Josh Rosen

[Au165]

(03-04-2019, 09:33 PM)Whatever Wrote: The QB trade market this year is going to be totally out of whack.  I don't see how the Cards can ask for a 1st or high 2 for Rosen when Flacco is being dealt for a rumored 4th rounder.  Flacco has that monster contract, but he's also a SB MVP and quite a bit better than Rosen.  The 49'ers gave up a 2nd rounder for Garrapolo to come in and be a starter.  I just don't see anyone giving that for a guy that needs to sit for at least a year.

I also feel that if you're sold enough on Murray or any other QB to take them at #1 if you can move Rosen, you're sold enough to take them at #1 if you can't move Rosen.  You're basically saying Murray is that good and/or Rosen is that bad.  There will be teams willing to take Rosen for a mid round pick if you're that worried about conflict.

Of course, this can also just be a complete smokescreen and the Cards are trying to move down a few spots by putting a scare in a QB needy team.

Simple, one is cheap young and has potential the other is old tapped out and expensive.

[J24]

(03-04-2019, 09:33 PM)Whatever Wrote: The QB trade market this year is going to be totally out of whack.  I don't see how the Cards can ask for a 1st or high 2 for Rosen when Flacco is being dealt for a rumored 4th rounder.  Flacco has that monster contract, but he's also a SB MVP and quite a bit better than Rosen.  The 49'ers gave up a 2nd rounder for Garrapolo to come in and be a starter.  I just don't see anyone giving that for a guy that needs to sit for at least a year.

I also feel that if you're sold enough on Murray or any other QB to take them at #1 if you can move Rosen, you're sold enough to take them at #1 if you can't move Rosen.  You're basically saying Murray is that good and/or Rosen is that bad.  There will be teams willing to take Rosen for a mid round pick if you're that worried about conflict.

Of course, this can also just be a complete smokescreen and the Cards are trying to move down a few spots by putting a scare in a QB needy team.

Please Flaco has been trash for the past 4 seasons ( not to mention a bad back) his trade won't impact any decent QB trade Value. 

[THE PISTONS]

(03-04-2019, 10:05 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Please Flaco has been trash for the past 4 seasons ( not to mention a bad back) his trade won't impact any decent QB trade Value. 

Agreed. I'm not sure he's an upgrade to Keenum honestly.

Denver makes some curious QB decisions outside of Manning who fell into their lap.

[t3r3e3]

(03-04-2019, 10:05 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Please Flaco has been trash for the past 4 seasons ( not to mention a bad back) his trade won't impact any decent QB trade Value. 

For Elway to be a HoF QB, his judgement of QB talent has been downright terrible. Manning when he signed was shrewd, and even a broken down Peyton Manning was the best choice of the rest. Every draft pick has been terrible, the FA signings uninspiring. It’s almost like he forgot what to look for in a QB. With that defense you’d figure they could nab a decent QB.

[Whatever]

(03-04-2019, 09:42 PM)Au165 Wrote: Simple, one is cheap young and has potential the other is old tapped out and expensive.

There are way more cheap young QB's with unrealized potential out there than QB's who have won the SB, though.  In fact, there's going to be a draft full of them.  Why give up a high pick on a kid who's already failed as a starter and who's team is ready to cut bait after only one season?  Plus, what will this do to Rosen's confidence?  

[Whatever]

(03-04-2019, 10:05 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Please Flaco has been trash for the past 4 seasons ( not to mention a bad back) his trade won't impact any decent QB trade Value. 

Flacco has had a QBR over 80 each of the last four years.  Rosen's was 66.7 last year.  Flacco probably won't affect a guy like Carr who's rumored to be on the trade block, but Rosen isn't even a "decent" QB.  Blake Bortles had a better rookie season, for pete's sake.

[*bfine32*]

Couple things:

I think having Rosen on the roster makes our QB situation better, but there are more QB needy teams that should/would give more for him than us.

Stick with Andy and bring in someone later in the draft

[Murdock2420]

(03-05-2019, 01:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Couple things:

I think having Rosen on the roster makes our QB situation better, but there are more QB needy teams that should/would give more for him than us.

Stick with Andy and bring in someone later in the draft

Give me the kid from Buffalo that was throwing fastballs through the hands of wideouts at the combine.

