{The Ultimate ANDY DALTON Mega Thread}

[jfkbengals]

(11-21-2017, 01:14 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: The lack of a running game is a killer, no denying that. Stafford seems to be overcoming it though. Lions are 6-4.

Lions - Rank (28th), 3.4 avg, 80. 8 yds/g

Bengals- Rank (32nd), 3.0 avg, 68. 0 yds/g

At 3.4, 3 runs move the chains and the defense remains on the sideline.

At 3.0, 3 runs are 3 and out and the defenders are grabbing their helmets.

Obviously .4 YPC isn't a massive difference per carry.  However it is enough to allow the defense enough rest to make a game changing play; or get the special teams close enough to add 3 points instead of punt; or force the opposition to play the run with 8 in the box and be subject to the play action game making it easier for the offense to get some points themselves.

In the grand scheme of things, I would say those things could easily have given us 2 more wins, and thus an identical record to the Lions.

So maybe Stafford isn't overcoming anything, but has something slightly more efficient and effective aiding him?

[Utts]

(11-22-2017, 02:56 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: He kinda is. No sarcasm necessary. Over last 8 games:

No. He is not.

[Brownshoe]

(11-23-2017, 03:28 AM)Utts Wrote: No. He is not.

This is the part where explain why you think he's not, because Shake provided a very good argument why he is.

[Whacked]

(11-21-2017, 10:21 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I would literally give my mortgage payment to see piggy get killed like that and see no receivers get open....ahhhh, what a dream.  People would say how it was the scheme and his talent around him all along and now without them he has been exposed for the fat piece of shit he is....Ahhh, this makes me smile.  

Werdd !! preach it brother.

[HarleyDog]

Dalton deserves his credit. He’s not elite but is well above middle of the pack. Only thing about heat mizer that’s tough for many is his mistakes. Also, we hammer on players who give upon plays and I think Andy does this sometimes. Yet, when you look at qbs overall, they all make some pretty crappy decisions when pressured at times. Some more than others of course. Better OL, better Andy. He does seem to be adapting to the atrocious OL though.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-22-2017, 04:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I realize what you're trying to do by bringing up Schaub, but Schaub was an excellent QB for 6 years in Houston, until he pulled a Rick Ankiel. His good passer rating has been preserved by not playing over the last 4 years. Every other QB in the top 20 or so is still considered a good QB. Schaub was truly an anomaly.

How dare you bring commen sense and facts to this discussion?

[*SHRacerX*]

(11-22-2017, 11:22 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Thanks, and I agree with you. I like Cousins a lot. I'd trade Dalton for him. 

I just find it interesting when someone claims Cousins has had a terrible cast around him, yet I've never seen this person being fair to Andy about the actual crap that surrounds him, especially this season. There is no comparison between his current cast and what Cousins has dealt with. 

Dalton looked pretty damn good as a young QB in this league with Gruden as his OC, even better with Hue, then Dalton suddenly sucked and forgot how to play football.  Strange how that happened.  

[BengalsRocker]

(11-21-2017, 12:10 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: If Mike Brown would have only valued winning over $$$$

Kept Big Whit, told PA to take a hike and went out and found a C and RG in free agency. Fired Zampese in the off season and hired a real OC.

I have little to no doubt we'd be in the thick of the playoff hunt right now, probably even in contention for a bye !

7-3 is no stretch at all.

I'm pretty sure Mike Brown would get his underwear fixed by a tailor before going out and purchasing a new pair.

The man loves familiarity and comfort even if his ass or shriveled junk is hanging out there.

[*rfaulk34*]

(11-22-2017, 04:44 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You have mentioned this before. It ties him with matt Schaub.

That sounds kind of like a shot. 

Fun fact time.

In his 3 full seasons of starting (16 games), he posted 98.6, 92.0 and 90.7 ratings. Good for #7, #9 and #9 in the league. 

So...you're saying Dalton is pretty good?

[grampahol]

Always always always QBs get to take the credit when things go right and always always always take the blame when they go bad..
Consider QB stats when for example every receiver drops every pass thrown to them in a game. 
Suppose Andy threw 100 passes exactly on target, on time every time and every receiver drops every pass.. His stats would be absolutely horrible and other than just quitting and saying the hell with the team there would be nothing he could do to have better stats and even quitting wouldn't improve them..
Unfortunately QB stats are tied directly to the receivers ability to catch the damned ball and receivers stats are tied directly to the QBs ability to throw the ball to them..
I hate to risk sounding redundant, but it's still a team sport...
Andy's a darn good QB with a terrible Oline and quite a few so-so receivers.. 

[Luvnit2]

(11-23-2017, 11:31 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That sounds kind of like a shot. 

Fun fact time.

In his 3 full seasons of starting (16 games), he posted 98.6, 92.0 and 90.7 ratings. Good for #7, #9 and #9 in the league. 

So...you're saying Dalton is pretty good?

Some want to ignore Schaub was very good for a short amount of time, they just want to go to he flamed out at the end. I don't see AD getting worse (flaming out), in fact once you dive into the OL issues, no true number 2 receiver and the loss of a great pass catching TE (Eifert out again), and zilch for a running game, he looks pretty darn good.

