Report: Bengals are interested in Warford

[Sled21]

(05-13-2020, 08:34 AM)Fullrock Wrote: He didn't have back issues. He had a blood clot in his leg that forced his retirement. 

The blood clot may have forced the issue, but he was having back issues all along.....
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2018/10/28/18035002/bengals-og-clint-boling-back-injury-christian-westerman

[yellowxdiscipline]

(05-12-2020, 11:19 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Of the 5 teams. though I don;t know cap space for the Teams.. Texans and Buffalo should have a clear advantage.. they are the only winners of late of the teams.. Buffalo loves to run the ball so that is a plus for the and Texans have a dynamic QB..

Im going to pick Texans sign him

Didn't they also pour a bunch of money into Tunsil?

[*pally*]

(05-13-2020, 08:57 AM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: Didn't they also pour a bunch of money into Tunsil?

made him the highest paid tackle in football....by a lot..

 three-year, $66 million with over $50 million guaranteed

[Geno_Can_Dunk]

(05-13-2020, 02:20 AM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: In terms of cap, even at $7 mil (and I hope he'd be cheaper), we could sign him, extend Mixon & AJ, & still have $8-10 mill in space pretty easily. Sitting around $17 mil in space after signing the rookies. Worford at $7 takes us down to $10. But we probably cut Redmond as a result, freeing up more than $2 mil. Back at $12 or so. If we get a long term deal with AJ done, it likely comes in below $17.8 mil per year. Just spitballing, but say $13.8. That ticks us up to $16 million. Mixon makes just under $2 mil now, say he gets a $7 mil bump to $9 mil per. That leaves us $9 million worth of room. Give or take a mil or two. If you want to free up another mil or so, let Sims walk and go with 2 of Brown/Rose/Swann as our 5th-6th CBs.

I actually think this cap analysis is spot on. Only thing I would nitpick is the very last sentence. We just signed Sims, I doubt we'd turn around and cut him. 

IF we wanted to free up more room (and I'm not convinced it's necessary), my idea would be to try to find a trade partner for Alex Erickson. There were rumors as recently as a year ago that we had received trade offers for him. Probably not much, but maybe a late 2021 pick. Right now he's likely a #6 WR making over 2 million a year, and we'd save 1.9 but trading him. We extended him a couple years ago because of his return ability, but we have other, better returners now. And he's in a contract year. I wouldn't cut him, but if we could get something for him sure. Maybe we can't find any interest, but apparently we did a year ago and he didn't suddenly get worse. 

[Burreaux]

I would like to have Warford but I’m not sure how the numbers would work. You have AJ, Mixon, and Lawson wanting extensions. From reports I’ve read Mixon and AJ are wanting to be paid top tier at their positions. That doesn’t leave any wiggle room at all. I’d guess AJ is wanting 17-18 million per. Mixon is probably wanting 9-10 million minimum. I haven’t heard anything on what Lawson is expecting but he’s a guy I’d like them to keep.

[Au165]

The NFL raised their debt limits yesterday, which tells me they plan to lose their ass this season with everything going on. Don't be surprised if teams, especially smaller market teams like the Bengals, pull back a little. I think some of the extensions we are trying to get done may look a little different than usual. Potentially more roster bonuses in later years that push some of the money later after this. With that in mind, I kind of wonder if they already regret spending as much as they did and doubt they add any more outside free agent with the financial outlook being so uncertain.

[Luvnit2]

(05-12-2020, 11:15 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Very few, and if the 6th round kid won the job we’d have 2 guys at OT protecting Burrow that have none.

Plus our depth at OL is terrible. And for whatever reason the team seems to love Hart. I just don’t any scenario where he gets cut.

What round was the starting LT of the Steeler's drafted? Was he drafted at all?

Who gives a rats ass when someone was drafted or if they were drafted? We see 1st round picks flutter out all the time. 

If the Bengal's coaching think Johnson has the tools to be a starting OT, I will go with their opinion versus some message board dude who thinks they know all.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-12-2020, 11:15 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: We act like the team has the decision... the player has the decision.. if 5 teams are looking at him.. he is going to weigh any offers first from all the teams.. 

Good point.  And also taking into account that it's likely just a made up report, and some wishful thinking on my part.

[SadFaceBengal15]

(05-12-2020, 09:25 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Plug him in at RG, let XSF and Jordan compete at LG. I’d go ahead and cut Hart to free up the money, let Johnson and Adeniji compete at RT.

This^^^^^^^^

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-13-2020, 10:17 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: What round was the starting LT of the Steeler's drafted? Was he drafted at all?