[TSwigZ]

If his value ever somehow drops to a 3rd rounder I’d do it in a heartbeat

[McC]

(03-04-2019, 08:49 PM)Whodey614 Wrote: The Bengals had a top 3 offensive line in 2014 & 15. That was a known fact back then. 2014 produced the best rushing offense since the Rudi Johnson days. Dalton's stats weren't as good in 2014 but that had more to do with Eifert and Jones being out for the season and AJ missed some time as well. They had to rely on the run more than ever before. With a healthy team, they were even better in 2015. They were top 3 in pass blocking efficiency, bottom 3 in sacks allowed and top 3 in rushing touchdowns in both seasons. Dalton hasn't been the same QB since because the line has regressed into terrible tier.

Who on Arizona hates Rosen? If you trade draft capital for Rosen, you obviously don't intend to sit him. Only Bengals fans think it's impossible that Rosen would offer more than Dalton if they were on the same team. GMs certainly don't think that, or they'd trade a 1st and 2nd for Dalton.

Bullshit.  Didn't even average 4 ypc.  Had a human turnstile at Center.  On what planet is that top 3? The passing game was what it was because of how quickly Dalton got the ball out.

Look, trading for Rosen is a stupid, stupid idea.  Sorry to burst your little bubble.

[McC]

It cost the Cardinals a first, third and fifth to get this guy. If they are willing to let him go one year later for a fraction of that, how is that anything but a red flag? That just screams buyer beware.

Some foolish, QB needy team might go for it, if it even happens and isn't just some figment of a sports blogger's imagination. Hard pass on this for us, though. We will be wanting a new QB in the near future but it cannot be this turd.

[ben_lewtas9]

(03-05-2019, 02:23 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Give me the kid from Buffalo that was throwing fastballs through the hands of wideouts at the combine.

Please god no. He should be playing defensive end or something.

[RunKijanaRun]

(03-05-2019, 07:26 AM)McC Wrote: It cost the Cardinals a first, third and fifth to get this guy.  If they are willing to let him go one year later for a fraction of that, how is that anything but a red flag?  That just screams buyer beware.

Some foolish, QB needy team might go for it, if it even happens and isn't just some figment of a sports blogger's imagination.  Hard pass on this for us, though.  We will be wanting a new QB in the near future but it cannot be this turd.

What this guy said. 

[Whodey614]

(03-05-2019, 07:05 AM)McC Wrote: Bullshit.  Didn't even average 4 ypc.  Had a human turnstile at Center.  On what planet is that top 3?  The passing game was what it was because of how quickly Dalton got the ball out.

Look, trading for Rosen is a stupid, stupid idea.  Sorry to burst your little bubble.

They were disappointing in terms of YPC but they still had 38 rushing touchdowns. 2nd most in the league from 2014-15. They got it done in the red zone and again, they were top 3 in pass-blocking efficiency. Bodine was bad but that's one player. The rest of the offensive line did more than their part. You were able to hide Bodine because the o-line was good. Smith had his struggles but was nowhere near as bad as Ogbuehi was. Yes, Dalton got the ball quickly, but that had to do more with the fact he has one of the fastest releases in the league. You don't want Dalton holding the ball longer than he has to. Let's not lie here. Bengals had a great offensive line in that period and there are many articles out there that said it if the eye test failed you.

I won't be hurt if they don't trade for Rosen. This isn't about hating Dalton. But I'm willing to bet that Rosen will flourish in a different situation and the Bengals will once again look stupid if he only gets away for a 3rd while Dalton leads another disappointing season with the new coaching staff and there will be no Marvin or Bill Lazor to blame.

[Au165]

(03-05-2019, 07:26 AM)McC Wrote: It cost the Cardinals a first, third and fifth to get this guy.  If they are willing to let him go one year later for a fraction of that, how is that anything but a red flag?  That just screams buyer beware.

Some foolish, QB needy team might go for it, if it even happens and isn't just some figment of a sports blogger's imagination.  Hard pass on this for us, though.  We will be wanting a new QB in the near future but it cannot be this turd.

This is why I keep wondering why people want him. Was Elway the last 1st round QB to be traded a year after being drafted? In his case he demanded it, so that's not even the same thing. Fact of the matter is no horrible team is trading a franchise QB for peanuts a year after taking him if they believe he is actually good. Either they get a haul for him and they believe he can be good or they get peanuts and the fact they will take peanuts should make anyone trying to get him run away.

