Time to face the facts, Zac Taylor is not a good head coach

[RunKijanaRun]

It's way too early to have this conversation. Way too early.

But he can put all his assistants on a dinghy and send them seaworthy.

[*bengalfan74*]

Well, let's face it, he inherited a pretty bad team. A team that since the 8-0 start in 2015 has went 23-39-1. A team that lost 7 of the last 8 games last season and got the hell beat out of them by the Chiefs and Saints.

Andy Dalton has regressed a lot over the last couple seasons, Darnold said he was seeing ghosts, so is Dalton ! The Oline is a joke, we're without AJ, the defense is the worst in the league and the front office did little to nothing to address the glaring holes on this team.

I'm not at all happy about what ZT has done so far but in the same breath he had little to work with.

It's time to blow it up but I highly doubt the powers that be will make the moves needed to fix it.

[reuben.ahmed]

I don't know about "way too early". Plenty of coaches get fired after a longer tenure and going 0-X the next season.

It would be fairly embarrassing to pull a Browns and let coach hue go 1-31 before firing him. This guy needs 2 wins this season or insta-fired.

[RunKijanaRun]

(10-23-2019, 09:25 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: I don't know about "way too early". Plenty of coaches get fired after a longer tenure and going 0-X the next season.

It would be fairly embarrassing to pull a Browns and let coach hue go 1-31 before firing him. This guy needs 2 wins this season or insta-fired.

Can't compare the situations at all. Apples and browns. Hue was somewhat of a known commodity who inherited a better situation than this, at least on paper. Zac has dealt with an inordinate amount of injuries and what healthy players he does still have are now aging and underachieving. 

No coach should have to try to scheme behind this line. It can't be done.

But his support staff and that joke of a draft he just completed - that all falls squarely upon him.

There's some real OJT going on, and we just have to hope he;s learning from it. 

[*psychdoctor*]

Taylor is brighter than most give credit here. Taylor is not going anywhere. He will get his QB of the future in the next two drafts and he will hopefully fix the line.

Taylor is working with a piecemeal roster left over from Marvin Lewis era and needs time to infuse talent that fits his schemes. Starts with both lines.

However, if the Bengals build primarily from the draft than Taylor should demand an NFL leading drafting department of the Bengal organization.

Tobin must go. Replace Tobin with Manning, Romo, or some of the up-comers as GM.

[XenoMorph]

(10-22-2019, 09:43 PM)Trademark Wrote: QBs coach ? Fine, but head coach material or OC material? No...When he was with the Bearcats his offense there was ranked 123rd in the nation. When he took over as OC for Bill Lazor in Miami their offense actually regressed and only scored 17 points a game? Sound familiar? Our offense has been nothing short of pedestrian under Taylor. The team as a whole is atrocious with a bunch of Dolphins castoffs. Face the facts, Taylor isn’t a good head coach. Like the old saying goes be careful what you wish for. The Bengals may of not won a playoff game under Lewis but at least they were competitive most seasons. I don’t think things will get any better if Taylor stays, hope he proves me wrong but we need a leader on that sideline. I also question his leadership abilities with the fact he brought in someone like Turner.

we knew this roster was a mess especially OL and LB...…  Not sure who realistically thought a rookie HC calling his own plays was going to magically transistion this team into a SB contender in year 1.


But you guys let yourselfs get super hyped just cause it wasn't marvin   

[*ochocincos*]

Taylor needs to hand over playcalling duties to someone who has actually been successful with it.
That way, he can focus on becoming a better HC.
Part of being a good HC is selecting a good staff, which he has not done to this point.

With how fast Dalton is getting pressured and lack of ability to feel pressure and move around to extend the play, they need to implement more of a WCO.

[scorp1974]

(10-22-2019, 11:26 PM)BengalFanInNJ Wrote: The Jets are going to crush the Bengals. Not sure why we keep looking at that game was a sure win. 

That why I used the word maybe.....

