The WR position going into 2019

[fredtoast]

We need help at WR. Especially with the system Taylor runs.

Last year the Rams #3 and #4 WRs combined for 69 receptions and 968 yards (14.0 avg)

Bengals #3 and #4 WRs had 41 receptions for 377 yds (9.2 avg)

[McC]

(02-10-2019, 08:06 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I watched Josh Malone play in college and I thought he would be a good NFL starter.  He is athletic and has good hands.  I felt his numbers were low in college because Tennessee had a very simplistic passing game.

But so far he has been a big disappointment.

He did show something his rookie year.  Granted, he didn't have a lot of catches, but he showed some speed and some hands, enough to give the impression he might do more in his second year.  Don't know what happened to him.  Hell, he took a back seat to Cody Core. 

I'm not ready to give up on him just yet.

[Catmandude123]

(02-10-2019, 04:02 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The offensive line being a bottom 5 line doesn't help the WR's produce either.

Bingo. Improve the running game while giving Dalton adequate time is the key. Our offense is not the problem its the inability to stop the other team. Hopefully our DC, who ever that turs out to be, can get more out of our existing players and can coach our rookies into NFL players or it may be a loooong season.
 

[*Nately120*]

(02-10-2019, 03:43 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: We seem to pick a WR or two late in every draft...and generally none of them contribute at any appreciable level.

That's right...does this mean Auden "gonna be a nighmare in the redzone" Tate is the winner of the 2018 "GOLDEN BINNS" award?

[Bengalitis]

Auden is past his "exempt" rookie year when he's allowed a "free pass", now he's ready to lead the team in catches and yards. Things I've learned from others' point of view here on the boards on the development of WRs in the NFL. (Add Ross to that "exempt" clause) With a seasoned AJ Green, a ferocious Boyd and the 2 "exempt" rookies, we're going to the SB!!!!

[THE PISTONS]

(02-11-2019, 10:07 AM)Bengalitis Wrote: Auden is past his "exempt" rookie year when he's allowed a "free pass", now he's ready to lead the team in catches and yards. Things I've learned from others' point of view here on the boards on the development of WRs in the NFL.    (Add Ross to that "exempt" clause) With a seasoned AJ Green, a ferocious Boyd and the 2 "exempt" rookies, we're going to the SB!!!!

People certainly get too excited about preseason and how players look. That's one thing for sure.

[*SHRacerX*]

(02-10-2019, 03:23 PM)impactplaya Wrote: one of the  most debated team positions in 2018 was the WRs.
Guys like Tyler Boyd stepped up and did alot of things to impact the offense.
Green when healthy showed times of dominance and even won a game (Falcons)
then others like John Ross had people divided on opinions on him.
then others like Josh Malone really did nothing when healthy.

looking at the Rams usage of WR in 2018 Im trying to figure out whos a good fit going ahead.
the Rams had 4 WRs that hauled in 5 TDs or more....Kupp Reynolds Woods Cooks.
2 -1,000 yd WRs  Cooks and Woods.

In 2018 Rams WRs ran the ball 39 times on jet sweeps etc thats a average of 2 attempts per game.

not to be overlooked the Rams WRs were really good downfield run blockers.

one of the negatives I saw out of the Bengals WRs in 2018 was their lack of 40 yd and over pass plays.
I think Boyd had the only gain over 40 plus yds.
I think even after the catch Bengals WRs struggled to seperate to get YAC.

I noticed in Lazors offense WRs ran alot of curl and hook routes.with back turned to the defense.
Lazor also did a porous job in implementing the levels concept.
McVay seemed to be in favor of that mindset with the Rams WRs.
the Rams WRs were able to catch the ball in space and get alot of YAC.

as far as the Bengals WRs go I think Green Boyd and Ross are locks.
I think guys like Tate Erickson and Malone are open for debate.
however I will say Tate of those 3 gives Taylor a bigger WR with radius he didnt have in L.A.
Erickson and Malone can be replaced. its not hard to replace 1 TDs in 2 years between those 2.

would not be surprised to see the Bengals draft a real burner in the mid rds.

