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(10-12-2015, 12:50 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Did we really upgrade the TE spot? Last year we had Eifert and Gresham and this year we have Eifert and 4 or so TEs that don't have a single reception all season. Eifert isn't balling because Gresham is gone, he's balling because he's healthy and Dalton is on fire. Gresham could have 0 receptions like the rest of our TEs, so I don't see what was upgraded other than Dalton and Eifert's elbow.
I'm done.
We are 5-0 and you wanna sit here and bicker about some former Bengals player because I dared to put into perspective just how well our current TE is doing by pointing out that his TD total through 5 games is our former guys ceiling every year he was here.
Yes we improved, a Healthy Eifert and No Gresham is an improvement over Healthy Gresham and No Eifert. Simple as that.
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(10-12-2015, 12:53 AM)TGISunday Wrote: Whoa, I've never seen BobJones mad before.
Not mad just find it ridiculous that we can't put into perspective just how well our young TE is doing by comparing our former TE. Maybe it's just me but Eifert matching Gresham's yearly average for TD's through 5 games is exciting for me.
We are 5-0 and we are arguing about Gresham.
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(10-12-2015, 12:59 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: I'm done.
We are 5-0 and you wanna sit here and bicker about some former Bengals player because I dared to put into perspective just how well our current TE is doing by pointing out that his TD total through 5 games is our former guys ceiling every year he was here.
Yes we improved, a Healthy Eifert and No Gresham is an improvement over Healthy Gresham and No Eifert. Simple as that.
I don't want to sit here and bicker about Gresham, but I don't want to sit here and delude myself into thinking his presence in 2014 was what kept this offense from being amazing. It sounds like your biggest gripe about 2014 was "no Eifert" and I still fail to see how that was Gresham's fault, that's all.
Eifert is better than Gresham...that's a given, but can't we have 2 TEs like last season in case you know, something happens? Or maybe use 2 TE sets? Or so on and so forth. I'm not arguing Gresham vs Eifert, I'm arguing Gresham vs. 0 catches from our other TEs and maaaaybe we'd be better with him, maybe not.
Let's just agree we're both high on glue over Eifert's play thus far, ok?
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(10-12-2015, 01:10 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I don't want to sit here and bicker about Gresham, but I don't want to sit here and delude myself into thinking his presence in 2014 was what kept this offense from being amazing. It sounds like your biggest gripe about 2014 was "no Eifert" and I still fail to see how that was Gresham's fault, that's all.
Honestly man, I'm still not even sure what the issue is.
I never once said that Gresham was the reason for our offensive deficiencies just simply stated that Eifert is doing great things right now and that it is nice to have a TE that isn't known for making silly mistakes at the worst times like Gresham had a tendency to do. You kept trying to twist it into something else when it was honestly a nonissue.
Edit:
I get what your saying but honestly I think it's a moot point since Gresham isn't healthy. Yea 2 solid TE's would be nice but I'm not sure how effective Gresham would have been this year with his health so far this season.
I'm with you though, loving Eifert's play this year so we can agree on that.
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(10-12-2015, 01:16 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Honestly man, I'm still not even sure what the issue is.
I never once said that Gresham was the reason for our offensive deficiencies just simply stated that Eifert is doing great things right now and that it is nice to have a TE that isn't known for making silly mistakes at the worst times like Gresham had a tendency to do. You kept trying to twist it into something else when it was honestly a nonissue.
Edit:
I get what your saying but honestly I think it's a moot point since Gresham isn't healthy. Yea 2 solid TE's would be nice but I'm not sure how effective Gresham would have been this year with his health so far this season.
I'm with you though, loving Eifert's play this year so lets just end this.
It seems like we agree on Eifert, and I'm not saying Gresham is great but I wouldn't turn down having a TE familiar with the system who is good for a decent stattline here at #2. Maybe Gresham wanted starter money, or maybe he said make me the #1 or nothing...I don't know. He sure as sugar isn't the #1 in AZ though.
EDIT: Ok, now I know where I picked up the imagined venom. When whodeywho said "Just goes to show the impact his loss last season had on this offense." I honestly thought he meant the loss of Gresham had a significant impact on making this offense better. My bad. Whodeywho and I tend to have certain disagreements over what exactly turned this franchise around lately, that's for sure.