[Big Boss]

I know our roster is depleted, but if Taylor can't coach these guys to 2+ wins, then he shouldn't be here. 0-16 or 1-15 is frankly inexcusable. If this guy is worth anything as a head coach, he should be able to squeeze something out of these guys. You can say whatever you want about the talent on this team (or lack thereof), but Taylor's play-calling has stuck out like a sore thumb. If the Brown family is not prepared to fire him after one season, then at the very least they need to force him to give up play-calling to a more experienced coordinator. Something HAS to give if this team goes 3-13 or worse.

If they roll into next season with these same coaches in place, with Taylor still calling plays, I ain't watching next year. There is no way the team can sell me on that after this trainwreck season.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-23-2019, 09:55 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: Taylor is brighter than most give credit here.  Taylor is not going anywhere.  He will get his QB of the future in the next two drafts and he will hopefully fix the line.  

Taylor is working with a piecemeal roster left over from Marvin Lewis era and needs time to infuse talent that fits his schemes.  Starts with both lines.

However, if the Bengals build primarily from the draft than Taylor should demand an NFL leading drafting department of the Bengal organization.

Tobin must go.  Replace Tobin with Manning, Romo, or some of the up-comers as GM.

Bright coaches...figure out how to throw the ball to the TE's and RB's. They don't run fake draw/QB sneaks on 4th and 1.

Bright coaches don't have the 123rd ranked offense out of 128 in college and get fired.

Bright coaches don't take over for an OC that gets fired in the NFL and make the offense worse.

Taylor will need a good OC and DC to succeed as a HC. He's definitely not some innovative guy at this point.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-23-2019, 10:02 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: we knew this roster was a mess especially OL and LB...…  Not sure who realistically thought a rookie HC calling his own plays was going to magically transistion this team into a SB contender in year 1.


But you guys let yourselfs get super hyped just cause it wasn't marvin   

Except Taylor evaluated the roster...and the team re-signed Preston Brown. IF the coaching staff thought LB was going to be a huge issue, they should have been like Brown won't fix the issue...bring in someone else.

And you certainly don't play 2 LB sets 80% of the time.

Offensive line is related to injuries atleast somewhat, but on defense it lies solely on the staff and front office.

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-23-2019, 10:40 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Bright coaches...figure out how to throw the ball to the TE's and RB's. They don't run fake draw/QB sneaks on 4th and 1.

Bright coaches don't have the 123rd ranked offense out of 128 in college and get fired.

Bright coaches don't take over for an OC that gets fired in the NFL and make the offense worse.

Taylor will need a good OC and DC to succeed as a HC. He's definitely not some innovative guy at this point.

He played for Tubby at UC correct?  Did Tubby have the ear of the team back then?  Tubby lost that team which affected how they performed.  
Are you talking about the Dolphins stunt?  Didn't he take over mid season there?  

So you judge a coach based on small sample sizes then overgeneralize these performances to future predictions.  Team has underperformed this year because of losing several games over the past 2 years.  

Could Taylor benefit from an OC that calls plays?  Sure.  Can he get a better OL and DC assistants?  Most certainly.  

When Taylor and the Bengals start winning next year, You will need to eat some crow.  If Taylor is fired by end of year 2, then I will eat crow.  Either way, one of us is eating crow...

[THE PISTONS]

(10-23-2019, 01:21 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: He played for Tubby at UC correct?  Did Tubby have the ear of the team back then?  Tubby lost that team which affected how they performed.  
Are you talking about the Dolphins stunt?  Didn't he take over mid season there?  

So you judge a coach based on small sample sizes then overgeneralize these performances to future predictions.  Team has underperformed this year because of losing several games over the past 2 years.  

Could Taylor benefit from an OC that calls plays?  Sure.  Can he get a better OL and DC assistants?  Most certainly.  

When Taylor and the Bengals start winning next year, You will need to eat some crow.  If Taylor is fired by end of year 2, then I will eat crow.  Either way, one of us is eating crow...

We're seeing the same questionable playcalling here. That's my point.

Guys who are offensive geniuses tend to come in and shine right away or shortly after. This is his 3rd crack at it and he's failing again.

Could he improve? Yes. But, he's definitely not some genius that playcalling comes naturally too.

