AJ - 'franchise tag is not the best thing'

[JSR18]

(01-23-2020, 07:00 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: If tagging AJ at $18m for 2020 is the only way we can keep him, I say thanks for what you did here and good luck wherever you go. This team needs so much more help than to blow their entire free agency budget on the hopes that AJ can play the entire 2020 season.

I'm a big fan of AJ and would love to keep him in stripes for the rest of his career, but paying him $18m is absolutely ridiculous. I'd rather spend that on an OG (not Jerry or Redmond) and a LB (hopefully better than what we have) and then draft a WR (preferably Jefferson from LSU). This is a team ran by people who almost always cut their salary cap space in half to account for the draft, injuries, and rollover money. With no rollover for 2021, I expect it will just rollover back into Mike Brown's bank account.

You're talking about a team that let Steinbach and then Zeitler walk. This team will not pay for OGs... 

[Sled21]

(01-23-2020, 11:37 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: Do I have the injury facts right? He tore a big toe ligament( turf toe) in 2018 and missed 3 games. He came back for a game and ran 1 play and missed the final 4 games because he couldn’t run on the turf toe. He didn’t play any games on that toe in 2019 and careers have ended because of turf toe. 18 million for a year sounds like a sound, winning investment? It sounds like gambling the whole season on his being healthy. 18 million can buy a contributor!

He had the toe surgically repaired. He then tore his ankle ligaments when he tripped over Kirkpatricks foot.

[Sled21]

(01-23-2020, 05:36 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: We blame him for not being able to stay healthy or recover, but look at our training facilities and medical staff and tell me if it's completely his fault.

Our training facilities and medical staff had zero to do with his ankle injury. He got tangled up with Dre and turned his ankle. How is that a facilities fault?

[fredtoast]

(01-23-2020, 07:00 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: I'm a big fan of AJ and would love to keep him in stripes for the rest of his career, but paying him $18m is absolutely ridiculous.

This.

I am also a big fan of Green, but the Benglas would be insane to pay a WR who has not been able to play for a yeard and a half $18 million.

To me the fact that he had problems recoverying is actually worse than getting another injury.  

[fredtoast]

(01-24-2020, 01:57 AM)JSR18 Wrote: You're talking about a team that let Steinbach and then Zeitler walk. This team will not pay for OGs... 

It was impossble to pay Steinbach because all five of our starting O-linemen were free agents in a two season span.  Bengals played if perfectly by keeping everyone else and drafting Whitworth to replace Steinbach.  Browns paid way too much for Eric.  Bengals were smart not to keep him at that price.

Bengals also paid to keep OGs Bobbie Williams and Clint Boling.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-23-2020, 04:19 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: He sure is a great guy. Wish he could stay healthy and help us win a ring here. I just don't know if AJ can considering
his injuries of late. I can completely understand why the team would put the Franchise tag on him cause of this.

If AJ really wants to stay here for a 3 year extension he will HAVE to take into consideration his injury history as of
late. The deal would have to include incentives.

Absolutely, and the Bengals really hold all the cards here....if he won't sign a deal like that, he gets tagged.  If a team wants to sign him at that point, Cincy gets something ridiculous like two first round picks.  No one is offering that for AJ Green.  Not even pinhead Dan Snyder.  

[Catmandude123]

I would offer a two years 36mil with 18mil guaranteed or let him walk. The risk the team is taking (can't preform to the contract or doesn't care because he was tagged) is not worth it if they have to go through the same thing next offseason. I believe that with his injury history he will be hard pressed to find a better deal.

[R3stangs]

(01-23-2020, 07:55 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Seeing as AJs opponent in this battle is a man who makes billions to watch football makes AJ the plucky underdog by default.  

I really don't give a hoot about Mikes money so I'm not seeing this as AJ v Mike Brown. I want to see the team make the best use of the funds available to get better within the cap. And rolling the dice on a player at a position shown to decline dramatically around his age and his injury questions doesn't seem like a good use of those. Especially committing them to a long term deal like he wants.