This is a good analysis, including things like % of jet sweeps, etc.  It would be hard to calculate, but I think the Rams do a LOT of misdirection, QB waggles, etc.   I think this will benefit the Bengals as Lazor seemed to have Dalton as a sitting duck in one spot for many plays.  Dalton did a great job (seemed to really improve this...QB Coach Van Pelt?) getting outside the pocket and creating plays.  With a bit less predictability in Dalton's launch point, it can slow the opposing pass rush.  

I am not sure if Cody Core or Malone are signed moving forward but I would think their bigger bodies (also key on special teams) are better blockers.  

It will be interesting to see who they go with moving forward.  

[THE PISTONS]

(02-11-2019, 10:43 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: This is a good analysis, including things like % of jet sweeps, etc.  It would be hard to calculate, but I think the Rams do a LOT of misdirection, QB waggles, etc.   I think this will benefit the Bengals as Lazor seemed to have Dalton as a sitting duck in one spot for many plays.  Dalton did a great job (seemed to really improve this...QB Coach Van Pelt?) getting outside the pocket and creating plays.  With a bit less predictability in Dalton's launch point, it can slow the opposing pass rush.  

I am not sure if Cody Core or Malone are signed moving forward but I would think their bigger bodies (also key on special teams) are better blockers.  

It will be interesting to see who they go with moving forward.  

I agree with all stated.

The elephant in the room though is the Rams have a Top 5 offensive line and we have a bottom 5 line.

[*Nately120*]

(02-11-2019, 10:07 AM)Bengalitis Wrote: Auden is past his "exempt" rookie year when he's allowed a "free pass", now he's ready to lead the team in catches and yards. Things I've learned from others' point of view here on the boards on the development of WRs in the NFL.    (Add Ross to that "exempt" clause) With a seasoned AJ Green, a ferocious Boyd and the 2 "exempt" rookies, we're going to the SB!!!!

I think we are going to be screaming for Auden Tate, unless we draft another 7th round WR that we deem to be a hidden gem.  If that is the case, Tate will get about 2 games to prove himself before we declare him to be getting in the way of our next late-round gem.

So we have a new system here.  Ross is a rookie since he's played like 4 games with Dalton, Tate is a rookie, Malone and Core are bums who need to get cut (no excuses for them).  That's how I see things going.  Time will tell!

[THE PISTONS]

(02-11-2019, 11:30 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I think we are going to be screaming for Auden Tate, unless we draft another 7th round WR that we deem to be a hidden gem.  If that is the case, Tate will get about 2 games to prove himself before we declare him to be getting in the way of our next late-round gem.

So we have a new system here.  Ross is a rookie since he's played like 4 games with Dalton, Tate is a rookie, Malone and Core are bums who need to get cut (no excuses for them).  That's how I see things going.  Time will tell!

And lets face it, even a 7th Round pick at WR will come in and have a ton of athleticism and look decent with no pads on in camp. It's can you do things with pads on and a top tier defensive back trying to stop you that separates these guys.

[XenoMorph]

(02-10-2019, 03:23 PM)impactplaya Wrote: one of the  most debated team positions in 2018 was the WRs.
Guys like Tyler Boyd stepped up and did alot of things to impact the offense.
Green when healthy showed times of dominance and even won a game (Falcons)
then others like John Ross had people divided on opinions on him.
then others like Josh Malone really did nothing when healthy.

looking at the Rams usage of WR in 2018 Im trying to figure out whos a good fit going ahead.
the Rams had 4 WRs that hauled in 5 TDs or more....Kupp Reynolds Woods Cooks.
2 -1,000 yd WRs  Cooks and Woods.

