Why not keep Andy as a backup?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-26-2020, 11:59 PM)McC Wrote: Right.  They want to do it this year, which is why Dalton's salary has to go.  And Mixon needs to do it this year.  But he also can't think of McCaffrey as a target number.

Yep, Mixon just wants to be paid what he deserves, he isn't a selfish guy from what I have seen and he should know that 
he is not scoring TD's on even close to a pace of McCaffery. TD's mean money.

(04-27-2020, 12:01 AM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: My thoughts exactly. They want to re-sign Mixon—as they should.

Cut or trade Andy. Sign a vet backup. Get on with life. Surround Burrow with as much talent as we can.

On the same page as usual Bengalstripes18.

[JSR18]

I'll ask again, because the 1st time it apparently got missed.
What is it that Joe Burrow is lacking in that you think Dalton will be able to help with??

[TecmoBengals]

(04-27-2020, 12:41 AM)JSR18 Wrote:  I'll ask again, because the 1st time it apparently got missed.
                What is it that Joe Burrow is lacking in that you think Dalton will be able to help with??

Right on dude, I totally agree.  Sure, when professionals interact, they can learn and learn from each other, but Burrow isn't a 20 to 21 year old junior entering the NFL who hasn't already faced adversity.

He's 23 and just served as a team leader during a championship run.  He was playing at a big time program and handled himself like a professional throughout it all.  Hell, the dude has a master's degree.  He's just entering the league at a different place in his life than other QBs and I think that will serve him well with or without a Dalton type as his backup.

[Brownshoe]

Why are people acting like Dalton wouldn't be able to help Burrow become a better QB? This is insane. I'm happy that we have Burrow as our new QB, and I'm rooting for him to win and win more than Dalton ever has. No matter how big of a Dalton hater you are, you have to agree that Dalton is a smart and studious QB. He has a lot of experience playing actual NFL defenses and what things to look for. He as experience changing OCs multiple times and know's his X's and O's. To act like there isn't anything that Dalton couldn't help Burrow with is just silly to me.

[BURROWorBUST]

For me it's always been about team chemistry. I'm not going to bash Andy. He's always done his best to help us win games. He's just not what we need moving forward. It's very telling that other teams haven't been beating down the door to sign him.

I know he's a great guy, and probably would stick around another year and mentor Joe to the best of his ability. But he couldn't help but wonder why the organization never did so much in free agency to help him be successful in the same way they're doing for Burrow. How could he not be a little sour? Plus, they benched him on his birthday.

I'd prefer that he continue his career in a different building. To quote Bob Segar: "Turn the Page."

[BURROWorBUST]

(04-27-2020, 12:49 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Right on dude, I totally agree.  Sure, when professionals interact, they can learn and learn from each other, but Burrow isn't a 20 to 21 year old junior entering the NFL who hasn't already faced adversity.

He's 23 and just served as a team leader during a championship run.  He was playing at a big time program and handled himself like a professional throughout it all.  Hell, the dude has a master's degree.  He's just entering the league at a different place in his life than other QBs and I think that will serve him well with or without a Dalton type as his backup.

We have a QB coach and a head coach who used to be a QB coach. I think they know how to teach Burrow what they need from him and how to run this offense. 

Back to my previous post. Andy's human. He has an ego. He used to be the starter. This was his team. It's not anymore. We don't want people in the locker room who aren't happy to be there.

I'm not saying Andy's a bad guy. Not at all. But he's only human. I think the Bengals are trying to help him preserve his dignity and trade him someplace where he'd have a chance to start. 

[Benton]

(04-26-2020, 11:27 PM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: Okay, I was open to keeping Dalton before. Everyone watch this clip. We don't need him. 

Give Burrow the reps. Let him lead the team. Peyton Manning played through a terrible rookie season, he learned from it. It didn't hamper his development. The next year he killed it. Give Burrow the keys. 

Dalton's a great guy, but he isn't worth the money. Spend that money extending Mixon and AJ. Leave some space in case of injuries.

