A Sleeping Giant

[TheUberHuber]

I like the optimism, but where the heck do you get excellent front 7 from?? We have a few good lineman and our linebackers are absolutely terrible.. I would not even remotely call that excellent.

[fortyyearfan]

(12-30-2019, 10:51 AM)kevin Wrote: and better players.  They don't have the players to execute plays no matter who the coaches are.  Oh, they beat the 6-10 Browns.  If they had played a play-off team they would have got their teeth kicked.   The 2-14 record is for real and 2018 was pretty awful also. 

The Offensive Line is Awful and The Defense is Awful.   I know people get tired of hearing it because it has been this way the last 3 years.  They don't have the Blocking or Tackling to win games, no matter if they draft Burrow.  By all means, draft Burrow, but address the O Line and Defense also.  This team still needs a major rebuild.  I'm sorry Price stinks and Williams injured.  After Ogbuhei and Fisher we needed help, not more top pick disasters.  The LT from Bills has been a bust also.  Of course the O Line Stinks.

We Need New Players.  2-14 is no illusion. ...On Defense, worst Run Defense in NFL.   No Blocking.  No Tackling. No Wins.

Somebody said maybe 5-11 next season.  OH BOY !!!....What a Sleeping Giant....the bar has been lowered from Play-Off wins to 5 Wins.   I'm not buying into any more NEW DEY.   Go out and win some games in September and October and I'll believe it when I see it.

On defense,most of the secondary needs to be gone and gone,Keep Shawn Williams and maybe number 30 and Darius Phillips,cut the rest.I am not sure of the D-line a lot of players are just not good enough.On Offense, the O-line needs a lot of work,we need dominate linemen,you tell me,Linebackers,please cut Virgil number 59 and get Praitt some help.And I am very displease with John Ross,another 1st rounder that is just awlful on the field,his speed is not what it was at the combine and he has horrible hands and is just awlful.He either dropped or missed 6 passes thrown to him and if he had caught those we would have scored 46 points. That is how much offense he left on the field,You cannot have that.Period. I know I left out some that need to go and oh yes B.W.Webb is just horrible,cut him tomorrow.

[Shake n Blake]

I guess we're all vulnerable to the effects of the dead cat bounce.

Buy your season tickets while you still can!

[SadFaceBengal15]

(12-30-2019, 09:11 AM)Devils Advocate Wrote: Admittedly, I’m always overly optimistic about every season, but this feels different to me. The biggest question mark being the coaching, however I believe they will and should all return.

I’m curious to know how the defense ranked over the second half of the season or last 3rd of the season because they looked infinitely better than they did in the first half, but I don’t know the numbers.

I think we have real weapons at all the offensive skill positions with a very underrated CJ Uzomah and underused Eifert. I believe Auden Tate will have a breakout year, given the assumed new QB will trust him and not rely too heavily on other (established) receivers.

I think there’s question marks along the Oline, but they’re not as puzzling as the narrative indicates. I’d like to see an upgrade or two, but I think these cast-offs have enough potential to allow most plays to develop.

I’ve always been a fan of and defended Andy. But sometimes it is just the QB and as much as I like Andy, I’m hoping it was just him because that means all the other pieces are good enough for the next QB.

I believe we have an excellent front 7 on defense. I’m a 4-3 guy, mainly because I’m most familiar with it because of this team, however I think they have all the pieces to lean heavily on a 3-4 front as this gets all of their best players on the field at the same time. It would awesome to land a an established play maker at LBer because he’d make this group fierce but I don’t think it’s necessary. I like that kid from Cleveland that hasn’t been re signed yet. I think Evans, Lawson, Pratt and Vigil/Hubbard (I know I know) have the potential to be stout and could use some help but I think the team should focus on a ball hawking super stud Safety (if one’s available). I think this is the missing piece on defense a la Minka Fitzpatrick.

I think Darious Phillips showed enough (4 picks is the 3rd highest) that cutting Dre is worth the risk and savings.

I know people think this team is far-away, but I disagree. Hopefully Zac makes the leap in his second season.

