Ross struggled with consistency during spring practices

[lone bengal]

Injury prone, learning issues and gives up on plays not a great combination. Hopefully he turns it around. The worst part of it is were hoping the number 9th pick of the draft becomes a decent number 3 WR and just not a complete bum. Ross plays next to two stud WR's in Boyd and Green ,has a good QB and a good running game.Imagine if Ross was on a team were he was expected to become the number one WR which is often asked of a pick as high as Ross. If you draft a guy at number 9 he needs to be an impact player not just a guy.

[OSUfan]

I am going to reserve judgement until I see how he performs under the new coaching staff.

[impactplaya]

Im sure on draft day Ross had to have been a bit surprised by the Bengals drafting him.
I bet he expected to be drafted by a team starved to.have a 4.3
burner that could stretch defenses.
I think Ross thought "hmm I could be drafted by a X team
and probally wind up as a number 2 by years end."
Ross got drafted by the Nati and thought
"oh boy got Green there and Boyd....."
his rookie year got washed out.
he got hurt.
nothing on offense went well that year.
even last year he got hurt.
WR take awhile to adjust to the pro game.
even WRs that come into really established offenses
struggle.
people cant gripe about Ross all they want.
yeah he hasnt reeled in 65 catches for 1000 and 8.
I get it.
the true is I believe.
I dont think any of the coaches last year really supported Ross or believed in him or even attempted
to put him in schemes to succeed.
if a typical Bengals Sunday scout at the bar can see Ross
was not schemed up last year to make huge plays
then what does that say about that Mickey Mouse offensive staff
last year?
i really believe Ross lacked confidence last year.
and I believe he felt if he made a error...he was getting a seat on
the bench.he was pressing.
he couldnt screw up plays like Cody Core and Alex Redmond
and no actions be enforced.
if anything Ross is a end zone threat legitimitally now.
you cant criticize that at all.

[*Nately120*]

(07-05-2019, 06:18 PM)OSUfan Wrote: I am going to reserve judgement until I see how he performs under the new coaching staff.

That's assuming Callahan knows how to use him when Zampese and Lazor apparently didn't. 

[BengalChris]

(07-05-2019, 10:49 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Im sure on draft day Ross had to have been a bit surprised by the Bengals drafting him.
I bet he expected to be drafted by a team starved to.have a 4.3
burner that could stretch defenses.
I think Ross thought "hmm I could be drafted by a X team
and probally wind up as a number 2 by years end."
Ross got drafted by the Nati and thought
"oh boy got Green there and Boyd....."
his rookie year got washed out.
he got hurt.
nothing on offense went well that year.
even last year he got hurt.
WR take awhile to adjust to the pro game.
even WRs that come into really established offenses
struggle.
people cant gripe about Ross all they want.
yeah he hasnt reeled in 65 catches for 1000 and 8.
I get it.
the true is I believe.
I dont think any of the coaches last year really supported  Ross or believed in him or even attempted
to put him in schemes to succeed.
if a typical Bengals Sunday scout at the bar can see Ross
was not schemed up last year to make huge plays
then what does that say about that Mickey Mouse offensive staff
last year?
i really believe Ross lacked confidence last year.
and I believe he felt if he made a error...he was getting a seat on
the bench.he was pressing.
he couldnt screw up plays like Cody Core and Alex Redmond
and no actions be enforced.
if anything Ross is a end zone  threat legitimitally now.
you cant criticize that at all.

You missed some of the excuses:

1. Have to list "he was injured" four times, not just once.
2. The QBs are incompetent, that's why Ross and the ball aren't at the same spot so the balls are uncatchable.
3. Marvin hates him.
4. "He's really just a rookie" has to be listed at least twice, if not three times.
5. His targets average 6 feet further down field than the targets to AJ Green and that's why his catch percentage is so bad.
6. Dalton doesn't have confidence in Ross so won't throw to him.
7. The last coaching staff didn't know how to use WRs. Just forget Chad, TJ, Green, Jones, Sanu, LaFell and Boyd cause they don't count.

You know how bad a player is by the length of the list of excuses.