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I really don't know what's happening Gresham might not have been the receiver Eifert is but I'd take him cheap as the number #2 constant inline TE cuz he did developed into one hell of a blocking TE.
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(10-12-2015, 01:21 AM)Nately120 Wrote: It seems like we agree on Eifert, and I'm not saying Gresham is great but I wouldn't turn down having a TE familiar with the system who is good for a decent stattline here at #2. Maybe Gresham wanted starter money, or maybe he said make me the #1 or nothing...I don't know. He sure as sugar isn't the #1 in AZ though.
Honestly I was one of the people that was alright with bringing him back cheap to be the #2 if the coaches were good with it but I understood both sides needing a change. I think Gresham and the coaches wanted to part ways and I think it has worked out for both sides, we have a TE playing lights out and some solid potential behind him and Gresham got to go play with Palmer on a stacked Cardinals team and may slowly get more reps in that offense as he gets healthy because even with the mental mistakes he is a better TE than guys like Fells and Niklas.
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(10-12-2015, 01:27 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Honestly I was one of the people that was alright with bringing him back cheap to be the #2 if the coaches were good with it but I understood both sides needing a change. I think Gresham and the coaches wanted to part ways and I think it has worked out for both sides, we have a TE playing lights out and some solid potential behind him and Gresham got to go play with Palmer on a stacked Cardinals team and may slowly get more reps in that offense as he gets healthy because even with the mental mistakes he is a better TE than guys like Fells and Niklas.
Fells is the closest thing they have to a receiving TE there. Gresham did have a back-breaking drop against the Rams though.
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I have one major concern on this team our safety duo. Iloka doesn't look the same since his ankle injury and Reggie is becoming OHalete 2.0. I expect a lot from those two and it seems were not getting the expected production from them.
On a positive our D line is back! Geno has already surpassed his sack total from last season and we have had 3 4 sack games from our defense this year(last year we had none).
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(10-11-2015, 11:44 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: And Eifert is easily one of the MVPs of the offense, don't you dare forget that. He was totally worth the first round draft pick.
Eifert is EVERYTHING I hoped Coffman would have been. Could you imagine if Kroft gets to the same level as Eifert. Freakin Scary
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Even though this thread got derailed, I didn't want to start a new one just for observations about the game so here goes:
The Bengals defensive line is doing there job. Every successful run, there was one gap that should have been filled by a LB or it was a cutback lane that wasn't filled by a LB. Even when running in nickel, the LBs should have had first contact with the RB within 2 yards of the LOS. I love Vinny Rey for what he has done to make this team and he is a tough, smart guy. Hawk had some decent run support, but Rey M is lacking on instincts, big time. This team needs Burfict and needs to start giving Dawson some snaps. It screams poor LB play and it needs help. I think Maualuga would be fine at SAM and our nickel package needs to get Dawson in there and, hopefully, Burfict before the end of the season.
The running game. Gio ended with 80 yards on 15 carries, but J Hills 13 yards on 8 carries just isn't cutting the mustard. I don't know if it is injury or what, but something is clearly wrong. I know the kid has talent, and I think the line was giving him opportunities. One more thing about J Hill: The Bengals need to throw him the ball. I think they did once deep down the sideline and despite him getting held, he REALLY made a great effort to get the ball instead of hoping for the penalty. If he got a few more targets, I think defenses would have to soften up just a tad against the run. It seems like they are just teeing off when Hill is in because they don't think of him the same way they think of Gio.
Dre Kirk needs to stop giving up on routes when he thinks the QB is down. Got burned again. Once, OK...twice, a problem. Can't happen any more, Dre. I don't want to hear "communication". You got lazy, there was no underneath route to protect, you simply gave up and got burned again.
Dennard is playing tougher and more "press" coverage, a la Adam Jones. This guy needs to keep getting more snaps. With the gigantic bust that Justin Gilbert is turning out to be this selection looks better every day.
Brandon Thompson played his best game as a NFL player. Great work, Yams. (That's for you Truck)
Dalton is our franchise QB and will be for a LONG time. Thank you, Andy. You never listened to the "noise". You just kept working and continued on the same trajectory you were on before last year's first year with Hue and the plethora of injuries.
