Teams with multiple picks in Rd 2-3

[*SHRacerX*]

I thought it was interesting to look at Rds 2 and 3 to see who had additional picks as potential trade bait for players or pick 33:

Rd 2:

Miami has #39 and #56
Indy has #34 and #44
Chicago has #43 and #50
Atlanta has #47 and #55

New England has NO 2nd round picks.

Rd 3:

Jets have #68 and #79
Denver has #77 and #83
Cleveland has #74 and #90

The Raiders have #80, #81, and #91 (but no 2nd rounders)

If the Bengals are fortunate enough to get a 2nd rounder for Dalton from either Indy (great fit) or Chicago (windy, but still a good fit...thank you Tannehill for showing the NFL that having a backup option if the starter tanks might work).

The fact that there could be an elite talent that is highly coveted at the top of Rd 2 could yield the Bengals a fairly solid additional 3rd rounder for swapping 2nd round picks. I wonder if the Bengals would slide all the way down to the Jets pick in Rd 2 (#48) to gain their first 3rd rounders at #68. Point system seems favorable. I guess it all depends on their playing weighting and who is there.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-05-2020, 09:35 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I thought it was interesting to look at Rds 2 and 3 to see who had additional picks as potential trade bait for players or pick 33:

Rd 2:

Miami has #39 and #56
Indy has #34 and #44
Chicago has #43 and #50
Atlanta has #47 and #55

New England has NO 2nd round picks.

Rd 3:

Jets have #68 and #79
Denver has #77 and #83
Cleveland has #74 and #90

The Raiders have #80, #81, and #91 (but no 2nd rounders)

If the Bengals are fortunate enough to get a 2nd rounder for Dalton from either Indy (great fit) or Chicago (windy, but still a good fit...thank you Tannehill for showing the NFL that having a backup option if the starter tanks might work).

The fact that there could be an elite talent that is highly coveted at the top of Rd 2 could yield the Bengals a fairly solid additional 3rd rounder for swapping 2nd round picks.  I wonder if the Bengals would slide all the way down to the Jets pick in Rd 2 (#48) to gain their first 3rd rounders at #68.  Point system seems favorable.  I guess it all depends on their playing weighting and who is there.

If I'm Dalton, I'd prefer Indy.
You get a dome to play your home games in, plus you get a dome for Houston game and then Nashville and Jacksonville weather for the other inter-division away games.

Plus, you'd have a solid OL (assuming they keep Castonzo), a running game with a 1000-yard rusher in Marlon Mack, a good WR in TY Hilton, and a versatile TE in Jack Doyle.
Their defense also is middle-of-the-pack, which is a big upgrade over the Bengals.
With having picks 13, 34, and 44, they definitely have room to add another impactful pass catcher and defensive player too.

[JerseyDD09]

(03-05-2020, 11:19 AM)ochocincos Wrote: If I'm Dalton, I'd prefer Indy.
You get a dome to play your home games in, plus you get a dome for Houston game and then Nashville and Jacksonville weather for the other inter-division away games.

Plus, you'd have a solid OL (assuming they keep Castonzo), a running game with a 1000-yard rusher in Marlon Mack, a good WR in TY Hilton, and a versatile TE in Jack Doyle.
Their defense also is middle-of-the-pack, which is a big upgrade over the Bengals.
With having picks 13, 34, and 44, they definitely have room to add another impactful pass catcher and defensive player too.

I think that Chicago is one of the places that Dalton could outright win the starting job as Trubisky clearly lost his confidence last year as everyone could see. But, I don't think Chicago would give up one of their 2nd rounders for him. It's too steep of a price. Last year, Flacco was only traded for a 4th Rounder. And, there's too many free agent QBs to choose from this year.

Also, no one is talking about Miami. Dalton would be a better transition QB than Fitz b/c he doesn't turn the ball over as much. He hits his reads most of the time. And, whomever Miami gets in this draft will not be able to start right away. Dalton is the perfect bridge QB and Miami has the ammo to give us a high 3rd round pick.

In regards to the 2nd round, Jeremiah just did his updated Round 1 Mock after the Combine and Epenesa was still there at pick #33. Same thing for Davidson from Auburn. I'd love for them or someone like QB Eason to be sitting there for anyone still needing that pass rusher/QB such as Atlanta specifically. They have picks 47 and 55 and 78 in the 3rd round. And, if Eason is still on the board there's a team loving his arm I'm sure such as Indy, Miami, NE, Raiders who all have multiple picks in the 2nd or 3rd rounds. So, it should be interesting.