I’m with cutting Dre for philips but if u do that imo u have to resign Dennard

[BengalChris]

(12-30-2019, 09:11 AM)Devils Advocate Wrote: Admittedly, I’m always overly optimistic about every season, but this feels different to me. The biggest question mark being the coaching, however I believe they will and should all return.

I’m curious to know how the defense ranked over the second half of the season or last 3rd of the season because they looked infinitely better than they did in the first half, but I don’t know the numbers.

I think we have real weapons at all the offensive skill positions with a very underrated CJ Uzomah and underused Eifert. I believe Auden Tate will have a breakout year, given the assumed new QB will trust him and not rely too heavily on other (established) receivers.

I think there’s question marks along the Oline, but they’re not as puzzling as the narrative indicates. I’d like to see an upgrade or two, but I think these cast-offs have enough potential to allow most plays to develop.

I’ve always been a fan of and defended Andy. But sometimes it is just the QB and as much as I like Andy, I’m hoping it was just him because that means all the other pieces are good enough for the next QB.

I believe we have an excellent front 7 on defense. I’m a 4-3 guy, mainly because I’m most familiar with it because of this team, however I think they have all the pieces to lean heavily on a 3-4 front as this gets all of their best players on the field at the same time. It would awesome to land a an established play maker at LBer because he’d make this group fierce but I don’t think it’s necessary. I like that kid from Cleveland that hasn’t been re signed yet. I think Evans, Lawson, Pratt and Vigil/Hubbard (I know I know) have the potential to be stout and could use some help but I think the team should focus on a ball hawking super stud Safety (if one’s available). I think this is the missing piece on defense a la Minka Fitzpatrick.

I think Darious Phillips showed enough (4 picks is the 3rd highest) that cutting Dre is worth the risk and savings.

I know people think this team is far-away, but I disagree. Hopefully Zac makes the leap in his second season.

The defense, over the past 6 weeks only went up against 1 winning team (New England). It got the snot kicked out of by Miami, a team that was winless half way through the season and which traded away its best players.

Yes, the defense looked better, but the team decided to run Mixon more as well, which shortens the possessions of the other team.

You have to take the season as a whole to grade the team, and it grades out at the bottom of the NFL, as indicated by its record.

There's no magic goodness from this season that's going to spring up to make it all good.

The LBers aren't good, as indicated by their lack of tackles and the secondary having to cover up for this. Dunlap plays great against OTs he can beat, but he does disappear too often. To go to a 3-4 they'd need 3 new LBers or maybe Hubbard would be an outside LB. Dunlap is a 4-3 DE all the way. Atkins would be a DE in a 3-4 scheme.

I'm not saying everything is hopeless and bad, but when you are dead last, a great deal needs fixing in the off-season. They went backwards this year, but the team doesn't seem to see it, even though basically everyone else does.

 

[*Awful Llama*]

C'mon, guys! What's with all the negativity? We pushed the Clowns around yesterday. True, we lost to the Pats two weeks ago, but we also beat the Jets back on December 1. Add that all up and what have you got? A .667 win percentage at home during the last month. Meaning, we OWNED the month of December at home! Just like championship-caliber teams do! Now, we just gotta own the other three months at home. And, half the months on the road. Easy peasy!

Today, the Clowns. Tomorrow, the world!

[*jason*]

(12-30-2019, 08:45 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: C'mon, guys! What's with all the negativity? We pushed the Clowns around yesterday. True, we lost to the Pats two weeks ago, but we also beat the Jets back on December 1. Add that all up and what have you got? A .667 win percentage at home during the last month. Meaning, we OWNED the month of December at home! Just like championship-caliber teams do! Now, we just gotta own the other three months at home. And, half the months on the road. Easy peasy!

Today, the Clowns. Tomorrow, the world!

#finishstrong

#deadcatbounce

[Catmandude123]

(12-30-2019, 03:38 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Bingo !

I've argued this in many threads going back to the mother ship.

Many people get way to geeked up when we beat 4-12 teams. "Oh look the D is improving" even though we just played the 30th ranked offense or whatever.

"See the running game is fixed" But we just played the two worst run D's in the league. "Look at our QB go, he's got it back" again we just played two of the worst D's in the NFL against pass.

But if you go back and look at our record against the upper half of the NFL we're getting our butts handed to us way more often than not.