[XenoMorph]

(01-24-2020, 01:35 PM)R3stangs Wrote: I really don't give a hoot about Mikes money so I'm not seeing this as AJ v Mike Brown. I want to see the team make the best use of the funds available to get better within the cap. And rolling the dice on a player at a position shown to decline dramatically around his age and his injury questions doesn't seem like a good use of those. Especially committing them to a long term deal like he wants.

right and their are younger WRs on the open market that could grow with burrow instead of being retired in a few years.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-24-2020, 11:52 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Absolutely, and the Bengals really hold all the cards here....if he won't sign a deal like that, he gets tagged.  If a team wants to sign him at that point, Cincy gets something ridiculous like two first round picks.  No one is offering that for AJ Green.  Not even pinhead Dan Snyder.  

Lone Bengal talked me out of the Tag, I think we could use that money on solidifying the O-line and the LB's and adding
weapons. If we want to spend big money on a top Receiver Amari Cooper would be the guy i would add. Just cannot trust
AJ to stay healthy anymore and 18 mil is a lot of dough for one season we don't even know if he will play in.

[fredtoast]

I think most of us feel the same.  We all wish Green would come back and play well, but we don't want to spend a lot of money on taking that chance.

In the end that may be the way it works out.  He doesn't get any great offers from any other teams so he comes back and signs with us at a greatly reduced price.

Sadly, considering the numbers on how WRs fall off dramatically at Green's age, I just don't see him ever returning to a top 10 WR status.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-24-2020, 03:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I think most of us feel the same.  We all wish Green would come back and play well, but we don't want to a lot of money on taking that chance.

In the end that may be the way it works out.  He doesn't get any great offers from any other teams so he comes back and signs with us at a greatly reduced price.

Sadly, considering the numbers on how WRs fall of dramatically at Green's age, I just don't see him ever returning to a top 10 WR status.

Agreed, it could end up that way and that would be better for all involved honestly than the Tag.

AJ might not ever be the same guy but I think he would still be our best Receiver if he is healthy which is a big deal.

[hoosierbengal]

(01-23-2020, 05:36 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: We blame him for not being able to stay healthy or recover, but look at our training facilities and medical staff and tell me if it's completely his fault.

I love that he says he's not going to turn down 18 million dollars. Players always complain about long-term security and whatever but it sounds like he understands that 18 million gives him plenty of security. Don't get me wrong because I understand that long-term is better but he sounds like he's not being greedy.

Personally, I love him and want him here for the rest of his career. I obviously hope that he can stay healthy and produce like we all know he can, but I think Burrow could rejuvenate his career.

Love ya, AJ!

Not trying to argue your point Fritz but reading it made me think of post in the past bashing our medical staff. I am not saying they are good or bad as I have no idea. I pretty much think none of us really know. I like to go around to other teams message boards to get some perspective. I see many of the same complaints we see on this board on all the other boards. The medical staff complaints being one of the most common. Personally I think it stems from fan frustrations for the most part. We all want our players healthy and on the field at all times but that isn’t realistic. When we hear a player is out for a certain amount of time and it ends up being longer we tend to blame the medical staff. I think most of the time that is unwarranted but of course there are exceptions. Does any of us really know if the Bengals medical staff is good or bad? Serious question cuz I have no clue lol

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-24-2020, 03:33 PM)hoosierbengal Wrote: Not trying to argue your point Fritz but reading it made me think of post in the past bashing our medical staff. I am not saying they are good or bad as I have no idea. I pretty much think none of us really know. I like to go around to other teams message boards to get some perspective. I see many of the same complaints we see on this board on all the other boards. The medical staff complaints being one of the most common. Personally I think it stems from fan frustrations for the most part. We all want our players healthy and on the field at all times but that isn’t realistic. When we hear a player is out for a certain amount of time and it ends up being longer we tend to blame the medical staff. I think most of the time that is unwarranted but of course there are exceptions. Does any of us really know if the Bengals medical staff is good or bad? Serious question cuz I have no clue lol

Players are going to go down, that is a given. Next man up is what most teams say, but it doesn't seem to work for us.

We changed up the medical staff years ago, the one that called Braham's injury a bone bruise and he never played again...