 

[THE PISTONS]

(07-05-2019, 10:58 PM)Nately120 Wrote: That's assuming Callahan knows how to use him when Zampese and Lazor apparently didn't. 

Is it how he's used? Like Fred pointed out, Ross got a lot of playing time last year and had a really low catch rate. When the ball is there, you got to catch it. Some guys have 'it'. Ross doesn't seem to.

[Thundercloud]

Has anyone else questioned something amiss with Ross's vision. I can't figure out if he quits on balls, or just loses it, because on some deeper balls, he doesn't seem to react right. Also he seems much more effective when running a crossing route, when the ball doesn't travel as far, and comes in at a lower trajectory.

[*Nately120*]

(07-06-2019, 12:04 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Is it how he's used? Like Fred pointed out, Ross got a lot of playing time last year and had a really low catch rate. When the ball is there, you got to catch it. Some guys have 'it'. Ross doesn't seem to.

I'm just playing devils advocate here.  How surprised are we that Ross is having these same old issues with a new system? As Art Garfunkel once sang "It's the same old tears on a new background."

[Nicomo Cosca]

(07-06-2019, 04:09 AM)Thundercloud Wrote: Has anyone else questioned something amiss with Ross's vision. I can't figure out if he quits on balls, or just loses it, because on some deeper balls, he doesn't seem to react right. Also he seems much more effective when running a crossing route, when the ball doesn't travel as far, and comes in at a lower trajectory.

So you’re saying we should get him some Wild Thing glasses?



In all seriousness though. I doubt that’s it. He had no issues catching the ball in college.

[Bengalitis]

(07-05-2019, 10:49 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Im sure on draft day Ross had to have been a bit surprised by the Bengals drafting him.
I bet he expected to be drafted by a team starved to.have a 4.3
burner that could stretch defenses.
I think Ross thought "hmm I could be drafted by a X team
and probally wind up as a number 2 by years end."
Ross got drafted by the Nati and thought
"oh boy got Green there and Boyd....."
his rookie year got washed out.
he got hurt.
nothing on offense went well that year.
even last year he got hurt.
WR take awhile to adjust to the pro game.
even WRs that come into really established offenses
struggle.
people cant gripe about Ross all they want.
yeah he hasnt reeled in 65 catches for 1000 and 8.
I get it.
the true is I believe.
I dont think any of the coaches last year really supported  Ross or believed in him or even attempted
to put him in schemes to succeed.
if a typical Bengals Sunday scout at the bar can see Ross
was not schemed up last year to make huge plays
then what does that say about that Mickey Mouse offensive staff
last year?
i really believe Ross lacked confidence last year.
and I believe he felt if he made a error...he was getting a seat on
the bench.he was pressing.
he couldnt screw up plays like Cody Core and Alex Redmond
and no actions be enforced.
if anything Ross is a end zone  threat legitimitally now.
you cant criticize that at all.

The coaches were graceful enough to not make him look like a bust as much as possible. Otherwise you would be hearing a lot of criticism of them from players.

[fredtoast]

(07-05-2019, 10:49 PM)impactplaya Wrote: the true is I believe.
I dont think any of the coaches last year really supported  Ross or believed in him or even attempted
to put him in schemes to succeed.

The Bengals coaches were desperate for anything to give their offense a boost.  If there was any scheme that would have made Ross a good player they would have tried it.

(07-05-2019, 10:49 PM)impactplaya Wrote: if a typical Bengals Sunday scout at the bar can see Ross 
was not schemed up last year to make huge plays 
then what does that say about that Mickey Mouse offensive staff
last year?

There is not magical scheme that makes a guy with a 30% catch percentage turn out "huge plays".

(07-05-2019, 10:49 PM)impactplaya Wrote: I believe he felt if he made a error...he was getting a seat on
the bench.he was pressing. 
he couldnt screw up plays like Cody Core and Alex Redmond
and no actions be enforced.

Ross played pretty much 100% of the offensive snaps after Green was injured.  He was not benched when he messed up.  I have no idea what you mean by comparing his playing time to Core.  Ross had more targets than Core and Erickson COMBINED.

