01-15-2019, 02:00 AM
(01-14-2019, 05:33 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Yes. He was awful. A modern day Chuck Bresnahan, but worse.
The most lazy, hands-off defense I’ve ever seen
Yes, but he was hand picked by Merv himself. Then thrown under the bus.
Was Austin the Problem with the Defense?
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01-15-2019, 02:00 AM
(01-14-2019, 05:33 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Yes. He was awful. A modern day Chuck Bresnahan, but worse. Yes, but he was hand picked by Merv himself. Then thrown under the bus.
01-15-2019, 09:52 AM
(01-14-2019, 04:19 PM)bengalhoel Wrote: You also have to factor in Driskel at QB and and a shit ton of injuries when Marvin was DC. All those final games were close except for the first Cleveland game, though we did make a mini comeback at the end. Beat me to it...we not only had a lot of backups on the field for offense, but on defense we had lost Glasgow, Lawson, Burfict, Evans, Vigil (who came back late), and at times a few of the secondary guys. Starting Nickerson at LB was an open door to all kinds of crossing routes and check downs. Austin was a horrible DC, and Marvin is still too soft for me, but it was an improvement. I think a DC that will up their blitz % and play more man coverage outside will have this unity potentially in the top 10 again....but they won't do that without significant upgrades in the LB corps. They need a very good draft pick (White?) AND a solid FA with some speed and attitude. Yes, that won't come cheap, but the upgrade should help the entire defense.
01-15-2019, 09:53 AM
(01-14-2019, 04:21 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: We don't need an overhaul. Much more succinct than I was, but this is dead on.
01-15-2019, 09:57 AM
(01-14-2019, 06:59 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Really dig the write up. I get this, but 4 of those were from Famous (for Picks) Jameis. And that is the Breshnahan/Austin defense: Sit back off the receiver and catch any bad passes. The only problem is now even the rookie QBs are good. When you get a dud QB, sure...that style seems to work, but there aren't many duds in the NFL right now at QB.
01-15-2019, 11:07 AM
(01-14-2019, 08:49 PM)Whatever Wrote: Our LB's are just plain bad. Burfict is finished. Rey is finished. Brown is a decent 2 down thumper, but he's a FA. Vigil looks like a quality backup, at best. Evans looks lost half the time. Nickerson isn't NFL roster worthy. Jefferson couldn't get on the field, but new coaches might be able to get something out of him. We definitely need 2 guys that are starting caliber. I agree, although I think Brown is a little better than he's given credit for around here. He had an INT at Indy, and played through a bad ankle sprain from then on. I think he's a pretty good ball player when healthy. He would make a good complimentary piece to a couple of legit LBs. "Better send those refunds..."
01-15-2019, 11:29 AM
(01-15-2019, 11:07 AM)Wyche Wrote: I agree, although I think Brown is a little better than he's given credit for around here. He had an INT at Indy, and played through a bad ankle sprain from then on. I think he's a pretty good ball player when healthy. He would make a good complimentary piece to a couple of legit LBs. Vigil is also taking alot of heat even though he had a serious MCL sprain but going into week 6 (week he was hurt) he lead the NFL in stops. https://www.cincyjungle.com/2018/10/15/17979278/bengals-lb-nick-vigil-to-miss-extended-time-due-to-mcl-injury
01-15-2019, 11:33 AM
(01-14-2019, 06:14 PM)jason Wrote: Think we could use a legit guy on the edge to replace MJ too. The linebackers being hot garbage, and MJ's lack of anything helped offenses to key in on Geno and Dunlap. I like Hubbard, and think he's gonna be a nice player, but I like him as a rotational guy at the moment. I don't think Lawson's a 3 down guy either. You've got a great point, however I feel Hubbard is ready to go. He had a great rookie year and he will build upon it, getting stronger and more savvy.
01-15-2019, 11:34 AM
(01-15-2019, 11:29 AM)Synric Wrote: Vigil is also taking alot of heat even though he had a serious MCL sprain but going into week 6 (week he was hurt) he lead the NFL in stops. That's true as well. With so many injuries, it's easy to overlook things when a guy came back to play. Brown wound up with 2 INTs, 2 more than our entire CB unit combined. One of those came while he was playing hurt. He was slowed dramatically from the guy that led the NFL in tackles the year prior, and you know Vigil was slowed down some as well. I would definitely keep him too. I would be inclined to release the rest of them if I am able to.....with the exception of Jefferson. "Better send those refunds..."
01-15-2019, 02:31 PM
(01-14-2019, 05:19 PM)Sled21 Wrote: At least Evans is showing steady improvement. A new LB coach will do him wonders.... Yes, not ready to dismiss Evans yet, he was a known project coming in, and he has the speed and skills to cover. Just needs to learn the position better. I would like to see him with a new LB Coach, find out of the learning or teaching was the problem and same there with Jefferson. I think he's got the ability, just needs to learn his positions well. Both are Projects that have the Speed and Ability, just need to acquire the skills from a competent LB Coach and both are of the mold we are looking for. Can't always get those 1st rounders ready to roll. Sometimes have to develop them yourselves.