Our coordinators are doing a fantastic job.
Brandon Tate gave us that one good play last week. Stop thinking you are helping by bringing out a kick 9 yards deep. The Bengals had starting field possessions of the 14, the 10, and the 16 because of your dumbass early in the game. You are not going to shut up Colin Cowherd because Dalton had to overcome poor field position. Just stop it.
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(10-12-2015, 10:38 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Even though this thread got derailed, I didn't want to start a new one just for observations about the game so here goes:
The Bengals defensive line is doing there job. Every successful run, there was one gap that should have been filled by a LB or it was a cutback lane that wasn't filled by a LB. Even when running in nickel, the LBs should have had first contact with the RB within 2 yards of the LOS. I love Vinny Rey for what he has done to make this team and he is a tough, smart guy. Hawk had some decent run support, but Rey M is lacking on instincts, big time. This team needs Burfict and needs to start giving Dawson some snaps. It screams poor LB play and it needs help. I think Maualuga would be fine at SAM and our nickel package needs to get Dawson in there and, hopefully, Burfict before the end of the season.
The running game. Gio ended with 80 yards on 15 carries, but J Hills 13 yards on 8 carries just isn't cutting the mustard. I don't know if it is injury or what, but something is clearly wrong. I know the kid has talent, and I think the line was giving him opportunities. One more thing about J Hill: The Bengals need to throw him the ball. I think they did once deep down the sideline and despite him getting held, he REALLY made a great effort to get the ball instead of hoping for the penalty. If he got a few more targets, I think defenses would have to soften up just a tad against the run. It seems like they are just teeing off when Hill is in because they don't think of him the same way they think of Gio.
Dre Kirk needs to stop giving up on routes when he thinks the QB is down. Got burned again. Once, OK...twice, a problem. Can't happen any more, Dre. I don't want to hear "communication". You got lazy, there was no underneath route to protect, you simply gave up and got burned again.
Dennard is playing tougher and more "press" coverage, a la Adam Jones. This guy needs to keep getting more snaps. With the gigantic bust that Justin Gilbert is turning out to be this selection looks better every day.
Brandon Thompson played his best game as a NFL player. Great work, Yams. (That's for you Truck)
Dalton is our franchise QB and will be for a LONG time. Thank you, Andy. You never listened to the "noise". You just kept working and continued on the same trajectory you were on before last year's first year with Hue and the plethora of injuries.
Our coordinators are doing a fantastic job.
Brandon Tate gave us that one good play last week. Stop thinking you are helping by bringing out a kick 9 yards deep. The Bengals had starting field possessions of the 14, the 10, and the 16 because of your dumbass early in the game. You are not going to shut up Colin Cowherd because Dalton had to overcome poor field position. Just stop it.
Great post!!! I'll make it easy and just say I agree with everything you said. My biggest concern down the road is our LB play and Kirkpatrick. They need to get things figured out real quick or they could be what derails this thing.
Sig compliments of ExtraRadiohead
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(10-11-2015, 11:43 PM)TGISunday Wrote: First of all, this was one of the more exciting regular season games in a long time...and the ending certainly lived up to the hype. Here are some of the things I'm thinking about, good and bad.
1) This team is battle-tested, and seems to have learned from earlier mistakes. Sometimes, it just takes a while to learn how to navigate the roller-coaster of emotions that comes with the NFL. They've grown up together, and are exorcising past demons.
2) Jeremy Hill's Sophomore slump continues. OK, it was a tough defense to run against...but Gio still seems to be making the most of his opportunities. Is the line just better at ZBS than it is the power run blocking that works for Jeremy better? Is he more hurt than we've been led to believe? I hope he comes around, because 3.3 ypc makes even the BJGE years more attractive by comparison.
3) We have the luxury of two great #2 WR's that have virtually the same stat lines--with the notable exception being MJ's 2 TDs over Sanu's zero to date. Moreover, I don't know how it will work, but I sure hope we can keep both of these guys. Otherwise, we might have to pick a quality WR early in the draft, because you and I both know we aren't bringing a FA in of any substance.