I hope that the Bengals can Trade Dalton for at least a 3rd if we can get it. And Trade down in the 2nd and 4th Rounds at the start of each new day of the draft and get additional picks b/c this draft is loaded with Talent. You can get a starting or rotational WR in the 5th round of the draft. All Positions seem to be deep this year except maybe TE, so it's a great time for the Bengals to get 1st picks in every round.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-05-2020, 04:04 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: I think that Chicago is one of the places that Dalton could outright win the starting job as Trubisky clearly lost his confidence last year as everyone could see. But, I don't think Chicago would give up one of their 2nd rounders for him. It's too steep of a price. Last year, Flacco was only traded for a 4th Rounder. And, there's too many free agent QBs to choose from this year.

Also, no one is talking about Miami. Dalton would be a better transition QB than Fitz b/c he doesn't turn the ball over as much. He hits his reads most of the time. And, whomever Miami gets in this draft will not be able to start right away. Dalton is the perfect bridge QB and Miami has the ammo to give us a high 3rd round pick.

In regards to the 2nd round, Jeremiah just did his updated Round 1 Mock after the Combine and Epenesa was still there at pick #33. Same thing for Davidson from Auburn. I'd love for them or someone like QB Eason to be sitting there for anyone still needing that pass rusher/QB such as Atlanta specifically. They have picks 47 and 55 and 78 in the 3rd round. And, if Eason is still on the board there's a team loving his arm I'm sure such as Indy, Miami, NE, Raiders who all have multiple picks in the 2nd or 3rd rounds. So, it should be interesting.

I hope that the Bengals can Trade Dalton for at least a 3rd if we can get it. And Trade down in the 2nd and 4th Rounds at the start of each new day of the draft and get additional picks b/c this draft is loaded with Talent. You can get a starting or rotational WR in the 5th round of the draft. All Positions seem to be deep this year except maybe TE, so it's a great time for the Bengals to get 1st picks in every round.

Fitzpatrick isn't that far off from Dalton to justify Dalton's more-than-double salary compared to Fitzpatrick ($17.8 mill vs $8 mill).
The Dolphins would also have to eat $4 mill in dead cap if they decided to move on from Fitzpatrick, basically putting the hit to $21.8 mill.
Then add in a pick on top of that additional salary? No way I'd do that.

I really don't see Dalton doing well on a team that needs so many pieces to compete.
He'd be better off in Indy or Chicago.

[schroomytunes]

I would love for this to happen. The Bengals trade Andy Dalton before the draft to the Bears for their 5th(142) and 6th(177) rd picks. The Bears have 2 picks in both of those rounds and I could see them giving up 1 in each round. The FA market is deep this year for QB's but Dalton is very affordable compared to the open market prices. I would like to see us not trade back in the 2nd and draft the BPA that fell out of the 1st round. We will be able to find solid players in the 5th/6th to shore up depth (WR, S, DL)

[JerseyDD09]

(03-05-2020, 04:27 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Fitzpatrick isn't that far off from Dalton to justify Dalton's more-than-double salary compared to Fitzpatrick ($17.8 mill vs $8 mill).
The Dolphins would also have to eat $4 mill in dead cap if they decided to move on from Fitzpatrick, basically putting the hit to $21.8 mill.
Then add in a pick on top of that additional salary? No way I'd do that.

I really don't see Dalton doing well on a team that needs so many pieces to compete.
He'd be better off in Indy or Chicago.

The Bengals have been rumored to eat a portion or even all of Dalton's Salary this year in order to move him to a team that he wants to go to and they want. But, they of course would want a decent draft pick/s in return.
That's of course just a rumor. But, I wouldn't put it past them since they have such high regard for Andy.
I'd still take Dalton over Fitz any day of the week for a reasonable price. He's Younger, more wins, been to the Playoffs 5 times, more accurate, etc....
I do agree he'd be better off behind that O Line in Indy or the Defense in Chicago. Dalton had all those good Zimmer defenses and he took us to the Playoffs each time. He does well on teams with good defenses.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2020, 11:19 AM)ochocincos Wrote: If I'm Dalton, I'd prefer Indy.
You get a dome to play your home games in, plus you get a dome for Houston game and then Nashville and Jacksonville weather for the other inter-division away games.

Plus, you'd have a solid OL (assuming they keep Castonzo), a running game with a 1000-yard rusher in Marlon Mack, a good WR in TY Hilton, and a versatile TE in Jack Doyle.
Their defense also is middle-of-the-pack, which is a big upgrade over the Bengals.
With having picks 13, 34, and 44, they definitely have room to add another impactful pass catcher and defensive player too.

Funny, haven't thought of Indy as a landing spot for Dalton until now. Seems like a perfect fit.