You mean like Seattle who beat us by one point? Gotcha!!

[Shake n Blake]

(12-30-2019, 08:01 PM)BengalChris Wrote: The defense, over the past 6 weeks only went up against 1 winning team (New England). It got the snot kicked out of by Miami, a team that was winless half way through the season and which traded away its best players.

Yes, the defense looked better, but the team decided to run Mixon more as well, which shortens the possessions of the other team.

You have to take the season as a whole to grade the team, and it grades out at the bottom of the NFL, as indicated by its record.

There's no magic goodness from this season that's going to spring up to make it all good.

The LBers aren't good, as indicated by their lack of tackles and the secondary having to cover up for this. Dunlap plays great against OTs he can beat, but he does disappear too often. To go to a 3-4 they'd need 3 new LBers or maybe Hubbard would be an outside LB. Dunlap is a 4-3 DE all the way. Atkins would be a DE in a 3-4 scheme.

I'm not saying everything is hopeless and bad, but when you are dead last, a great deal needs fixing in the off-season. They went backwards this year, but the team doesn't seem to see it, even though basically everyone else does.

 

Points allowed over the last 4 weeks:

27
34
38
23

Guess I'm not seeing the massive improvement, either. The defense had a good 3 week stretch against the Raiders, Jets and a decimated Steelers team. Other than that, we were pretty gross all year. No other games where we allowed less than 21 points.

[Catmandude123]

(12-30-2019, 02:48 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Because they played the Ravens and the Steelers, who both beat them twice.

Without the Bengals, the Ravens were 12-2, and the Steelers were 6-8. MATH!

- - - - - -

There's being optimistic, and then there's ignoring reality. This thread is full of the latter.

I don't mind some optimism, but ignoring the reality and calling this team a "sleeping giant" is how we passively end up with 4 more years of Zac Taylor calling 4th and short QB runs out of the shotgun, Andrew Billings dropping back into coverage, while Bobby Hart and Preston Brown get 3 year deals in FA, and draft Drew Sample in the 2nd round.

Where did you go to school ? I'm old but if the Bengals played eight games in the first half of the season and none of their opponents that half of the season subtracted the Bengals record just how in the wahoo does that Make a ten game difference? In the second half they would only subtract six games instead of seven. Numbers mean something . Don't abuse them or you will get called out.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-30-2019, 09:11 AM)Devils Advocate Wrote: Admittedly, I’m always overly optimistic about every season, but this feels different to me. The biggest question mark being the coaching, however I believe they will and should all return.

I’m curious to know how the defense ranked over the second half of the season or last 3rd of the season because they looked infinitely better than they did in the first half, but I don’t know the numbers.

I think we have real weapons at all the offensive skill positions with a very underrated CJ Uzomah and underused Eifert. I believe Auden Tate will have a breakout year, given the assumed new QB will trust him and not rely too heavily on other (established) receivers.

I think there’s question marks along the Oline, but they’re not as puzzling as the narrative indicates. I’d like to see an upgrade or two, but I think these cast-offs have enough potential to allow most plays to develop.

I’ve always been a fan of and defended Andy. But sometimes it is just the QB and as much as I like Andy, I’m hoping it was just him because that means all the other pieces are good enough for the next QB.

I believe we have an excellent front 7 on defense. I’m a 4-3 guy, mainly because I’m most familiar with it because of this team, however I think they have all the pieces to lean heavily on a 3-4 front as this gets all of their best players on the field at the same time. It would awesome to land a an established play maker at LBer because he’d make this group fierce but I don’t think it’s necessary. I like that kid from Cleveland that hasn’t been re signed yet. I think Evans, Lawson, Pratt and Vigil/Hubbard (I know I know) have the potential to be stout and could use some help but I think the team should focus on a ball hawking super stud Safety (if one’s available). I think this is the missing piece on defense a la Minka Fitzpatrick.

I think Darious Phillips showed enough (4 picks is the 3rd highest) that cutting Dre is worth the risk and savings.

I know people think this team is far-away, but I disagree. Hopefully Zac makes the leap in his second season.

Well, need to use Free Agency to its potential and add a RT, and decent covering and tackling LB then add Joe Burrow.

