Small market free agency

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 03:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I don't know if I've ever seen a less motivational person than Mike Brown.

Well I would bet that if MB owned Kraft foods he would probably be more likely to spend more on his toy, the Bengals. 

[higgy100]

(11-06-2019, 12:29 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: The NFL is unfair to small market teams. Big market teams get FAs easier and cheaper than small market teams because they know they have a better chance of winning a championship. I believe that the NFL needs to move the free agent signing period until after the draft. This way the weaker teams could see after the draft what exactly their needs were . This would keep the teams who know how to manipulate the salary cap from taking advantage of those who don't. Being able to pay players when they no longer on the team defeats the whole point of the salary cap.

Don't blame a big city itself for any unfairness to the NFL. Sure, a big-time city with a mass market can lure a good player with endorsements, etc. but it's as fair as it gets.

Sometimes the actual organization and it's leadership need to stop acting small...

[Catmandude123]

We definitely are not playing on a level playing field. We have the third lowest average price per seat at $77 per seat(that MB should be charging what the Chargers do $162). Short of MB selling the franchise to a filthy rich guy things don't look any better for the foreseeable future.

[*bengalfan74*]

(11-06-2019, 03:27 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Ultimately, it comes down to winning.
For things outside of winning, how nice are the facilities? What's the atmosphere of the city? What's the weather like? What's the cost of living? 

This

(11-06-2019, 03:32 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Market is determined by wins, championships and social interest, which are correlated.  Patriots were nobody until the alliance of Brady and BB.  Now they are iconic.  Cowboys are said to be American's team but not really.  Browns, as bad as they are for years have a big following because Brown fans are delusional and somewhat of a cult mentality.  Some would consider Browns as mid-large following.

And this

Getting bounced in the first round mostly looking like you didn't belong counts for basically nothing. 

[*bengalfan74*]

(11-06-2019, 03:48 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Browns have the fan base because of all the championships before the Super Bowl era.
And even though their basketball and baseball teams are (far) better than their football team, Cleveland has always been predominantly a football town.
Last, there are a decent number of fans in Ohio who root for the Browns but live closer to Cincinnati because Cincinnati didn't have a team when they (or their family) got into football.

Yep

When I was a much younger man still in my early 20's a bunch of the then "older guys" I hung out with, late 20's 30's were Browns fans because the Bengals didn't exist yet. Their Dads, uncles and so on were Browns fans. 

[muskiesfan]

Here's where I see all of this fall apart.

In 2018, the NFL teams shared $8.78 billion. That means the each NFL team received a check for $274.3 million. Since that would come after the season, we'll use 2019 numbers to deduct from that. The salary cap for 2019 is $188.2 million. The Bengals rolled over $7.4 million from 2018, so their adjusted salary cap is $196.1 million. The Bengals have spent $181.9 million of that money this season; that includes contracts, IR money, Reserve/PUP money, dead cap, and the Practice Squad. So the Bengals still have $14.1 million in available 2019 cap space.

So Mike Brown was given $274.3 million from the NFL. Strictly on cap he spent $181.9 million which leaves $92.3 million left over. After paying the entire coaching staff, the 2 scouts, the front office, and whatever people that have to be paid I'm saying he probably has some $70 million or so left over. Then he pays shareholders, which I believe he has bought up all of the share so that money goes to him and his family. I'll be generous and say he has $40 million left over after that. I'll be honest that I have no idea what shareholders get and I don't feel like looking up the other salaries, so we can knock my laziness and call it $30 million left over if that makes everyone happy.

So for being a small market team, Mike Brown gets his entire salary cap paid for by the League as well as his coaching staff, employees, and shareholders with money left over. None of these numbers include what he gets to keep from ticket sales, concessions, parking, and everything else that does not have to go into revenue sharing. Mike Brown keeps the financial numbers behind lock and key, so we'll never truly know how much he's profiting each season. Mike Brown also has a sweetheart stadium deal, so his cost of upkeep and maintenance to the stadium or nothing compared to the rest of the League.

The only that that hurts this team in free agency is Mike Brown. Flying players coach, taking them and/or their agents to Wendy's, allowing Troy to run his fat ***** mouth, knowing jack shit about football but remaining and paying himself to be the GM, and so on negatively impact free agency much more than money or location.

This turned out incredibly longer than I intended and I apologize to everyone who takes the time to read it. My entire point is Mike Brown makes millions each year and being a "small market" is not the issue when it comes to the Bengals and free agency .

[SunsetBengal]

Small market and "small time" are two entirely different ideals.

[kevin]

(11-06-2019, 12:29 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: The NFL is unfair to small market teams. Big market teams get FAs easier and cheaper than small market teams because they know they have a better chance of winning a championship. I believe that the NFL needs to move the free agent signing period until after the draft. This way the weaker teams could see after the draft what exactly their needs were . This would keep the teams who know how to manipulate the salary cap from taking advantage of those who don't. Being able to pay players when they no longer on the team defeats the whole point of the salary cap.