In 2018 Rams WRs ran the ball 39 times on jet sweeps etc thats a average of 2 attempts per game.

not to be overlooked the Rams WRs were really good downfield run blockers.

one of the negatives I saw out of the Bengals WRs in 2018 was their lack of 40 yd and over pass plays.
I think Boyd had the only gain over 40 plus yds.
I think even after the catch Bengals WRs struggled to seperate to get YAC.

I noticed in Lazors offense WRs ran alot of curl and hook routes.with back turned to the defense.
Lazor also did a porous job in implementing the levels concept.
McVay seemed to be in favor of that mindset with the Rams WRs.
the Rams WRs were able to catch the ball in space and get alot of YAC.

as far as the Bengals WRs go I think Green Boyd and Ross are locks.
I think guys like Tate Erickson and Malone are open for debate.
however I will say Tate of those 3 gives Taylor a bigger WR with radius he didnt have in L.A.
Erickson and Malone can be replaced. its not hard to replace 1 TDs in 2 years between those 2.

would not be surprised to see the Bengals draft a real burner in the mid rds.

my only problem with tate is in key situations he didn't make the catch..

[impactplaya]

Tate and Malone had very little margain for error last year under Lewis while Core would drop passes and still stay on the field.
Tate was raw last year.
but he showed me stronger hands and being able to adjust to errant throws better than Core could do.
Malone and Tate have a chance to Taylor they belong.
its not Tates fault Lazor had him the same 2 routes .

[*Nately120*]

(02-11-2019, 12:07 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Tate and Malone had very little margain for error last year under Lewis while Core would drop passes and still stay on the field.
Tate was raw last year.
but he showed me stronger hands and being able to adjust to errant throws better than Core could do.
Malone and Tate have a chance to Taylor they belong.
its not Tates fault Lazor had him the same 2 routes .

I guess we will find out this year.  It's Marvin's fault Tate wasn't on the field and Lazor's fault that when Tate was on the field he didn't do anything.  This year we are either going to see Tate get productive, or decide he's a bum and Marvin was right.  I don't see us blaming ZT for Tate's failings this year, if he disappoints.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-10-2019, 03:23 PM)impactplaya Wrote: one of the most debated team positions in 2018 was the WRs.
Guys like Tyler Boyd stepped up and did alot of things to impact the offense.
Green when healthy showed times of dominance and even won a game (Falcons)
then others like John Ross had people divided on opinions on him.
then others like Josh Malone really did nothing when healthy.

looking at the Rams usage of WR in 2018 Im trying to figure out whos a good fit going ahead.
the Rams had 4 WRs that hauled in 5 TDs or more....Kupp Reynolds Woods Cooks.
2 -1,000 yd WRs Cooks and Woods.

In 2018 Rams WRs ran the ball 39 times on jet sweeps etc thats a average of 2 attempts per game.

not to be overlooked the Rams WRs were really good downfield run blockers.

one of the negatives I saw out of the Bengals WRs in 2018 was their lack of 40 yd and over pass plays.
I think Boyd had the only gain over 40 plus yds.
I think even after the catch Bengals WRs struggled to seperate to get YAC.

I noticed in Lazors offense WRs ran alot of curl and hook routes.with back turned to the defense.
Lazor also did a porous job in implementing the levels concept.
McVay seemed to be in favor of that mindset with the Rams WRs.
the Rams WRs were able to catch the ball in space and get alot of YAC.

as far as the Bengals WRs go I think Green Boyd and Ross are locks.
I think guys like Tate Erickson and Malone are open for debate.
however I will say Tate of those 3 gives Taylor a bigger WR with radius he didnt have in L.A.
Erickson and Malone can be replaced. its not hard to replace 1 TDs in 2 years between those 2.

would not be surprised to see the Bengals draft a real burner in the mid rds.

With Boyd coming into his own last year we are a lot better off than we were and i think a WR like Ross will thrive in Taylor and Callahan's system the way Cooks did. I think adding another pass catching TE in the 3rd round or so will really help out the WR core. Malone and Core have been the most disappointing to me. I agree that we should add another talented WR in the mid rounds to compete. Erickson is still a good Returner, i think he still makes the team unless someone like Phillips becomes a great Returner for us.