But some will hate on AD regardless of the facts because they can't use the facts to support their argument. Dalton is no Brady and never will be. But, he is not even close to this team's problem winning games.

[*bfine32*]

(11-23-2017, 11:31 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That sounds kind of like a shot. 

Fun fact time.

In his 3 full seasons of starting (16 games), he posted 98.6, 92.0 and 90.7 ratings. Good for #7, #9 and #9 in the league. 

So...you're saying Dalton is pretty good?

Yes. Dalton is pretty good. 

[*bfine32*]

(11-23-2017, 12:33 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Some want to ignore Schaub was very good for a short amount of time, they just want to go to he flamed out at the end. I don't see AD getting worse (flaming out), in fact once you dive into the OL issues, no true number 2 receiver and the loss of a great pass catching TE (Eifert out again), and zilch for a running game, he looks pretty darn good.

But some will hate on AD regardless of the facts because they can't use the facts to support their argument. Dalton is no Brady and never will be. But, he is not even close to this team's problem winning games.

I'm not ignoring anything. Simply mentioned if you want to go by career passer rating Andy equals Shaub. A solid starter

[Shake n Blake]

(11-23-2017, 12:36 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I'm not ignoring anything. Simply mentioned if you want to go by career passer rating Andy equals Shaub. A solid starter

There's a lot of guys who are a bit less than solid then.

Derek Carr
Carson Palmer
Matt Stafford
Andrew Luck
Alex Smith
Ryan Tannehill
Jameis Winston
Cam Newton
Joe Flacco
Eli Manning

[*PhilHos*]

(11-23-2017, 10:22 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Dalton looked pretty damn good as a young QB in this league with Gruden as his OC, even better with Hue, then Dalton suddenly sucked and forgot how to play football.  Strange how that happened.  

Ummm, Dalton never "suddenly sucked". Last year, he threw over 4000 yards had a 18-8 TD-INT ratio and a QB rating over 90. This year, Dalton currently has 16 TDs and 8 INT and a QB rating over 90.

He's having his struggles, to be sure, but it's a far cry from sucking. 

[*Synric*]

You know how you hear about defenses forcing the QB to win games by stacking the box and shutting down the run?

It's funny because the defenses being used against Cincy is the opposite right now. Defensive Coordinators are running alot of slanted cover 2 against the Bengals they are begging them to run the football while doubling AJ Green.

[*PhilHos*]

(11-24-2017, 04:16 PM)Synric Wrote: You know how you hear about defenses forcing the QB to win games by stacking the box and shutting down the run?

It's funny because the defenses being used against Cincy is the opposite right now. Defensive Coordinators are running alot of slanted cover 2 against the Bengals they are begging them to run the football while doubling AJ Green.

It just goes to show how much our offensive line and running game suck if defenses are focusing on stopping the pass and they're STILL stopping our rushing attack. 

[Shake n Blake]

(11-24-2017, 04:16 PM)Synric Wrote: You know how you hear about defenses forcing the QB to win games by stacking the box and shutting down the run?

It's funny because the defenses being used against Cincy is the opposite right now. Defensive Coordinators are running alot of slanted cover 2 against the Bengals they are begging them to run the football while doubling AJ Green.

That's what happens when you average 68.0 yards rushing on 3.0 per carry. I've been a stats nerd for 25 years and I can't recall many teams having a run game that bad.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

I look at the 2011 quarterback draft class. Who, besides maybe Cam Newton, would have been a better selection for the Bengals than Andy Dalton?

[Shake n Blake]

(11-24-2017, 09:05 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: I look at the 2011 quarterback draft class.  Who, besides maybe Cam Newton, would have been a better selection for the Bengals than Andy Dalton?

Not so sure I'd take Cam over Andy, tbh. Just compare the stats:

Quote:2011
Andy: 3398 yards, 21 TDs, 80.4 rating, 152 rush yards
Cam: 4051 yards, 35 TDs, 84.5 rating, 706 rush yards

2012
Andy: 3669 yards, 31 TDs, 87.4 rating, 120 rush yards
Cam: 3869 yards, 27 TDs, 86.2 rating, 741 rush yards

2013
Andy: 4293 yards, 35 TDs, 88.8 rating, 183 rush yards
Cam: 3379 yards, 30 TDs, 88.8 rating, 585 rush yards

2014
Andy: 3398 yards, 24 TDs, 83.5 rating, 169 rush yards
Cam: 3127 yards, 23 TDs, 82.1 rating, 539 rush yards

2015
Andy: 4255 yards, 37 TDs, 106.2 rating, 189 rush yards (at the pace he was on)
Cam: 3837 yards, 45 TDs,  99.4 rating, 636 rush yards

2016
Andy: 4206 yards, 22 TDs, 91.8 rating, 184 rush yards
Cam: 3509 yards, 24 TDs, 75.8 rating, 359 rush yards 

2017
Andy: 3453 yards, 26 TDs, 90.7 rating, 91 rush yards (at current pace)
Cam: 3571 yards, 29 TDs, 83.0 rating, 698 rush yards (at current pace)

By my count, Andy wins 2 of those years (2013, 2016), Cam wins 2 (2011, 2015) and the rest are too close to call.