01-15-2019, 02:55 PM
(01-14-2019, 05:06 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Marvin did more with less.... This. Kudos to the OP for a really well thought breakdown.
01-15-2019, 03:36 PM
(01-15-2019, 11:29 AM)Synric Wrote: Vigil is also taking alot of heat even though he had a serious MCL sprain but going into week 6 (week he was hurt) he lead the NFL in stops. Rey M used to get a lot of tackles as well. But old Captain "Wrong gap" also did most of his tackling after 4 or 5 yards were given up. This LB crew is a complete re-set. Maybe one or two guys will be salvaged.
Fredtoast + Ignore = Forum bliss
01-15-2019, 03:48 PM
Was Austin THE issue with the defense? No, but he was certainly a major issue. For example, his insistence on playing personnel obviously better suited for press man coverage in soft zones did nothing but make it child's play for offenses to march down the field on us.
As to the LB I keep Brown, Vigil and Jefferson and release EVERYONE else. Between the draft and free agency restock the LB corps.
01-15-2019, 03:58 PM
BONUS STAT:
Okay, I did 3rd down percentage. It was sitting in the back of my mind as a curiosity, so I just went ahead and did it. The format is exactly the same as the first post. With Austin, we allowed conversions 56.15% of the time. Without Austin, we allowed conversion 38.71% of the time. An improvement of 17.44 points. With Austin, they were allowing 3rd down conversions a whopping 12.4% more than the opponent's season average. Without Austin, they were allowing a 3rd down conversion only 0.1% more than the opponent's average. Under Austin, they held a team below their season average just 1 time. Without Austin, they held a team below their season average 3 times. On the whole, the Bengals ended the season dead last in 3rd down conversion % allowed. With Austin, they were also dead last. Without Austin, if that period of time were compared to the entire regular season for other teams, they would have come in at 17th place. Not great, but not abysmal either. Obviously, the same asterisks apply: generally better offenses in the first half, more injuries and a worse Bengals offense in the 2nd half etc. The bottom line is Austin's defense ***** sucked.
01-15-2019, 05:29 PM
(01-15-2019, 03:36 PM)I_C_DeadPeople Wrote: Rey M used to get a lot of tackles as well. But old Captain "Wrong gap" also did most of his tackling after 4 or 5 yards were given up. Stops are not just tackles. It's a tackle that results in the failure of an offensive drive aka not letting an opposing offense convert on a 3rd or 4th down.
01-15-2019, 06:34 PM
(01-14-2019, 04:00 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I was reading the NFL draft forum threads and someone mentioned, as a reason not to draft the LSU LB White, that Austin was the problem and that once we fired him, our defense improved to the point that we don't really need to overhaul the defense anymore. Great breakdown CJD, yeah it was definately much better once Austin was gone no surprise but the Linebackers were bad all season long and that made the enitre Defense way worse than what they really are. We have good players but when one entire position group is just terrible it hurts everyone on the Defense. I want to see how much better our Linebackers are next year under a different LB coach. BTW, still need a FA and an early pick LB'er.
01-15-2019, 07:29 PM
(01-15-2019, 09:57 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I get this, but 4 of those were from Famous (for Picks) Jameis. And that is the Breshnahan/Austin defense: Sit back off the receiver and catch any bad passes. The only problem is now even the rookie QBs are good. When you get a dud QB, sure...that style seems to work, but there aren't many duds in the NFL right now at QB. That is true. But you can also say that 2 of the fumble recoveries came against the Raiders. So that would leave 2 INTs and 1 fumble recovery for the other 6 games with Marvin being DC. I just don't think the personnel fit what Austin wanted to do. Just a bad fit for everyone involved.
01-15-2019, 08:01 PM
(01-14-2019, 04:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Worth also pointing out the records with and without Austin... WE were 5-4 in spite of Austin not because of him.
01-16-2019, 12:21 AM
(01-15-2019, 08:01 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: WE were 5-4 in spite of Austin not because of him. I know that...my point was that the offense was better and therefore the opponents were calling more pass plays. I thought that was obvious... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins Zac Taylor 2023: 9 wins despite losing Burrow half the season Zac Taylor 2024: Started 1-4. If he can turn this into a playoff appearance, it will be impressive. Sorry for Party Rocking!
01-16-2019, 06:27 PM
01-17-2019, 04:46 AM
(01-14-2019, 04:21 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: We don't need an overhaul. I think fearsome is an awfully strong word. Three 1st round CBs with 0 INT is hardly fearsome. ____________________________________________________________
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