Our LB's and Secondary have Regressed Horribly

[THE PISTONS]

(09-16-2019, 04:21 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: 1.) You damn well no the secondary is better than this they showed it at the end of last season. Bates and Jackson in particular. They will be playing a lot better probably sooner than later.
2.) Maybe they will actually start to mix Pratt into the game plan. One of his strengths is his athlectism. Why didn't they play IDK but they should play him more. Like the guy said if he is who they think he is then it will be a major improvement.

Absolutely the secondary is more talented, but we saw what bad coaching can do to a defense under Austin. I fear we're seeing that again.

[jj22]

Williams was never any good (Iloka was the better safety, and always set the tone on D if it wasn't for Burfict), neither was our lb's.

Not sure what everyone saw in Bates last season. He was apart of the worse passing and overall defense in Bengal history.

[THE PISTONS]

(09-16-2019, 04:29 PM)jj22 Wrote: Williams was never any good, neither was our lb's.

Not sure what everyone saw in Bates last season. He was apart of the worse passing and overall defense in Bengal history.

The LB's were the main issue last year. The secondary was atleast serviceable.

[*Synric*]

(09-16-2019, 04:26 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Absolutely the secondary is more talented, but we saw what bad coaching can do to a defense under Austin. I fear we're seeing that again.

What we saw was a very aggressive defense taken advantage of with cutbacks and misdirection add in poor tackling and it's a recipe for disaster.

[jj22]

(09-16-2019, 04:29 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The LB's were the main issue last year. The secondary was atleast serviceable.

I remember all the wide open receivers and big passing plays. Neither the LB's or Secondary was able to stop anything. Everyone took part in that. You don't become a historically bad defense like that with a "good" secondary.

Only thing Bates did well was tackle. You couldn't say the same for Williams.

[*ochocincos*]

(09-16-2019, 04:24 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Our LBers were really bad; problem is the Draft wasn't that great in terms of off LB talent.

Yep. There were good options in FA though.
All of the following were all FA pickups this past offseason and have been better than Brown and Vigil (so far):
- CJ Mosley
- Kwon Alexander
- Vontaze Burfict
- Mark Barron
- KJ Wright
- Jordan Hicks
- Jon Bostic
- Zach Brown

I did like the selection of Pratt but he's only received 3 defensive snaps so far. It would have been best if the Bengals not only drafted Pratt but also signed one of the LBs listed above.

[*Synric*]

Anyone have the defensive line pff scores for week 2? I thought Geno had a ok game but the edge defenders struggled big time.

[J24]

(09-16-2019, 04:35 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Yep. There were good options in FA though.
All of the following were all FA pickups this past offseason and have been better than Brown and Vigil (so far):
- CJ Mosley
- Kwon Alexander
- Vontaze Burfict
- Mark Barron
- KJ Wright
- Jordan Hicks
- Jon Bostic
- Zach Brown

I did like the selection of Pratt but he's only received 3 defensive snaps so far. It would have been best if the Bengals not only drafted Pratt but also signed one of the LBs listed above.

Kwon and Alexander were the only two I were really interested in. Mosley isn't a three down player and the others were just Meh.
I would have singed Alexander though instead of Brown, Webb, and Dennard. The Bengals get caught up in depth too much and forget that starters win games.
Especially when you look at what system we are playing with the 4-3 under you need speed at LB and Brown clearly isn't.

[J24]

(09-16-2019, 04:52 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Kwon and Alexander were the only two I were really interested in. Mosley isn't a three down player and the others were just Meh.
I would have singed Alexander though instead of Brown, Webb, and Dennard. The Bengals get caught up in depth too much and forget that starters win games.
Especially when you look at what system we are playing with the 4-3 under you need speed at LB and Brown clearly isn't.

Another thing is we had a bad draft in 18 
It should Been 
1st.Bates 2nd Warner 3rd Brown 3b.) Hubbard you do that.
Missing out on Price and Jefferson is killing us right now 

[J24]

(09-16-2019, 04:29 PM)jj22 Wrote: Williams was never any good (Iloka was the better safety, and always set the tone on D if it wasn't for Burfict), neither was our lb's.

Not sure what everyone saw in Bates last season. He was apart of the worse passing and overall defense in Bengal history.

Really you couldn't see how good Bates was? I'll give you he is over aggressive at times but dude as athlectism and Ball skills that can't be teached. Plus he lead the team in Tacklels last season.

[*psychdoctor*]

(09-16-2019, 04:26 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Absolutely the secondary is more talented, but we saw what bad coaching can do to a defense under Austin. I fear we're seeing that again.

The same players with the same coaches played well week 1 against Seattle. I have to agree with another poster that Kyle Shanahan knew exactly where to hit the bengals in zone.  When Sweet Lou had the players in position, the players did not make tackles.  It was like watching two different teams over the span of two weeks. Players would wait to make the tackle instead of just reacting and making the tackle.  