If we do this and Zac Taylor grows as a HC you could be right and it is the way I have to think as well.

Need a new DC and just have Zac coach and not be the play caller is also something that must happen.

New DC, OC, RT, LB'ers (have to have a lot of them in a 3-4), Burrow and a great Draft.

Lot of needs there, but it can happen.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-30-2019, 07:17 PM)TheUberHuber Wrote: I like the optimism, but where the heck do you get excellent front 7 from?? We have a few good lineman and our linebackers are absolutely terrible.. I would not even remotely call that excellent.

Yeah LB's are the worst in the league at going from sideline to sideline besides Pratt.

Need to add at least 3 good ones to go to a 3-4 and a new DC and LB coach.

Need this optimism though, been a hard year.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-30-2019, 07:45 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I guess we're all vulnerable to the effects of the dead cat bounce.  

Buy your season tickets while you still can!  

1 game winning streaks to end the year mesmerize people.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-30-2019, 07:46 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: I’m with cutting Dre for philips but if u do that imo u have to resign Dennard

Cutting guys to gain cap space is generally a faulty premise with the Bengals as they likely wouldnt add a guy of Kirkpatricks caliber.

[Shake n Blake]

(12-30-2019, 11:54 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: 1 game winning streaks to end the year mesmerize people.

People just want to be positive about the team. I get it, but I just can't buy into another dead cat bounce = we'll get 'em next season.

We need a lot of moves from a motivated front office. When I see that, you'll get my optimism.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-30-2019, 11:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: People just want to be positive about the team. I get it, but I just can't buy into another dead cat bounce = we'll get 'em next season.

We need a lot of moves from a motivated front office. When I see that, you'll get my optimism.

This was a minimal bounce.

I think people think with Burrow that hes going to hit the ground running and putting up video game numbers Day 1. Hes going to need coached...and NFL speed is faster and defenses trickier.

He has a ton of potential, but coaching matters.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-30-2019, 11:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: People just want to be positive about the team. I get it, but I just can't buy into another dead cat bounce = we'll get 'em next season.

We need a lot of moves from a motivated front office. When I see that, you'll get my optimism.

(12-31-2019, 12:05 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: This was a minimal bounce.

I think people think with Burrow that hes going to hit the ground running and putting up video game numbers Day 1. Hes going to need coached...and NFL speed is faster and defenses trickier.

He has a ton of potential, but coaching matters.

Completely agree, just trying to be optimistic is all. That is probably the best QB in College I have ever watched play this 
season, so that sure does help a lot for me. But damn, the coaching this season besides Turner and Eason has been pretty
damn terrible. Not easy for any talent to elevate, even if it is Joe frickin' Burrow.

[Shake n Blake]

(12-31-2019, 12:09 AM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Completely agree, just trying to be optimistic is all. That is probably the best QB in College I have ever watched play this 
season, so that sure does help a lot for me. But damn, the coaching this season besides Turner and Eason has been pretty
damn terrible. Not easy for any talent to elevate, even if it is Joe frickin' Burrow.

Burrow looks like a fantastic prospect and I'm thrilled to get him. I just worry the Bengals are going to ruin him. Palmer was amazing at USC in 2002. Had a similar rise like Burrow. We all saw what happened.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-31-2019, 12:16 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Burrow looks like a fantastic prospect and I'm thrilled to get him. I just worry the Bengals are going to ruin him. Palmer was amazing at USC in 2002. Had a similar rise like Burrow. We all saw what happened.

And Lewis was a better and more experienced coach.

Burrow needed great coaching to make this ride in college.

[BengalChris]

(12-30-2019, 11:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: People just want to be positive about the team. I get it, but I just can't buy into another dead cat bounce = we'll get 'em next season.

We need a lot of moves from a motivated front office. When I see that, you'll get my optimism.

Yeah, this front office is about as ho-hum as they come. Waiver wire pickups just aren't going to inspire me.

LBer and OL continue to be sore points despite numerous draft picks being spent on them, and with AJ likely gone there's another hole to fill with no one the roster ready to step up. Maybe they'll re-sign Green, but it just seems more likely that someone else with more to offer is going to step up and take AJ.