I'm Going To STOP You Right There...... The Reds in MLB are small market compared to Yankees and others......However TV Revenue Sharing and the Draft Structure in The NFL is Parity.   We can NOT claim SMALL MARKET as an excuse for Mike Brown as we do for Reds.   The Bengals make as much money as anybody per TV Revenue Sharing. Plus there is Salary Cap unlike MLB.    The NFL is set up for no owner to be this bad over the last 30 years.   

If you were talking Reds, I would agree and say dump Vottos fat salary in Money Ball.    Bengals in NFL is NOT the same.  The problem with The Bengals is NOT the NFL.  The problem with the Bengals is the Front Office.  

However I just started a thread on how I HOPE they make a Plan Of Attack for 2020's and Get After It.   The NFL IS set up for all teams including Bengals to turn things around, BUT this front office has to want to.  They Have To Want To. 

I will say Bengals have some big salary cap eaters who The Window Of Opportunity in 2011 has CLOSED ON. Dump them for much needed rebuilding draft picks and try to Get At It in 2020's Decade. There is nothing stopping them, in spite of your view of NFL that I disagree with. Remember BENGALS are ONLY team to not win play-off game in 30 years and also have most 0-4 starts. Not the other teams. ONLY THE BENGALS....ONLY. ..It's not the NFL, poor excuse, It is a Bengals Front Office Issue. They have no plan of attack, unlike Paul Brown. The good teams have a plan, a system that rarely changes. The Bengals need to get a Plan Of Attack and GO AT IT.

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 08:05 PM)kevin Wrote: I'm Going To STOP You Right There...... The Reds in MLB are small market compared to Yankees and others......However TV Revenue Sharing and the Draft Structure in The NFL is Parity.   We can NOT claim SMALL MARKET as an excuse for Mike Brown as we do for Reds.   The Bengals make as much money as anybody per TV Revenue Sharing. Plus there is Salary Cap unlike MLB.    The NFL is set up for no owner to be this bad over the last 30 years.   

If you were talking Reds, I would agree and say dump Vottos fat salary in Money Ball.    Bengals in NFL is NOT the same.  The problem with The Bengals is NOT the NFL.  The problem with the Bengals is the Front Office.  

However I just started a thread on how I HOPE they make a Plan Of Attack for 2020's and Get After It.   The NFL IS set up for all teams including Bengals to turn things around, BUT this front office has to want to.  They Have To Want To. 

I will say Bengals have some big salary cap eaters who The Window Of Opportunity in 2011 has CLOSED ON.   Dump them for much needed rebuilding draft picks and try to Get At It in 2020's Decade. There is nothing stopping them, in spite of your view of NFL that I disagree with.   Remember BENGALS are ONLY team to not win play-off game in 30 years and also have most 0-4 starts.   Not the other teams. ONLY THE BENGALS....ONLY.  ..It's not the NFL, poor excuse, It is a Bengals Front Office Issue.   They have no plan of attack, unlike Paul Brown.  The good teams have a plan, a system that rarely changes.  The Bengals need to get a Plan Of Attack and GO AT IT.

I will remind you that the Bengals have been to two super bowls and there is more than ONE ONLY ONE who haven't. Cleveland, Jacksonville, Detroit and Houston(Texans). We may be bad but don't try to say were are an exclusive club.

[WhodeyRay]

If I only had 10 years if im lucky to get my money to last the rest of my life i would want to be in a small market. A 400,000 home here would be 4 million in NY or LA. Groceries are half the price and taxes you pay on those items are so much less. Small markets could cut your expenses in half. What do I know though, I don't wear $200,000 watches or chains that are made of 10lbs of gold while driving a depreciating asset that costs as much as a house.

[t3r3e3]

(11-06-2019, 12:29 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: The NFL is unfair to small market teams. Big market teams get FAs easier and cheaper than small market teams because they know they have a better chance of winning a championship. I believe that the NFL needs to move the free agent signing period until after the draft. This way the weaker teams could see after the draft what exactly their needs were . This would keep the teams who know how to manipulate the salary cap from taking advantage of those who don't. Being able to pay players when they no longer on the team defeats the whole point of the salary cap.

The smallest market team in the NFL (The Packers) have no problem signing targeted FA’s, winning Playoff games, and winning Super Bowls. This is not a small market problem, it’s a Mike Brown is a cheap bastard and the players know it problem...

[t3r3e3]

(11-06-2019, 04:56 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: We definitely are not playing on a level playing field. We have the third lowest average price per seat at $77 per seat(that MB should be charging what the Chargers do $162). Short of MB selling the franchise to a filthy rich guy things don't look any better for the foreseeable future.

The Chargers are playing in a bandbox in the LA market. Mike could make the tickets $20 a pop, but with his inept management and inferior product he still would not sell out.