Luck leaves and Dalton ends up in a great spot.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-05-2020, 08:05 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: The Bengals have been rumored to eat a portion or even all of Dalton's Salary this year in order to move him to a team that he wants to go to and they want. But, they of course would want a decent draft pick/s in return.
That's of course just a rumor. But, I wouldn't put it past them since they have such high regard for Andy.
I'd still take Dalton over Fitz any day of the week for a reasonable price. He's Younger, more wins, been to the Playoffs 5 times, more accurate, etc....
I do agree he'd be better off behind that O Line in Indy or the Defense in Chicago. Dalton had all those good Zimmer defenses and he took us to the Playoffs each time. He does well on teams with good defenses.

That would be dumb IMO.
You'll get $17.7 mill in savings if you just cut Dalton.
A third-round pick only costs $1-2 mill a year for 4 years.
You'd be better off just cutting Dalton and put the $17.7 mill toward a FA vs eating that cap just to get a Day 2 draft pick.

[JerseyDD09]

(03-05-2020, 08:15 PM)ochocincos Wrote: That would be dumb IMO.
You'll get $17.7 mill in savings if you just cut Dalton.
A third-round pick only costs $1-2 mill a year for 4 years.
You'd be better off just cutting Dalton and put the $17.7 mill toward a FA vs eating that cap just to get a Day 2 draft pick.

I would agree with you on that one. It doesn't seem smart at all. But, I guess the Bengals are trying to maybe save face with all the bad publicity from Palmer lately? I could see them eating a portion of it but not all of it. IDK, but we'll see if it's just rumors.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2020, 08:25 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: I would agree with you on that one. It doesn't seem smart at all. But, I guess the Bengals are trying to maybe save face with all the bad publicity from Palmer lately? I could see them eating a portion of it but not all of it. IDK, but we'll see if it's just rumors.

MB never cares what anyone says, especially Palmer lol

[JerseyDD09]

(03-05-2020, 08:27 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: MB never cares what anyone says, especially Palmer lol

Think about it this way. They may have no choice but to eat some of his salary if they want to get anything for him in a trade. His Salary is too rich for any team that we'd be talking about besides NE if Brady leaves or a team like SD. Indy would drop Brissett most likely. Chicago would still keep Trubisky. Miami keep Fitz and/or Rosen or a new Rookie? If I'm Miami, I draft Tua, and trade for Dalton and keep Rosen for this year. I'd drop Fitz.
SD could take on his salary along with a Rookie, make him their bridge QB. Dalton is better than Taylor.
NE could, but wouldn't take on that money.
If the Bengals are trading Dalton, they're eating some of the money IMO. I don't think any team would take on his salary.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2020, 08:38 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: Think about it this way. They may have no choice but to eat some of his salary if they want to get anything for him in a trade. His Salary is too rich for any team that we'd be talking about besides NE if Brady leaves or a team like SD. Indy would drop Brissett most likely. Chicago would still keep Trubisky. Miami keep Fitz and/or Rosen or a new Rookie? If I'm Miami, I draft Tua, and trade for Dalton and keep Rosen for this year. I'd drop Fitz.
SD could take on his salary along with a Rookie, make him their bridge QB. Dalton is better than Taylor.
NE could, but wouldn't take on that money.
If the Bengals are trading Dalton, they're eating some of the money IMO. I don't think any team would take on his salary.

I don't know, 17.5 mil ain't breaking the bank for a solid starting QB in the NFL.

As you note there are multiple teams that would be interested. Just depends on which one gives us the best option and which
one is the best fit for Dalton. The more I think of it Indy is a nice spot for him to land if NE is left Bradyless. 

Belichick has already mentioned they are interested in Dalton. The problem for the Patriots is they have no 2nd round picks and
Indy has 2. Indy has the upper hand already looking at it in this perspective.

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-05-2020, 11:19 AM)ochocincos Wrote: If I'm Dalton, I'd prefer Indy.
You get a dome to play your home games in, plus you get a dome for Houston game and then Nashville and Jacksonville weather for the other inter-division away games.

Plus, you'd have a solid OL (assuming they keep Castonzo), a running game with a 1000-yard rusher in Marlon Mack, a good WR in TY Hilton, and a versatile TE in Jack Doyle.
Their defense also is middle-of-the-pack, which is a big upgrade over the Bengals.
With having picks 13, 34, and 44, they definitely have room to add another impactful pass catcher and defensive player too.

Indy makes a lot of sense...and I think Dalton would do quite well there.  Maybe that gives the Bengals pause as he is in their conference, but I think it is smarter than New England.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(03-05-2020, 08:15 PM)ochocincos Wrote: That would be dumb IMO.
You'll get $17.7 mill in savings if you just cut Dalton.
A third-round pick only costs $1-2 mill a year for 4 years.
You'd be better off just cutting Dalton and put the $17.7 mill toward a FA vs eating that cap just to get a Day 2 draft pick.

The smart thing to do is to eat some salary to increase the draft pick.