[McC]

(03-05-2019, 12:47 PM)Whodey614 Wrote: They were disappointing in terms of YPC but they still had 38 rushing touchdowns. 2nd most in the league from 2014-15. They got it done in the red zone and again, they were top 3 in pass-blocking efficiency. Bodine was bad but that's one player. The rest of the offensive line did more than their part. You were able to hide Bodine because the o-line was good. Smith had his struggles but was nowhere near as bad as Ogbuehi was. Yes, Dalton got the ball quickly, but that had to do more with the fact he has one of the fastest releases in the league. You don't want Dalton holding the ball longer than he has to. Let's not lie here. Bengals had a great offensive line in that period and there are many articles out there that said it if the eye test failed you.

I won't be hurt if they don't trade for Rosen. This isn't about hating Dalton. But I'm willing to bet that Rosen will flourish in a different situation and the Bengals will once again look stupid if he only gets away for a 3rd while Dalton leads another disappointing season with the new coaching staff and there will be no Marvin or Bill Lazor to blame.

How does sucked so bad they want him gone in a year equate to will flourish in a different situation?  How often does that happen?  Seems like a leap of faith beyond what reality dictates.

They had a lot of rushing TD's because a crazy amount of them from the five in.  YPC says it all about a run game.  I watched every one of those games in those years and never once thought damn, that is a great line.

[Whodey614]

(03-05-2019, 02:17 PM)McC Wrote: They had a lot of rushing TD's because a crazy amount of them from the five in.  YPC says it all about a run game.  I watched every one of those games in those years and never once thought damn, that is a great line.

They weren't Dallas level in terms of being the best OL or opening holes in the run game but they were a pretty good unit. Bengals fans are still holding onto hope that Dalton will return to 2015 form but downplay that the OL was good? Has Dalton not been inconsistent and played some of his worst football since the O-line fell apart? He hasn't been bad by any means, he's risen above it more than most people give him credit for but that doesn't change the fact. In order for 2015 Dalton to happen again, you need a 2015 o-line. Too bad the Bengals allowed the key pieces to leave and they've been paying for it since.

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/7/17/8992507/bengals-o-line-tabbed-one-of-nfls-best-offensive-position-groups

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/6/20/11976022/espn-ranks-bengals-offensive-line-nfl-units

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-offensive-lines-this-season

[THE PISTONS]

(03-05-2019, 02:17 PM)McC Wrote: How does sucked so bad they want him gone in a year equate to will flourish in a different situation?  How often does that happen?  Seems like a leap of faith beyond what reality dictates.

They had a lot of rushing TD's because a crazy amount of them from the five in.  YPC says it all about a run game.  I watched every one of those games in those years and never once thought damn, that is a great line.

I think the Jared Goff situation where he's lost as a rookie then gets a coaching staff that's capable and it clicks.

That said, it's far from a given that Rosen would flourish like that.

I think it's somewhat telling that the Cardinals would give up on him after 1 year...although with the 1st pick it's quite tempting to go QB. Picking Tackles doesn't really rally a fanbase and there aren't any worth it.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-05-2019, 02:23 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Give me the kid from Buffalo that was throwing fastballs through the hands of wideouts at the combine.

Why do people think this is a good thing? A QB who can't put touch on the ball can easily result in a lot of incompleted passes because the receivers can't make the catch. I remember seeing this a lot with Palmer. He would throw a bullet to a receiver who wasn't even 10 yards out and then get mad they didn't catch it. Blame the receivers all you want, but it's not always easy catching a ball that's thrown like a rocket.

[Au165]

(03-05-2019, 03:07 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Why do people think this is a good thing? A QB who can't put touch on the ball can easily result in a lot of incompleted passes because the receivers can't make the catch. I remember seeing this a lot with Palmer. He would throw a bullet to a receiver who wasn't even 10 yards out and then get mad they didn't catch it. Blame the receivers all you want, but it's not always easy catching a ball that's thrown like a rocket.

It was actually one of the knocks on Josh Allen last year was that he couldn't change up his speeds. I was heater all day and the issue is on a drag or a hitch that heater can fly through a WR's hand and end up an INT. Knowing how to change the pall velocity is a big deal.