4) If the Steelers can't pull out a victory in SD (tall order), we're poised to run away with the division. 3 up after 5? Yes, thank you!
Oh yeah, WHO DEY!!
What do you think?
Not sure what's going on with Jeremy Hill. To me it seems like his is not making the right hole choices. I recall one play where he had plenty of room to bounce a play to the outside and he chose to cut up field and stoned for no gain. It's almost as if he's not seeing or reading the holes as well as last year.
I think the bye will help the team out on both sides of the ball, run game on offense and stopping the run on defense. If I remember correctly we had the same issues at this time last year and were much more consistent during the 2nd half of the season.
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(10-12-2015, 12:22 AM)bengalsfan73 Wrote: My observations from this game are similar to yours but I also have some others.
1. First off we are watching Andy become the qb that we all thought he could be when he took over the job after Carson left. He is more confident and he has a swagger about him that shows he has matured into a leader after his previous four seasons with the team and he is quickly becoming one of the best qbs in the league in the first half of the season. I know everyone will continue to say it does not matter because it is not the playoffs which is fair but he is not the same and anyone with common sense can see that. Also AJ is playing great right now and is showing why he is a top receiver in this league. We are fortunate to have two other threats in MJ and Sanu because finally teams cannot double team AJ without a chance of getting rocked by another of our receivers. What a luxury this is.
2. Our running game is good but could be better. I know I may get several people that will disagree with me but I honestly feel that Gio should get the majority of the carries from this point out as a starter and have Jeremy come in on shorter yardage plays and even at the goal line until he can get out of his slump that he is in.
3. Hands down the biggest threat and possible MVP of this team is Tyler Eifert. He is showing what we missed without him last year and what a mismatch he is for anyone on the defense. He is easily becoming the second best te in the league behind Gronk. What a difference he makes for this offense and especially Andy as a red zone threat.
4. I am a little concerned about our offensive line right now because they are not giving Andy the protection he needs. The holding on Whit today and it clearly was holding, could have been a back breaker for this team but it wasn't which was a great thing. Past teams would have folded after that.
5. As for the defense the run defense is a big question mark right now. They are giving up way too many yards on the ground. However, I think we all can see the difference that a healthy Geno is making on this defense. Dre has got to play better on the corner because it is getting hard to watch him getting burned at least once or twice every week.
6. I know Nugent made two key field goals today but it still makes me nervous when he lines up to try a field goal and even an extra point. I hope he continues to kick like he did today because that will hopefully give him the confidence he needs. As for special teams, Darrin Simmons has got to tell Brandon Tate to stop bringing out the ball from ten yards deep in the end zone because he is not very good. He nearly cost us on three different occasions with his horrible decisions. That has got to stop. We need to have Adam Jones returning because he is a difference maker returning kicks period. Today's call where they said he called for a fair catch was horrible. Last time I checked you have to raise your hands over your head when calling for a fair catch. Also the key play in this game at the end of regulation was the field goal team getting on the field within 10 seconds and I think Darrin Simmons deserves full credit for that. That was great timing to get the field goal and send it into overtime.
7. Finally I saw a team today that will not quit like previous teams have. They have a confidence about them and if they stay healthy I do not care what the rest of the country says they can beat anyone in the league period. They match up with anyone and they have the potential to make a deep run into the playoffs. I think this team is more talented than the 2005 group when Kimo Von Olhoffen took out Carson's knee, costing them the win against Pittsburgh and a potential trip to the Super Bowl that year. Today however made me even more proud to say that I have been a Bengals fan for my entire life and I will never change. Who Dey!!!
Broke up your post for readability and numbered the sections so I could respond.
1. I keep going to the NFL's stats page just to see Dalton leading the pack in yardage. And 11 TDs and 2 INTs? Last year he ended with 19 and 17...this is unreal! He's on pace to eclipse his team record 33 TDs not to mention he already has 2 rushing TDs so extrapolate that out and...yeah ~40 total TDs he could have this year with maybe less than 10 turnovers? OK I know I know, football doesn't work that way and there will be some tough weeks ahead, but it does put a big ol' smile on my face to think about.