Who gives a rats ass when someone was drafted or if they were drafted? We see 1st round picks flutter out all the time. 

If the Bengal's coaching think Johnson has the tools to be a starting OT, I will go with their opinion versus some message board dude who thinks they know all.

I guess we should just shut the board down then since our opinions are meaningless...

JFC get over yourself.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-13-2020, 10:12 AM)Au165 Wrote: The NFL raised their debt limits yesterday, which tells me they plan to lose their ass this season with everything going on. Don't be surprised if teams, especially smaller market teams like the Bengals, pull back a little. I think some of the extensions we are trying to get done may look a little different than usual. Potentially more roster bonuses in later years that push some of the money later after this. With that in mind, I kind of wonder if they already regret spending as much as they did and doubt they add any more outside free agent with the financial outlook being so uncertain.

I was looking at an article on CBS Sports that estimated that a season without fans in the stadiums, the league would lose an average of $70M per team in gate receipts alone.  $70M x 32 teams = $2.24B, and that's not counting any sponsorship, merchandise, advertising, or any of the potential losses of every business that generally receive from sporting event attendees.

[Geno_Can_Dunk]

I don't think anybody is saying Fred Johnson is doomed to be terrible because he wasn't drafted. I think it's more like the coaches have talked him up as a guy who has tools and could possible start one day, and suddenly message board dudes want to cut our only OT with any experience (Hart) and anoint Johnson the starting RT. That would be incredibly reckless. And not what the coaches have in mind.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-13-2020, 10:37 AM)Geno_Can_Dunk Wrote: I don't think anybody is saying Fred Johnson is doomed to be terrible because he wasn't drafted. I think it's more like the coaches have talked him up as a guy who has tools and could possible start one day, and suddenly message board dudes want to cut our only OT with any experience (Hart) and anoint Johnson the starting RT. That would be incredibly reckless. And not what the coaches have in mind.

Exactly. I’m pulling for Fred Johnson as much as anyone, but cutting Hart is a risky move. Gotta wait and see how things play out.

[phil413]

(05-12-2020, 09:25 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Plug him in at RG, let XSF and Jordan compete at LG.  I’d go ahead and cut Hart to free up the money, let Johnson and Adeniji compete at RT.

First sentence is ideal. If MJ is the guy the staff sees then he earns it and we have actual depth, something we haven't had in years 

Hart grades out average if you see PFF as credible, he is replacement level/fringe but his money doesn't inhibit a Warford signing.  Adeniji was drafted late as a project, if he surprises great but it's likely Hart vs Johnson at RT.  

[Wes Mantooth]

One thing I see mentioned quite a bit, whenever any potential signing or our cap space is brought up, is factoring in potentially extending AJ Green (along with Mixon).

Just so we're clear, IF we were to extend AJ it would most likely save us money against the cap for this season.

His current cap hit on the tag is is 18 mil dollars. Barring an extension where we choose to front-load the heck out of the contract, that number most likely comes down.

--Ex. 4 yrs, 55 mil @ average hits of 13.75. 2020 savings = 4.25 mil (This is just an example for simplicity sake. I have no clue what the true savings or number would be, only that the his 2020 hit of 18 mil is likely to go down)

I only bring this up because it seems there's confusion about cap considerations. While an AJ Green extension would require a big pile of money, and it would lock up future space that could be spent elsewhere, it doesn't necessarilly mean we need to set aside anything right now.

Mixon on the other hand is entirely different story. IMHO he's worth about 9-10 mil per on an early deal that rewards him with an immediate raise. His cap number would rise substantially, in the neighborhood of 8-9 mil.

In many of the threads this season, the backup QB ones for example, people have said "I'd rather use that money for AJ". Again, just so we're clear, a new deal for AJ doesn't prohibit you from spending elsewhere. A new deal increases 2020 cap space, not decreases.

On topic, this would be a great signing. Simply put, he's better than any guard on our roster and his market price seems more than reasonable. I'm not sure what's to argue about either of those statements. I guess the question is, even if we were to pursure him, would he want to come aboard?

I hope we do, and I hope he does. This would be a great example of "All In", and further cements the message that this teams is all about winning immediately.

*Fingers crossed.

[fredtoast]

(05-13-2020, 10:37 AM)Geno_Can_Dunk Wrote: I don't think anybody is saying Fred Johnson is doomed to be terrible because he wasn't drafted. I think it's more like the coaches have talked him up as a guy who has tools and could possible start one day, and suddenly message board dudes want to cut our only OT with any experience (Hart) and anoint Johnson the starting RT. That would be incredibly reckless. And not what the coaches have in mind.