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 08:50 PM)WhodeyRay Wrote: If I only had 10 years if im lucky to get my money to last the rest of my life i would want to be in a small market. A 400,000 home here would be 4 million in NY or LA. Groceries are half the price and taxes you pay on those items are so much less. Small markets could cut your expenses in half. What do I know though, I don't wear $200,000 watches or chains that are made of 10lbs of gold while driving a depreciating asset that costs as much as a house.

Sounds like you need to knuckle down a little bit and apply yourself.

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 08:58 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: The smallest market team in the NFL (The Packers) have no problem signing targeted FA’s, winning Playoff games, and winning Super Bowls.  This is not a small market problem, it’s a Mike Brown is a cheap bastard and the players know it problem...

They have a history of great QBs. You think they are the same with Dalton. 

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 07:04 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: Here's where I see all of this fall apart.

In 2018, the NFL teams shared $8.78 billion. That means the each NFL team received a check for $274.3 million. Since that would come after the season, we'll use 2019 numbers to deduct from that. The salary cap for 2019 is $188.2 million. The Bengals rolled over $7.4 million from 2018, so their adjusted salary cap is $196.1 million. The Bengals have spent $181.9 million of that money this season; that includes contracts, IR money, Reserve/PUP money, dead cap, and the Practice Squad. So the Bengals still have $14.1 million in available 2019 cap space.

So Mike Brown was given $274.3 million from the NFL. Strictly on cap he spent $181.9 million which leaves $92.3 million left over. After paying the entire coaching staff, the 2 scouts, the front office, and whatever people that have to be paid I'm saying he probably has some $70 million or so left over. Then he pays shareholders, which I believe he has bought up all of the share so that money goes to him and his family. I'll be generous and say he has $40 million left over after that. I'll be honest that I have no idea what shareholders get and I don't feel like looking up the other salaries, so we can knock my laziness and call it $30 million left over if that makes everyone happy.

So for being a small market team, Mike Brown gets his entire salary cap paid for by the League as well as his coaching staff, employees, and shareholders with money left over. None of these numbers include what he gets to keep from ticket sales, concessions, parking, and everything else that does not have to go into revenue sharing. Mike Brown keeps the financial numbers behind lock and key, so we'll never truly know how much he's profiting each season. Mike Brown also has a sweetheart stadium deal, so his cost of upkeep and maintenance to the stadium or nothing compared to the rest of the League.

The only that that hurts this team in free agency is Mike Brown. Flying players coach, taking them and/or their agents to Wendy's, allowing Troy to run his fat ***** mouth, knowing jack shit about football but remaining and paying himself to be the GM, and so on negatively impact free agency much more than money or location.

This turned out incredibly longer than I intended and I apologize to everyone who takes the time to read it. My entire point is Mike Brown makes millions each year and being a "small market" is not the issue when it comes to the Bengals and free agency .

The top eight teams make 3mil per game more than the Bengals even more if you figure they don't always sell out. That is an average of 24 mil over a whole season. You can say what you want but the teams don't have the same amount to spend .

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 08:58 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: The smallest market team in the NFL (The Packers) have no problem signing targeted FA’s, winning Playoff games, and winning Super Bowls.  This is not a small market problem, it’s a Mike Brown is a cheap bastard and the players know it problem...

Packers are owned by the fans. We could do the same. Get out your check book . We can do this.

[t3r3e3]

(11-06-2019, 09:13 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: They have a history of great QBs. You think they are the same with Dalton. 

In the last 25 years they have a history of good-excellent GM’s, good scouting, and solid coaching. The QB’s don’t show up without the first two, because neither HoF QB was a unanimous Top 5 draftee. The team does not win the Super Bowls without the QB’s and the coaching. The Pack are light years ahead of the Bengals with respect to the FO and scouting.

[*Synric*]

(11-06-2019, 03:50 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Really? I never would have thought someone would go to a team because they cared about how many jerseys they would sell. Learn something new every day I guess.

Players get almost half the profit from each Jersey sale. A big name guy going to a big market will make a decent amount from jersey sales.

Also a larger market team provides more commercial opportunities (Advertising, Promotions etc.).

[HarleyDog]

(11-06-2019, 10:47 PM)Synric Wrote: Players get almost half the profit from each Jersey sale. A big name guy going to a big market will make a decent amount from jersey sales.

Also a larger market team provides more commercial opportunities (Advertising, Promotions etc.).

Condom sales go up no matter where I go and I don't even know why? Makes sense. Good post. 

[Catmandude123]

(11-06-2019, 10:30 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: In the last 25 years they have a history of good-excellent GM’s, good scouting, and solid coaching.  The QB’s don’t show up without the first two, because neither HoF QB was a unanimous Top 5 draftee.  The team does not win the Super Bowls without the QB’s and the coaching.  The Pack are light years ahead of the Bengals with respect to the FO and scouting.

I guess you are ignoring Ringo's brother Bart Starr.