and you're not going to be perfect at every spot. And then you have the Bengals, who almost had a perfect team in 2015 and they allowed half of the core to leave in 2 years.

[THE PISTONS]

(01-13-2019, 04:55 PM)Whodey614 Wrote: How many times did the Chiefs try to tailor their offense around Alex Smith's strengths before they realized that he just wasn't the guy? Then they got lucky and took a guy that catapulted the offense to levels they couldn't have imagined. I'm not saying that would happen if the Bengals took Haskins, Murray, Lock, etc but are we gonna be replacing the scheme every year hoping that it will finally be the one that'll turn Dalton into an amazing QB?? This will be his 5th OC in 9 years.

I'm fine with Dalton being the starter cause I don't expect the Bengals to pick a QB and Dalton is a very capable QB but every offseason we have this discussion trying to revive 2015 Dalton.. while the OL is still a mess, the "weapons" are either underperforming (Ross) or being used incorrectly (Ross, Mixon at times), injuries taking a toll (Eifert, AJ). Elite QBs are capable of surviving without their top targets while Dalton without AJ is terrible. Dalton is not elite, everything around him has to absolutely be perfect and you're not going to be perfect at every spot. And then you have the Bengals, who almost had a perfect team in 2015 and they allowed half of the core to leave in 2 years.

That is a great point. And the same applies to Alex Smith in SF too because the 49ers replaced Smith when that team was Super Bowl caliber.

The Bengals likely would have never considered replacing Dalton for the same reason they kept Marvin: Fear of regressing. And we sure could do worse at QB.

[fredtoast]

Too many people think it is easy to upgrade average to above average players. For example they say "Upgrade Dalton with a draft pick", but they don't realize how much of a crap shoot draft picks are. Of the 25 QBs taken in the first round since we got Dalton in 2011 only FIVE have a higher career passer rating than Dalton. Close to half (11of 25) have a career rating in the 60's or 70's.

Huber's average was not impressive but he was not near the bottom of the league. He was top 10 in punts downed inside the 20, and every punter who had more also had more punts. His ratio of punts downed inside the 20 (29) to touchbacks (3) was almost 10 to 1. That is excellent. Only one other punter in the league had both more downed inside the twenty and fewer touchbacks. So while you may say he is not worth $2.5 million my question is "Where is the obvious upgrade for less money?"

[THE PISTONS]

(01-13-2019, 04:58 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Too many people think it is easy to upgrade average to above average players.  For example they say "Upgrade Dalton with a draft pick", but they don't realize how much of a crap shoot draft picks are.  Of the 25 QBs taken in the first round since we got Dalton in 2011 only FIVE have a higher career passer rating than Dalton.  Close to half (11of 25) have a career rating in the 60's or 70's.

Huber's average was not impressive but he was not near the bottom of the league.  He was top 10 in punts downed inside the 20, and every punter who had more also had more punts.  His ratio of punts downed inside the 20 (29) to touchbacks (3) was almost 10 to 1.  That is excellent.  Only one other punter in the league had both more downed inside the twenty and fewer touchbacks. So while you may say he is not worth $2.5 million my question is "Where is the obvious upgrade for less money?"

Yep. And IF you do use say the 1st Round pick to try to upgrade QB...then you can't use that pick on offensive line which will make it harder for that QB to perform. Opportunity costs.

[fredtoast]

(01-13-2019, 04:55 PM)Whodey614 Wrote:  Elite QBs are capable of surviving without their top targets while Dalton without AJ is terrible.

That is not true at all.   Before this season in the 12 games Green had missed Dalton actually averaged more passing yards (244.9) than for his career (235.5), and his passer rating without Green (85.2) is not much different from his career (88.9).

[Nebuchadnezzar]

A first for Dalton
Two firsts for Geno
Boyd would demand at least a first
Green could get 8 first round picks for the Bengals from multiple teams. If the Bengals traded Green, they could demand every top ten pick in this years draft...that's how good he is.

That's 12 first round picks right there in this years draft.

SUPER BOWL BABY!

[*rfaulk34*]

(01-13-2019, 04:18 PM)TrevBengal Wrote: Kevin Huber was awful last year and he’s not worth 2.5 million

Why? Because he was 27th and 20th in Avg and Net last year?

Except that he was 9th in kicks inside the 20 (29). Had only 3 touch backs, 7th in fair catches and was 11th in return avg (7.3)

Yeah. That's awful. On average, he was less than 2 yards per punt away from #10. 6 feet.

You're either a blatant troll or you don't know jack shit about football and how to look at anything objectively. Either or both.


Arguing about a punter...lol. That's some stupid ass shit. 

[Earendil]

(01-13-2019, 04:58 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Too many people think it is easy to upgrade average to above average players.  For example they say "Upgrade Dalton with a draft pick", but they don't realize how much of a crap shoot draft picks are.  Of the 25 QBs taken in the first round since we got Dalton in 2011 only FIVE have a higher career passer rating than Dalton.  Close to half (11of 25) have a career rating in the 60's or 70's.

Huber's average was not impressive but he was not near the bottom of the league.  He was top 10 in punts downed inside the 20, and every punter who had more also had more punts.  His ratio of punts downed inside the 20 (29) to touchbacks (3) was almost 10 to 1.  That is excellent.  Only one other punter in the league had both more downed inside the twenty and fewer touchbacks. So while you may say he is not worth $2.5 million my question is "Where is the obvious upgrade for less money?"

See Trev, you've made me agree with Fred.


Honestly, I agree with Fred more often than I thought. But as faulk said, you're either trolling or you don't understand football.

[Whodey614]

(01-13-2019, 05:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: That is not true at all.   Before this season in the 12 games Green had missed Dalton actually averaged more passing yards (244.9) than for his career (235.5), and his passer rating without Green (85.2) is not much different from his career (88.9).

So by this logic, you would trust Dalton in a playoff game if AJ couldn't play? Terrible might have been an exaggeration, but Dalton immediately goes from above average to mediocre without AJ and the stats show.

Dalton in 16 games without Green: 5-10-1 record, 60% completion, 16/13 TD-INT, 3,612 yards (6.6 YPA), 79.8 passer rating

0-3 this season when the Bengals were fighting for the playoffs. We can point out some of the coaching flaws but Dalton wasn't hot in any of those games either.

AJ has more touchdowns in the playoffs with a backup than he does with Dalton by the way which isn't a coincidence. And pointing out the dropped touchdown AJ had vs the Texans doesn't really excuse that either.

[fredtoast]

(01-13-2019, 05:32 PM)Whodey614 Wrote: AJ has more touchdowns in the playoffs with a backup than he does with Dalton by the way which isn't a coincidence. 

Yes it is a coincidence.  Green's production dropped off significantly when McCarron played instead of Dalton.

[Sled21]

(01-13-2019, 04:55 PM)Whodey614 Wrote:  Elite QBs are capable of surviving without their top targets while Dalton without AJ is terrible. 

Yep, AJ goes out and all Andy can do is hit his other receivers in the hands and in between the numbers and watch them drop it. Dammit Andy, Dammit...

[Atomic Orange]

Agree with releasing Burfict, and that is about it.

[corpjet]

(01-13-2019, 03:12 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: Like it or not, Dalton isn’t going anywhere.

Unless Jay Gruden throws a 1st for him......