I also noticed that the players did not show the same discipline in maintaining gap protection.  49ers used slant or "bend" blocking schemes and the D-Line had difficulties protecting the backers, hence, 49ers RB had big game.  

259-25 yards rushing is not a good discrepancy for any team on defense.    

[jj22]

(09-16-2019, 05:00 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Really you couldn't see how good Bates was? I'll give you he is over aggressive at times but dude as athlectism and Ball skills that can't be teached. Plus he lead the team in Tacklels last season.

The worse stat you can see in a Defense is your safety leading them in tackles.

That is not how it should be.

Bates was beat all over the place as was the rest of the secondary last year.

He did lead the team in tackles, but that speaks more about the Defense then it does the safety.

He did flash good range early on. But you didn't see nearly enough of that as they got beat deep, intermediate, and all over the field through the air last season.

[jj22]

(09-16-2019, 05:12 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: The same players with the same coaches played well week 1 against Seattle. I have to agree with another poster that Kyle Shanahan knew exactly where to hit the bengals in zone.  When Sweet Lou had the players in position, the players did not make tackles.  It was like watching two different teams over the span of two weeks. Players would wait to make the tackle instead of just reacting and making the tackle.  

I also noticed that the players did not show the same discipline in maintaining gap protection.  49ers used slant or "bend" blocking schemes and the D-Line had difficulties protecting the backers, hence, 49ers RB had big game.  

259-25 yards rushing is not a good discrepancy for any team on defense.    

The dline played great week one. The secondary....... when Wilson wasn't getting sacked, was giving up big play after big play at will.

That's why we lost. We weren't beat by the run. We were beat through the air.

If Wilson had time, the score would have been a lot more lopsided.

[scorp1974]

Can we please get rid of Vigil?? He does nothing on the field.

[*psychdoctor*]

(09-16-2019, 05:39 PM)jj22 Wrote: The dline played great week one. The secondary....... when Wilson wasn't getting sacked, was giving up big play after big play at will.

That's why we lost. We weren't beat by the run. We were beat through the air.

If Wilson had time, the score would have been a lot more lopsided.

The Bengals allowed just 232 total yards of offense against Seattle and Wilson had one completion over 30 yards.  I did not see the Bengals giving up big plays after big plays via the air against Seattle.  Then again, I experienced shock-and-awe week one.  

The Bengals defense in week 2 against the 49ers did not maintain good gap protection at the line and the backers were not in position.  I did not see many plays where a Bengal player shot through the gap.  Shanahan called an awesome game and Sweet Lou's zone defense felt the pain.  The secondary did not adjust well in zone and several blown assignments were made.  The safeties for the Bengals had a bad day against the 49ers.  

[jj22]

(09-16-2019, 05:59 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: The Bengals allowed just 232 total yards of offense against Seattle and Wilson had one completion over 30 yards.  I did not see the Bengals giving up big plays after big plays via the air against Seattle.  Then again, I experienced shock-and-awe week one.  

The Bengals defense in week 2 against the 49ers did not maintain good gap protection at the line and the backers were not in position.  I did not see many plays where a Bengal player shot through the gap.  Shanahan called an awesome game and Sweet Lou's zone defense felt the pain.  The secondary did not adjust well in zone and several blown assignments were made.  The safeties for the Bengals had a bad day against the 49ers.  

I don't know.

A star was born with their rookie wideout

The long bomb for a TD was 2018 Bengals D like.

Seems like when Wilson could throw he did with ease.

He just couldn't throw with the pressure from the Dline.

[J24]

(09-16-2019, 05:38 PM)jj22 Wrote: The worse stat you can see in a Defense is your safety leading them in tackles.

That is not how it should be.

Bates was beat all over the place as was the rest of the secondary last year.

He did lead the team in tackles, but that speaks more about the Defense then it does the safety.

He did flash good range early on. But you didn't see nearly enough of that as they got beat deep, intermediate, and all over the field through the air last season.

Half your post his made up he wasn't being beaten constantly. What are you talking about?

[THE PISTONS]

We're now 25th in total defense and 29th in scoring defense! With tonights game to go.

Total offense 11th. Scoring offense 21st. Rushing offense...32nd by a far margin. We're half a yard a carry behind the next worst team.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

Better tackling will solve 75% of Cincinnati’s defensive issues. The scheme is definitely a work in progress and Lou Anarumo won’t get fooled by constant misdirection plays again. What worked against Seattle and what failed against San Francisco won’t work against Buffalo. The Bills present a whole new set of problems.

[fredtoast]

(09-16-2019, 04:29 PM)jj22 Wrote: Not sure what everyone saw in Bates last season. He was apart of the worse passing and overall defense in Bengal history.

Yeah, that means Geno Atkins sucks also.



Brilliant logic there, jj22.