I don't know if this one is better or worse than that one honestly.

[muskiesfan]

I think part of the problem is that we all wants answers when someone is injured. They do not have to give us answers and we're not entitled to them honestly. However, the teams will generally put a little something out there. The feeling that we deserve or are owed answers is part of the issue. We all want our favorite and best players out there, but if they're injured we need to just accept that and move on.

The other part of the problem is what the team puts out. Player X has injury y and will be out 4-6 weeks. Then it's Player X is still dealing with injury y, had some setbacks, should be back in next 2-3 weeks. Then nothing. Not a peep. Another 4, 5, 6 weeks have passed. Then it's Player X is still not 100% and needs more time. The next thing you know, Player X has missed the entire season. What's even worse is when they carry Player X on the active roster almost the entire damn season. Yes, that sounds a lot like Green. It's also almost identical to Eifert, Ross, Dennard, etc, etc, etc.

The team should just say that Player X is injured and will return when healthy. Putting timetables on it and then always changing/extending the timetable adds to the frustration. The fans gets upset with the player, team, coaches, and medical staff.

[*Nately120*]

(01-24-2020, 01:35 PM)R3stangs Wrote: I really don't give a hoot about Mikes money so I'm not seeing this as AJ v Mike Brown. I want to see the team make the best use of the funds available to get better within the cap. And rolling the dice on a player at a position shown to decline dramatically around his age and his injury questions doesn't seem like a good use of those. Especially committing them to a long term deal like he wants.

Your post made it sound like you were complaining about AJ making millions to play football.  My mistake, I guess.

[R3stangs]

(01-24-2020, 05:17 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Your post made it sound like you were complaining about AJ making millions to play football.  My mistake, I guess.

Maybe I am a little. Has nothing to do with Mike Brown. Probably has a lot to do with a guy lamenting that he might only get paid 18 million dollars next year and implying thats somehow a negative thing.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-24-2020, 02:43 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Lone Bengal talked me out of the Tag, I think we could use that money on solidifying the O-line and the LB's and adding
weapons. If we want to spend big money on a top Receiver Amari Cooper would be the guy i would add. Just cannot trust
AJ to stay healthy anymore and 18 mil is a lot of dough for one season we don't even know if he will play in.

I understand the logic of 18 Million to pay Green sounding too much, but the one year contract is a huge benefit to the Bengals.  If AJ wants to get another big bite of the apple, he will HAVE to not only play, but excel.  If he doesn't, his next deal will be worth that much less.  If he does, the Bengals have an asset that they could either sign long-term and let him finish his career here, tag him again if they can't come to a realistic deal, or (unlikely) let him go and get a 3rd round compensatory pick for him.  

I would wager he would produce in that one year, albeit in a forced "bet on yourself" season.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-24-2020, 05:29 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I understand the logic of 18 Million to pay Green sounding too much, but the one year contract is a huge benefit to the Bengals.  If AJ wants to get another big bite of the apple, he will HAVE to not only play, but excel.  If he doesn't, his next deal will be worth that much less.  If he does, the Bengals have an asset that they could either sign long-term and let him finish his career here, tag him again if they can't come to a realistic deal, or (unlikely) let him go and get a 3rd round compensatory pick for him.  

I would wager he would produce in that one year, albeit in a forced "bet on yourself" season.  

We will see what AJ is willing to take cause it cannot break the bank. His injury history should scare every team, not just us.

Incentive laden contract is all he should get whether it is here or somewhere else.

Not on board tagging him and him sitting hurt again all year for a crazy amount like 18 mil.

[*bengalfan74*]

(01-24-2020, 06:10 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: We will see what AJ is willing to take cause it cannot break the bank. His injury history should scare every team, not just us.

Incentive laden contract is all he should get whether it is here or somewhere else.

Not on board tagging him and him sitting hurt again all year for a crazy amount like 18 mil.

Fully agree

AJ is just to big a risk to tag ! If he won't come back on like a max two year prove it incentive laden deal wish him well at his new team. He's only like 3 or 4 games short of missing 1/2 of the games over last four seasons.