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-04-2019, 04:33 PM)jason Wrote: It's almost as if that guy's not very good or something...

Hated the pick, but I try to pull for the guy, but he doesn't give me much to work with. It was pretty damn exciting when he caught that long TD vs Buffalo last preseason though.

This has been the narrative from many fans (and seemingly his former coach, who really wanted Rueben Foster) and I get it.  We were defense starved and Ross felt like a luxury pick...until we saw what the offense did with him, Boyd, AJ, and Eifert in there together.  It was only a short while, but they were 4-1 with two of those wins coming on the road.  

I am not trying to say Ross was 100% the reason for this success, but he was absolutely a part of it.  I will explain:

Ross was largely used as a vertical threat between the 20s.  He was running and drawing coverage deep while Boyd, Eifert, and AJ worked underneath.  Look at AJs success in his snaps lined up in the slot vs. outside.  A lot of that was due to the coverage played against the Bengals.  Ross has decent success in the Red Zone and started to show much better effort in contested catches.  He also stayed healthy...something a lot of people said he would never do because he is too "frail".   The rushing attack also yielded its best YPC in over a decade.  Some of that could be attributed to Ross pulling safeties back from the LOS.  

If he has a dud of a season with the new offense, I will get on here and say that he probably shouldn't get another chance and we should try to trade him to KC as they will likely need to replace Tyreek Hill because that guy can't stay out of trouble.  Until then, I will give Ross this last chance and hope the coaching staff gets him more involved in the game plan with screens and slants that are high% completions and let him do his thing with the ball in his hands.  He is NOT just a straight ahead speed merchant.  The guy has phone-booth quicks that no one on the team has demonstrated before.  I would think Taylor is salivating at the prospect of getting him the ball early and drawing coverage off Green and Boyd.

This play-action heavy offense will take shots and I think it sets up perfectly for Ross.  Maybe I am wrong and he will never have the proverbial light go on but he had solid progress in what amounted to his first year last year.   I, personally, can't wait to see it.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-05-2019, 01:01 PM)fortyyearfan Wrote: To start with, I would give ross 3-4 super good plays and allow him to just learn them inside and out,and as the season rolls along give him more,some guys struggle to learn all of that stuff,I know I would,and some players just cannot grasp a lot at once,their attention is not long term and their memory is not good enough.Too much wacky weed early in life and you struggle to remember anything for very lone,that stuff destroys brain cells by the millions.I hated to see friends smoke that crap and I was always a stay in shape guy,like lifting weights,running the road and all that.I believe he will be good this season,but he has to prove himself or else ZT will say good bye. :andy:

I agree with the so-called "package of plays" beyond just simply having him run vertical routes.  One thing I like that ZT has said is he wants his team to be the fastest team on the field on Sundays and the freshest team on the field on Sundays.  That will involve Ross and keeping a thoroughbred fresh is a good idea.  Even Paul Brown was rumored to have told Issac Curtis is just sit out and stretch if something was nagging him at all.  He realized that without his speed, he wouldn't be near the weapon.  He wasn't wasting him on blocking drills and the like, just to be a "football player".  

[*Nately120*]

(07-06-2019, 11:13 AM)fredtoast Wrote: The Bengals coaches were desperate for anything to give their offense a boost.  If there was any scheme that would have made Ross a good player they would have tried it.


There is not magical scheme that makes a guy with a 30% catch percentage turn out "huge plays".


Ross played pretty much 100% of the offensive snaps after Green was injured.  He was not benched when he messed up.  I have no idea what you mean by comparing his playing time to Core.  Ross had more targets than Core and Erickson COMBINED.

Ross was going to be great as long as he got on the field and then he DID get on the field and he would have been great were it not for Marvin/Lazor/Driskell, so the excuses rolleth onward.  I still can't believe the guy could end a meaningless NFL game in a dead season with no more than 1-3 receptions.  He didn't even have Green and Boyd "getting in his way" and he's only good for a single catch...huzzha.  That was his time to show that he can at least put up some gaudy stats in a losing affair, but alas, he cannot.  