He's struggling to use RB's and TE's in the passing game. The playcalls are very predictable. The plays tip themselves by personnel.

[Bengalfan4life27c]

(10-23-2019, 09:25 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: I don't know about "way too early". Plenty of coaches get fired after a longer tenure and going 0-X the next season.

It would be fairly embarrassing to pull a Browns and let coach hue go 1-31 before firing him. This guy needs 2 wins this season or insta-fired.

If Taylor has a 3 year guarantee he will be here for 3 years. He may get fired at 0 - 40 wouldn'd be at all surprised if MB let him go 0 - 48 he's nearly 15 percent their. we already lowest team in ELO in 538 football analytics. dolphins are 20 + ahead of us

[Circleville Guy]

Nobody answered me to the question of if his past gives an indication that he will be a good coach. Here’s another way to look at it and I’m not asking because of one of these things but because of the combination of them. Is it harder to buy into a guy that has never been a head coach, has never played a snap in an NFL game and that is basically the same age as a few of the players? He’s been a QB coach.. He played QB in College so that makes sense. What are the indicators that say that this guy really should make a good NFL Head Coach? I don’t see any. If he struggles all year, why throw away more years when there’s no indication that he will be good in the first place?

[Bengalfan4life27c]

(10-23-2019, 01:46 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: Nobody answered me to the question of if his past gives an indication that he will be a good coach. Here’s another way to look at it and I’m not asking because of one of these things but because of the combination of them. Is it harder to buy into a guy that has never been a head coach, has never played a snap in an NFL game and that is basically the same age as a few of the players? He’s been a QB coach.. He played QB in College so that makes sense. What are the indicators that say that this guy really should make a good NFL Head Coach? I don’t see any. If he struggles all year, why throw away more years when there’s no indication that he will be good in the first place?

I could tell especially after the Steelers game he is clueless and it's only gotten worse every week since then. He seems incapable of adjustments.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-23-2019, 01:46 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: Nobody answered me to the question of if his past gives an indication that he will be a good coach. Here’s another way to look at it and I’m not asking because of one of these things but because of the combination of them. Is it harder to buy into a guy that has never been a head coach, has never played a snap in an NFL game and that is basically the same age as a few of the players? He’s been a QB coach.. He played QB in College so that makes sense. What are the indicators that say that this guy really should make a good NFL Head Coach? I don’t see any. If he struggles all year, why throw away more years when there’s no indication that he will be good in the first place?

Yes - People explain away his past failures as a coach and are like 'He was in a tough situation. Or they had no talent.'

There's very little success to point to that makes you say...he'll achieve that.

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2019, 01:46 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote:  What are the indicators that say that this guy really should make a good NFL Head Coach? I don’t see any. If he struggles all year, why throw away more years when there’s no indication that he will be good in the first place?

The NFL is an interconnected system.  Coaches and GMs know other coaches and GMs all around the league.  Most coaches have worked with multiple staffs on multiple teams.

So when a team is looking for a coach they rely a lot on the suggestions of other guys around the league who they know (The same thing happens in a lot of other industries).  Obviously some people who had worked with Taylor saw HC potential in him.  I'm pretty sure their was talk of him being an "up and comer" before the Bengals interviewed him.

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2019, 01:56 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yes - People explain away his past failures as a coach and are like 'He was in a tough situation. Or they had no talent.'

There's very little success to point to that makes you say...he'll achieve that.

And you discount his work with the Rams with "That was someone else's work".

The fact is that we as fans know very little about the references Taylor had that made him an attractive candidate.

He hasn't shown me much so far, but he also has been given a trainwreck of a team.

[Bengalfan4life27c]

(10-23-2019, 02:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: And you discount his work with the Rams with "That was someone else's work".

The fact is that we as fans know very little about the references Taylor had that made him an attractive candidate.

He hasn't shown me much so far, but he also has been given a trainwreck of a team.

I hated Marvin but I believe we would be at least 2-5 with Marvin. An average coach could have won the Jaguars game last week or the Cardinal game or the Bills game or the Seahawks game. Heck even the Raven game was winnable with a quality head coach.