Radio guys were drawing the Manning conparison to Manning and rookie QBs. I guess to me the thing is the team around them. Manning that second season had a good team (if I'm remembering right) whereas a lot of QBs walk into a dumpster fire on both sides.

If the team ends up being as good as it looks on paper, send burrow out and let him get his lumps. If it's last seasons team, for all that's good in the world, keep him on the bench a year and let the team improve.

[corpjet]

I can think of 17.5 million reasons...

[TecmoBengals]

(04-27-2020, 03:40 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Why are people acting like Dalton wouldn't be able to help Burrow become a better QB? This is insane. I'm happy that we have Burrow as our new QB, and I'm rooting for him to win and win more than Dalton ever has. No matter how big of a Dalton hater you are, you have to agree that Dalton is a smart and studious QB. He has a lot of experience playing actual NFL defenses and what things to look for. He as experience changing OCs multiple times and know's his X's and O's. To act like there isn't anything that Dalton couldn't help Burrow with is just silly to me.

I posted Burrow could learn from Dalton, but emphasized Burrow will also be okay without Dalton.  I don't think everyone is posting he can't learn from him, but rather posters are suggesting he doesn't need Dalton as much as other new to the NFL QBs might need a veteran.

Everything I read about veteran QBs mentoring youth is that the benefit is about how to be a professional.  Burrow has been through that with the type of program he was in at LSU.  He's dealt with travel, national media, and hopefully his formal education and age are also signs of maturity needed for NFL success.

[fredtoast]

This thread has gotten a little toxic.  Let me step back and make my position clear before stepping out.

Personally I don't think we should keep Dalton, but I think it may be a possibility just because of what happened with Palmer.  Mike Brown may think he can get something of value in trade if he holds onto Dalton and another team loses a starting QB before the trade deadline.

I think we should extend MIxon, but only if he is not asking for "top of the league money".  So if MIxon really is demanding $10+ per year extending him is not a good option.  Other than that I don't see any top free agents to spend Dalton's salary on.

Dalton could be of value to Burrow, but the idea of a "mentor QB" is a little overblown.  Not just here but everywhere.  It is great if a vet QB is available and willing, but that is really the job of the QB coach.

So basically I won't freak out no matter what they do with Dalton.  I am fine if they release him as long as they use the money they save this year.  But I would also be okay if they kept him.

[TecmoBengals]

(04-27-2020, 09:35 AM)fredtoast Wrote: So basically I won't freak out no matter what they do with Dalton.  I am fine if they release him as long as they use the money they save this year.  But I would also be okay if they kept him.

I think that is a sensible take.  If Dalton is on the team, we know the narrative by the media: "Dalton or Burrow!"  Since Dalton has only presented himself as a good, professional, and respectable dude, I think there isn't much to worry about if he is on this team despite the possibility of such a narrative.  He'll be a good team mate.

All will be well with or without Dalton on the team.

[Bengalfan4life27c]

Imagine if we are 9 -2 and Burrow has a 6 week injury. you want to put the season in the hands of Ryan Finley or Jake Dolegala? you need 2 competent qb's we only have 1 without Dalton. our backup becomes bottom 3 in the league with no Dalton

[McC]

(04-27-2020, 10:18 AM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: Imagine if we are 9 -2 and Burrow has a 6 week injury. you want to put the season in the hands of Ryan Finley or Jake Dolegala? you need 2 competent qb's we only have 1 without Dalton.  our backup becomes bottom 3 in the league with no Dalton

That's why you release Dalton and sign a veteran backup for a third of what Dalton costs.  And now you're onto the next chapter.

[*bfine32*]

(04-27-2020, 12:41 AM)JSR18 Wrote:  I'll ask again, because the 1st time it apparently got missed.
                What is it that Joe Burrow is lacking in that you think Dalton will be able to help with??

On the field experience against our AFC foes. That's six games per year that when Joe comes to the sidelines He and Andy can talk through what he's seeing and Andy is the only one that has seen similar things over the past 9 years. 

[*bfine32*]

(04-27-2020, 09:35 AM)fredtoast Wrote: This thread has gotten a little toxic.  Let me step back and make my position clear before stepping out.