2. This is the one place we might disagree. Gio may run better because teams also have to plan for Hill. Either way though, we're getting great value out of both of them who were each 2nd round picks. Of course, if we did give Gio more carries he might crack the top 5 on the above linked stat page (heck he might be #1). Then again, it's about the wins not the stats.
3. He really is and he's changed my mind about drafting 1st round TEs. I thought it was a waste. Now...if we draft another TE in the 1st next year, I'd be fine with that. He is basically another superstar receiver who also blocks.
4. Agreed. I think in the past Andy has covered for the OLine a bit by getting rid of the ball fast. I think he's expecting more of them now and if they don't deliver he is getting better at taking a sack (not perfect). The good news is, the line is still fairly talented and we can dig ourselves out of a big hole from a penalty or sack (sometimes). The bad news is, I'm still concerned about how Bodine is snapping in the shotgun formation, so add that to the list of issues to work on.
5. Yeah, we definitely seem weak on Run D. How soon do we get Vontaze back? Not that he can do it alone. That Seahawks RB was pretty speedy but there was some poor/sloppy tackling on his big run that needs to be cleaned up. We've got the Steelers and Leveon Bell on our schedule twice yet. Part of stopping them is not letting him run all over us. We're not ready yet.
6. I really liked what I saw out of Obarski in pre-season so it isn't like we don't have a kicker who could come in to replace Nuge. However, unless things get really bad, I suspect the team won't make a change with him or Tate. Which I agree with you in both places. I wish we could clone Adam Jones because I do understand the concern about him playing a defensive series and then also being a returner 100% of the time. Hopefully Alford will be ready to step in by next year at the latest.
7. The resiliency was amazing and surprising. I think Dalton may not have the world's most commanding voice or speech giving abilities, but he has focus and a great work ethic. When he's saying 'Calm down calm down' to the team after big plays, it is because he knows for a long comeback there is a lot of work in front of them. Can't get too excited about a TD if you still have to score another 10 points. And they did it. Also, again, credit to the defense for shutting out Seattle on at least 5 consecutive possessions to end the game. And boy we have a really interesting game on our schedule with Arizona don't we? New Bengals QB vs. Old Bengals QB. That should be a crazy one to watch. In 2005 we were flashier. Now we're more blue collar -- fewer super-stars but everyone is contributing strong. That may be the real way to go all the way in this league.
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(10-12-2015, 12:15 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Dear lord, we are 5-0 and we can't go 4 posts in a thread about the Bengals without mentioning Gresham. The guy is gone. Eifert is better. Mission accomplished. It's a free country, but feel free to let it go.
So if Andy Dalton ever gets replaced you promise not to bring him up?
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The biggest concern is definitely the run defense. That absolutely must improve, and soon, or it will bite the Bengals in the butt. Hopefully Burfict can get on the field soon, but that's no guarantee at all. The linebackers have to do their jobs like they did in the 4th quarter yesterday.
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(10-12-2015, 01:01 PM)StripesInSuffolk Wrote: The biggest concern is definitely the run defense. That absolutely must improve, and soon, or it will bite the Bengals in the butt. Hopefully Burfict can get on the field soon, but that's no guarantee at all. The linebackers have to do their jobs like they did in the 4th quarter yesterday.
I would love for Burfict to come back as a boss. What's the likelihood of that happening given the type of surgery he had? We could definitely use him, but I just don't see how effective he will be coming back from injury. At least not this year. Hope I'm wrong.
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(10-12-2015, 10:38 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Even though this thread got derailed, I didn't want to start a new one just for observations about the game so here goes:
The Bengals defensive line is doing there job. Every successful run, there was one gap that should have been filled by a LB or it was a cutback lane that wasn't filled by a LB. Even when running in nickel, the LBs should have had first contact with the RB within 2 yards of the LOS. I love Vinny Rey for what he has done to make this team and he is a tough, smart guy. Hawk had some decent run support, but Rey M is lacking on instincts, big time. This team needs Burfict and needs to start giving Dawson some snaps. It screams poor LB play and it needs help. I think Maualuga would be fine at SAM and our nickel package needs to get Dawson in there and, hopefully, Burfict before the end of the season.