Again, I can't see the future but when I see stuff like "If Ross can produce, if Ross can get consistent" or "If Eifert can stay healthy" I just hope genius ZT isn't counting on either guy too much.

(07-06-2019, 02:46 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I agree with the so-called "package of plays" beyond just simply having him run vertical routes.  One thing I like that ZT has said is he wants his team to be the fastest team on the field on Sundays and the freshest team on the field on Sundays.  That will involve Ross and keeping a thoroughbred fresh is a good idea.  Even Paul Brown was rumored to have told Issac Curtis is just sit out and stretch if something was nagging him at all.  He realized that without his speed, he wouldn't be near the weapon.  He wasn't wasting him on blocking drills and the like, just to be a "football player".  

I guess that's worth a shot.  I mean, it's beyond disappointing to see a top 10 pick have to be used in such a limited and gimmicky manner, but that ship has sailed so we may as well try to get something out of it.  The idea of using a using a player like Ross to be super specific and fast sounds like a senile-Al Davis strategy more than a Paul Brown one, though.

[fredtoast]

(07-06-2019, 02:31 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: we should try to trade him to KC as they will likely need to replace Tyreek Hill

Ross could not replace Tyreek Hill.  Tyreek Hill can get open and catch passes.

[bengals67]

Problem is that the alleged superior Duke Tobin ( or whoever is making the calls) has been missing on draft picks for the last few years.

Ross was a dumb pick. They should have taken an o lineman or a linebacker.

It has all gone downhill fast since the Fisher and Og we don't need Whit or Zeitler any more debacle.

[*psychdoctor*]

I would like to say a few points:

1-If Ross gets injured again this season, then I will lose all hope for the guy. He had injury concerns prior to the draft so some athletes are just snake bit (See Eifert).

2-Just send Ross on "go" routes and keep the game plan simple. No more reversals or gimmicks.

3-Use Ross in the Red Zone.

[Bengalitis]

(07-06-2019, 03:38 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I would like to say a few points:

1-If Ross gets injured again this season, then I will lose all hope for the guy.  He had injury concerns prior to the draft so some athletes are just snake bit (See Eifert).
 
2-Just send Ross on "go" routes and keep the game plan simple.  No more reversals or gimmicks.

3-Use Ross in the Red Zone.

#1 He is not too durable a player in the injury bracket.

#2 Has not worked in the last 2 years. He either gives up because he gets tired of just sprinting 3 hours and hardly gets the ball/miss thrown/dropped/ didn't think they would throw at him/ etc.  Unreliable to say the least.

#3 This is his best usefulness as BOYD and GREEN and EIFERT and MIXON are the biggest concerned for other teams and get covered well. THat leaves Ross open. That's how he was able to get 7 TDs last season perhaps. To his credit he didn't drop many in the end zone. The 5th option 1st rounder.  

[THE PISTONS]

(07-06-2019, 03:05 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Ross could not replace Tyreek Hill.  Tyreek Hill can get open and catch passes.

That's a dumb narrative that the forum uses. As you've shown, Ross got opportunities and didn't produce. He likely wouldn't produce in KC either.

People in the forum think coaches are magic.

[fredtoast]

(07-06-2019, 03:24 PM)bengals67 Wrote: Problem is that the alleged superior Duke Tobin ( or whoever is making the calls) has been missing on draft picks for the last few years.

Ross was a dumb pick. They should have taken an o lineman or a linebacker.

It has all gone downhill fast since the Fisher and Og we don't need Whit or Zeitler any more debacle.

Nothing wrong with plan to let older players go before they break down and using high draft picks to replace them.  The problem a has been in the execution.  

Even the best teams have high draft picks that flop, but they will use free agency to fill holes when they miss in the draft.  Not every player taken in the first two rounds will be good, but most of them should at least be starters.  In just the last 7 years we have used those picks on guys like Devon Still, Margus Hunt, Tyler Eifert, Jeremy Hill, Jake Fisher, Cedric Ogbuehi, John Ross, and Billy Price.  I still feel pretty good about Price, and we did get one good year each out of Hill and Eifert, but that is 8 players in the first two rounds with very little production at all.  If you are a team that lives by the draft those picks should be what you build your team around.