Personally I don't think we should keep Dalton, but I think it may be a possibility just because of what happened with Palmer.  Mike Brown may think he can get something of value in trade if he holds onto Dalton and another team loses a starting QB before the trade deadline.

I think we should extend MIxon, but only if he is not asking for "top of the league money".  So if MIxon really is demanding $10+ per year extending him is not a good option.  Other than that I don't see any top free agents to spend Dalton's salary on.

Dalton could be of value to Burrow, but the idea of a "mentor QB" is a little overblown.  Not just here but everywhere.  It is great if a vet QB is available and willing, but that is really the job of the QB coach.

So basically I won't freak out no matter what they do with Dalton.  I am fine if they release him as long as they use the money they save this year.  But I would also be okay if they kept him.

Yeah, if anyone knows me at all they understand I am not the biggest supporter of Andy's play on the field, but there is merit to keep him on the squad. I do differ with you on the role of mentor QB, one of those can be very important. We saw it all weekend during the draft when QBs came of the board..."He's going to a great situation and could have no better mentor than Phillip Rivers ect....

No skin off my nose if the Bengals cut Andy, but there is merit to holding on to him even if it means paying a premium for Joe's rookie year. But things do become toxic when counters are met with such thought out retorts as "stupid, goofey...ect". 

As I said earlier my dream scenario would be to extend Andy an additional year, give him all his loot this year, but spread his cap out over 2. Then either mid-season or next off season work proactively to deal Andy. I don't think we've made one call to anyone gauging their interest in Andy, because we want to hold onto him

[BacknDaDey]

I don't get why some people think Dalton will be thrilled and enthused to set behind Burrow to back him up or so called "mentor" him. You all are going to be mad if Dalton outplays Burrow and ends up starting!

[Luvnit2]

I have said my opinion. I wanted AD traded the day we secured the #1 pick. But things change. I thought we may be rebuilding and we are not. A playoff team needs a solid back up QB and AD or Joe would be the best QB tandem in football other than maybe Brees and Winston.

At this moment in time, there is zero FINANCIAL RISK to allow AD to compete in TC with Joe. If AD plays well and wins the job so be it. If he loses the job, it gives us more time to get something back for Andy versus just cutting him.

I love Burrow and think he will become a great NFL QB, but he may have a shortened or no TC to help him prepare for his rookie season. Peyton Manning advised him his rookie year will be rough and he knows a thing or two about being a great rookie QB.

I want to win in 2020, 2021 and beyond.  I do not want another season of losing and in my opinion a back up QB to a great rookie QB would provide us security. We are improving the rest of the team, we cut AD and we likely downgrade our 2nd QB. Is that smart?

Put the egos aside as AD is a professional and not a diva, so AI see no issue with team chemistry if AD stays in 2020. I would love for AD to restructure his contract, but unlikely he would do it because if traded, that new deal goes with him.

[Essex Johnson]

(04-27-2020, 10:20 AM)McC Wrote: That's why you release Dalton and sign a veteran backup for a third of what Dalton costs.  And now you're onto the next chapter.

how about a happy compromise. you cut Dalton.. come late July he is unsigned you then sign him a veteran backup QB on the higher end for backups.. then you got your experience so the season is not lost, development of players is not lost at a good rate...

If not Dalton I hope that is what we do with our backup regardless

[McC]

(04-27-2020, 11:35 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: how about a happy compromise. you cut Dalton.. come late July he is unsigned you then sign him a veteran backup QB on the higher end for backups.. then you got your experience so the season is not lost, development of players is not lost at a good rate...

If not Dalton I hope that is what we do with our backup regardless

That would work too.  It just doesn't work at 17.7 mil.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-27-2020, 10:18 AM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: Imagine if we are 9 -2 and Burrow has a 6 week injury. you want to put the season in the hands of Ryan Finley or Jake Dolegala? you need 2 competent qb's we only have 1 without Dalton. our backup becomes bottom 3 in the league with no Dalton

KC signed Matt Moore for about 1 million last season. He filled in when Mahomes went down he and did fine. Even won them a game. There is no reason to spend a crazy amount of money on a backup.