I gave this example the other day: a second round guard would be one of the best IOL in the draft and should be able to start immediately and would cost $2m a year for 4 years. A free agent guard of a similar standard (i.e. in the second tier of free agency, so Glasgow rather than Thuney or Scherff) would cost $8m a year.

 You could pay $8m towards Dalton to secure a 2nd round pick and still be up $16m over 4 years over the free agency option. 

[*ochocincos*]

(03-06-2020, 03:37 PM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: The smart thing to do is to eat some salary to increase the draft pick.

I gave this example the other day: a second round guard would be one of the best IOL in the draft and should be able to start immediately and would cost $2m a year for 4 years. A free agent guard of a similar standard (i.e. in the second tier of free agency, so Glasgow rather than Thuney or Scherff) would cost $8m a year.

 You could pay $8m towards Dalton to secure a 2nd round pick and still be up $16m over 4 years over the free agency option. 

True, another good idea...assuming you trust the Bengals to make good picks and develop those players.
Last year's draft left a lot to be desired.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(03-06-2020, 03:40 PM)ochocincos Wrote: True, another good idea...assuming you trust the Bengals to make good picks and develop those players.
Last year's draft left a lot to be desired.

In which case why do you trust the Bengals to spend the money wisely in free agency?

And if you do go wrong, then a 2nd round draft pick will have far less guaranteed money than a second wave free agent.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-06-2020, 03:37 PM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: The smart thing to do is to eat some salary to increase the draft pick.

I gave this example the other day: a second round guard would be one of the best IOL in the draft and should be able to start immediately and would cost $2m a year for 4 years. A free agent guard of a similar standard (i.e. in the second tier of free agency, so Glasgow rather than Thuney or Scherff) would cost $8m a year.

 You could pay $8m towards Dalton to secure a 2nd round pick and still be up $16m over 4 years over the free agency option. 

(03-06-2020, 03:43 PM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: In which case why do you trust the Bengals to spend the money wisely in free agency?

And if you do go wrong, then a 2nd round draft pick will have far less guaranteed money than a second wave free agent.

Good thoughts, the only problem I have with it is that any Guard they get in FA whether it be Glasgow or Fieler is proven.

I trust any FA acquisition over any pick pretty much every time. The FA has played in the NFL and proven he can play in the NFL.

The pick has not, although, something is better than nothing.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(03-06-2020, 03:53 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Good thoughts, the only problem I have with it is that any Guard they get in FA whether it be Glasgow or Fieler is proven.

I trust any FA acquisition over any pick pretty much every time. The FA has played in the NFL and proven he can play in the NFL.

The pick has not, although, something is better than nothing.

That's true but a free agent also has more wear and tear and you may not be getting the player they once were (e.g. Lavernus Coles).

Plus in the Bengals' current position- rebuilding rather than contending - I'd rather take the ascending player over the descending one.

[JerseyDD09]

(03-06-2020, 04:12 PM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: That's true but a free agent also has more wear and tear and you may not be getting the player they once were (e.g. Lavernus Coles).

Plus in the Bengals' current position- rebuilding rather than contending - I'd rather take the ascending player over the descending one.

You make good points. But, you seem to be nothing at all for FA? And, the Bengals are trying to make their #1 QB feel at ease that they will protect their investment; and, the Bengals are going through a horrible PR problem nationally as everyone knows. With Dalton Traded, Cordy Traded or waived, and Dre Traded or waived, the Bengals will have about 80Mill to spend. You can't just supplement this team with 7 Draft picks. They will have to fork out some money on a proven FA OLineman and/or LB or CB in order to get this team going in the right direction.

For the money, I hope we can pull away Whit back to us again from the Rams who will only have 15 Mill to spend in FA. There's no one I trust more than him to be a Leader and mentor for Jonah and a Rookie QB. After a 2 year contract, move him directly over to be a coach if he desires to go that direction.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(03-06-2020, 05:23 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: You make good points. But, you seem to be nothing at all for FA? And, the Bengals are trying to make their #1 QB feel at ease that they will protect their investment; and, the Bengals are going through a horrible PR problem nationally as everyone knows. With Dalton Traded, Cordy Traded or waived, and Dre Traded or waived, the Bengals will have about 80Mill to spend. You can't just supplement this team with 7 Draft picks. They will have to fork out some money on a proven FA OLineman and/or LB or CB in order to get this team going in the right direction.

For the money, I hope we can pull away Whit back to us again from the Rams who will only have 15 Mill to spend in FA. There's no one I trust more than him to be a Leader and mentor for Jonah and a Rookie QB. After a 2 year contract, move him directly over to be a coach if he desires to go that direction.

I'm for 8+ draft picks - getting a good one for Dalton is paramount for shortening the rebuild.

The Bengals can afford to re-sign some of their own guys, still eat some of Dalton's salary and have money left over to invest in free agency.