It is like Christian Westerman all over again.  Plays one meaningless game at the end of the year and everyone falls in love with him.  It doesn't take much for fans to fall in love with a player.  Vinny Rey played one great game against the Ravens and fans were wanting to build the defense around him.  Cedric Peerman had one long run on preseason and many were calling for him to be a starter.

However, in this case the coaches seem to be higher on Johnson than they ever were for Westerman.

I know Bobby Hart is a favorite whipping buy for a lot of fans, but he played over a thousand snaps last year and only allowed 4.5 sacks with only 2 holding penalties.  I am not saying he is a great player.  I would have no problem replacing him if we find a better RT.  I am just saying he is far from the trash some people here claim he is.  They just hated him for his horrible 2018 season (just like I did), but refuse to see the improvement last year.

[Sled21]

(05-13-2020, 10:12 AM)Au165 Wrote: The NFL raised their debt limits yesterday, which tells me they plan to lose their ass this season with everything going on. Don't be surprised if teams, especially smaller market teams like the Bengals, pull back a little. I think some of the extensions we are trying to get done may look a little different than usual. Potentially more roster bonuses in later years that push some of the money later after this. With that in mind, I kind of wonder if they already regret spending as much as they did and doubt they add any more outside free agent with the financial outlook being so uncertain.

They still have minimums they have to spend to be in compliance.

[yellowxdiscipline]

(05-13-2020, 10:06 AM)Burreaux Wrote: I would like to have Warford but I’m not sure how the numbers would work. You have AJ, Mixon, and Lawson wanting extensions. From reports I’ve read Mixon and AJ are wanting to be paid top tier at their positions. That doesn’t leave any wiggle room at all. I’d guess AJ is wanting 17-18 million per. Mixon is probably wanting 9-10 million minimum. I haven’t heard anything on what Lawson is expecting but he’s a guy I’d like them to keep.

Warford could come at 7 million per year, which is a good deal for a excellent run blocking RG. Better then paying 7 million a year for a sub par RT like we currently are. AJ isnt going to get top tier money. He'll get something that is good for a 30+ oft injured wide receiver. I love AJ but he's not worth 17-18 million a year, and I hate the idea of paying that much for him. He won't fetch that amount on the open market even if he has a good season. 

[fredtoast]

I am not even convinced we have one solid NFL starter for our two OG positions.

Meanwhile the argument over Warford is if he is "great" or just "good". Some people like to poo-poo Pro Bowl selections, but 2/3rds of the voters are players and coaches who know a hell of a lot more about NFL talent than any of us.

We have made moves to address almost every hole in our lineup EXCEPT guard. This signing could actually be bigger than many of the other free agents we signed that were pretty much lateral moves to replace players that were not much worse (if any) than the guys we brought in. Warford would be BY FAR the best OG on our roster.

[Luvnit2]

(05-13-2020, 10:50 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: One thing I see mentioned quite a bit, whenever any potential signing or our cap space is brought up, is factoring in potentially extending AJ Green (along with Mixon).

Just so we're clear, IF we were to extend AJ it would most likely save us money against the cap for this season.

His current cap hit on the tag is is 18 mil dollars. Barring an extension where we choose to front-load the heck out of the contract, that number most likely comes down.  

--Ex. 4 yrs, 55 mil @ average hits of 13.75. 2020 savings = 4.25 mil (This is just an example for simplicity sake. I have no clue what the true savings or number would be, only that the his 2020 hit of 18 mil is likely to go down)

I only bring this up because it seems there's confusion about cap considerations.  While an AJ Green extension would require a big pile of money, and it would lock up future space that could be spent elsewhere, it doesn't necessarilly mean we need to set aside anything right now.

Mixon on the other hand is entirely different story.  IMHO he's worth about 9-10 mil per on an early deal that rewards him with an immediate raise.  His cap number would rise substantially, in the neighborhood of 8-9 mil.

In many of the threads this season, the backup QB ones for example, people have said "I'd rather use that money for AJ".  Again, just so we're clear, a new deal for AJ doesn't prohibit you from spending elsewhere.  A new deal increases 2020 cap space, not decreases.

On topic, this would be a great signing.  Simply put, he's better than any guard on our roster and his market price seems more than reasonable. I'm not sure what's to argue about either of those statements.  I guess the question is, even if we were to pursure him, would he want to come aboard?

I hope we do, and I hope he does.  This would be a great example of "All In", and further cements the message that this teams is all about winning immediately.

*Fingers crossed.

Spot on they could save in 2020 and push the money to future years