[*Nately120*]

(02-11-2019, 02:54 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: With Boyd coming into his own last year we are a lot better off than we were and i think a WR like Ross will thrive in Taylor and Callahan's system the way Cooks did. I think adding another pass catching TE in the 3rd round or so will really help out the WR core. Malone and Core have been the most disappointing to me. I agree that we should add another talented WR in the mid rounds to compete. Erickson is still a good Returner, i think he still makes the team unless someone like Phillips becomes a great Returner for us.

I see what you are getting at, but I have to admit the fact that the young guys who got a chance to get on the field unanimously disappointed and the young guys who didn't get a chance to get on the field still have exciting potential doesn't bode well, either.

It just seems like every year we watch the WRs we used to be hyped about disappointing and getting in the way of the WRs we are hyped about right now...who then become the WRs we used to be hyped about that are getting in the way of the WRs we are hyped about now.  Son on and so forth, ashes to ashes, etc.  Sort of like the Steelers have a young and ego-free cheap #2 WR who replaces their over-paid diva cancer #1 WR before becoming an over-paid diva cancer #1 WR who will be gleefully replaced by a young and ego-free cheap #2 WR, himself.

I see some real WR hierarchies, going on here.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-11-2019, 03:33 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I see what you are getting at, but I have to admit the fact that the young guys who got a chance to get on the field unanimously disappointed and the young guys who didn't get a chance to get on the field still have exciting potential doesn't bode well, either.

It just seems like every year we watch the WRs we used to be hyped about disappointing and getting in the way of the WRs we are hyped about right now...who then become the WRs we used to be hyped about that are getting in the way of the WRs we are hyped about now.  Son on and so forth, ashes to ashes, etc.  Sort of like the Steelers have a young and ego-free cheap #2 WR who replaces their over-paid diva cancer #1 WR before becoming an over-paid diva cancer #1 WR who will be gleefully replaced by a young and ego-free cheap #2 WR, himself.

I see some real WR hierarchies, going on here.

Something to note is it was only Bicknell's first year as our WR coach. Boyd sure responded in a positive way.

Hope Ross does the same this year and Taylor did work with the young WR's with the Rams. Kupp had a great rookie year going until he got injured working with Taylor.

[*Nately120*]

(02-11-2019, 03:57 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Something to note is it was only Bicknell's first year as our WR coach. Boyd sure responded in a positive way.

Hope Ross does the same this year and Taylor did work with the young WR's with the Rams. Kupp had a great rookie year going until he got injured working with Taylor.

Right, it could happen.  Our WRs that aren't Green and Boyd had better hope Marvin and Lazor were the reason they weren't up to par, because we aren't going to be blaming our new coaches this year.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-11-2019, 05:10 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Right, it could happen.  Our WRs that aren't Green and Boyd had better hope Marvin and Lazor were the reason they weren't up to par, because we aren't going to be blaming our new coaches this year.

There are reasons to believe that out WR's will improve another year under Bicknell and under an offensive minded HC.

Didn't like how Lazor used Ross at all.

[BengalChris]

(02-11-2019, 06:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: There are reasons to believe that out WR's will improve another year under Bicknell and under an offensive minded HC.

Didn't like how Lazor used Ross at all.

I didn't like how Ross ran his routes and attempted to catch the ball. The guy needs to step up in year 3.

[*bengalfan74*]

(02-11-2019, 06:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: There are reasons to believe that out WR's will improve another year under Bicknell and under an offensive minded HC.

Didn't like how Lazor used Ross at all.

You gotta love Lazor for helping to get PA booted. But I didn't like his coaching/play calling down the stretch, at all. He ignored Mixon for giant stretch's in games and didn't get him involved enough in the passing game. 

Lazor did little to nothing to help Ross and get him involved in the short to medium passing game. He did little to help Driskel and on and on.