The running game. Gio ended with 80 yards on 15 carries, but J Hills 13 yards on 8 carries just isn't cutting the mustard. I don't know if it is injury or what, but something is clearly wrong. I know the kid has talent, and I think the line was giving him opportunities. One more thing about J Hill: The Bengals need to throw him the ball. I think they did once deep down the sideline and despite him getting held, he REALLY made a great effort to get the ball instead of hoping for the penalty. If he got a few more targets, I think defenses would have to soften up just a tad against the run. It seems like they are just teeing off when Hill is in because they don't think of him the same way they think of Gio.
Dre Kirk needs to stop giving up on routes when he thinks the QB is down. Got burned again. Once, OK...twice, a problem. Can't happen any more, Dre. I don't want to hear "communication". You got lazy, there was no underneath route to protect, you simply gave up and got burned again.
Dennard is playing tougher and more "press" coverage, a la Adam Jones. This guy needs to keep getting more snaps. With the gigantic bust that Justin Gilbert is turning out to be this selection looks better every day.
Brandon Thompson played his best game as a NFL player. Great work, Yams. (That's for you Truck)
Dalton is our franchise QB and will be for a LONG time. Thank you, Andy. You never listened to the "noise". You just kept working and continued on the same trajectory you were on before last year's first year with Hue and the plethora of injuries.
Our coordinators are doing a fantastic job.
Brandon Tate gave us that one good play last week. Stop thinking you are helping by bringing out a kick 9 yards deep. The Bengals had starting field possessions of the 14, the 10, and the 16 because of your dumbass early in the game. You are not going to shut up Colin Cowherd because Dalton had to overcome poor field position. Just stop it.
I agree that the LBs are certainly a liability right now. Pretty funny for a Marvin Lewis football team, but this is what happens when you rely on undrafted guys and old veterans. Hopefully Burfict comes back strong and PJD gets some playtime as you metioned. I personally think Lamur is a liability out there. He makes a good flash play here and there, but the rest of the time he looks lost. I saw you mentioning Dre K with his blown coverage but I think that was part Lamurs fault as well.
The running game is fine to me. I think what is happening with Hill is what happened to Gio in the preseason. Runners sometimes get good looks, other times they don't. Right now Gio is getting the looks and making the plays, most of Hills runs were stuffed in the backfield. Seattles run D was no joke either. Our line was getting beat off the ball which they rarely do, as much as I hate Micheal Bennett, the guy is a good player... along with avril and bruce Irvin. Anywho, Hill will be ok, unless he does indeed have some lingering knee issue, but I don't think he does. Marvin said something to the extent that Gio plays when we are behind and passing, Hill plays when we are ahead and chewing clock. I think its somewhat true that you would want Gio out there in hurry up catch up offense.
I really like our corners, they have played well so far. Adam Jones is having the best year of his career, and Dre K and Dennard are the next wave of shutdown tandems. What happened to Reggie tho? His attempted strip tackle of Rawls made me want to cry lol. I love Reggie bud DAMN! Iloka looked decent, but I think he is still nursing the ankle.
Daltons audible to the QB sneak was bada**. It was very Tom Brady like. In fact, I don't think anyone other than Brady or Rodgers could do what Dalton did against Seattle yesterday. Impressive.
Brandon Tate went crazy yesterday and I don't know what he was thinking. At the same time, Darren Simmons needs to fix the blocking on the returns. I don't know if they weren't blocking because they thought tate would knee it or if it was just that bad. Either way, tate shouldn't have to dodge 4 guys. All around bad special teams on KR.
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Dalton's throws are much different than his previous seasons. Instead of floating a biscuit, he is becoming his moniker - The Red Rifle. A lot of zip and acceleration on his throws this time around.
#WhoDey
#RuleTheJungle
#TheyGottaPlayUs
#WeAreYourSuperBowl
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(10-12-2015, 11:57 AM)PApinhead Wrote: Great post!!! I'll make it easy and just say I agree with everything you said. My biggest concern down the road is our LB play and Kirkpatrick. They need to get things figured out real quick or they could be what derails this thing.
Agreed, and thanks. I really think that the LBs will be better and Burfict and Dawson will become a part of this team's playoff run. Kirkpatrick has all the talent in the world, but he needs to stay focused. I have faith in the coaches and these players. It is nice to nitpick over a few details when the overall picture is so positive.
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