We’re probably stuck with Taylor

[Yojimbo]

Not sure who would do the actual firing Mike or Katie, but Mike has said in the past, the only thing that moves him on a coach is an empty stadium. Pretty much wipes out firing Zac this year for obvious reasons. But, if the fans don’t come back next year when having a “full” stadium is a possibility, maybe then Zac ends up on a hot seat.

[*psychdoctor*]

I have said before in other threads, Taylor is not going anywhere. The team played well enough to beat the Colts, and that is what Mike Brown will see as progress. Not Wins. Progress. NOT WINS!

Also, Taylor still has some dead wood to cut from this team and open up some cap space. I will let you guess what and who that dead would would be.

[Sled21]

Are all of you new here. Mike Brown is not going to fire any coach without giving them at least 3 years to get their guys and implement their systems. Never has, never will.

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-19-2020, 10:49 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: The team played well enough to beat the Colts

No they didn't.

If they had played well enough to beat the Colts then they would have beaten the Colts.  You know we lost, right?

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-19-2020, 10:57 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: No they didn't.

If they had played well enough to beat the Colts then they would have beaten the Colts.  You know we lost, right?

no shit genius.  But Mike Brown will see it as close to a win, a win they should have had.  

[TecmoBengals]

(10-19-2020, 12:26 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: This is extremely concerning...

https://mobile.twitter.com/joegoodberry/status/1317930536975859714

I have to laugh because Dehner's reply says, "10 years." Imagine if we have Taylor for 10 years. At his current pace, it will take him until 2025 or later to get his 10th career win as a head coach. 

[Geno_Can_Dunk]

I see it like this:

If we had a vastly improved roster, one in which the highest paid players were actually contributing, would this coaching staff still put a losing team on the field? I don't know, I really don't. And for all the phony expertise that flies around this board, I don't think any of us here do.

If we had the coaching staff so many around here want, let's say Bienemy and his choice of assistants, would they make a winning team out of this roster, with so much cap space going to basically useless players? No. That much I can confidently say.

That is to say IOW that our roster really holds us back. Old Core guys like Green, Dunlap and Atkins sucking up cap room and not producing is a ball and chain that has been waiting us down as long as ZT has been here. (Reader and Waynes too but that's due to injury).

I figure we'll win 3 more games this year. The FO will say "hey, we knew there'd be growing pains, but we didn't know it'd be with such a ball and chain around his ankle. Let's get rid of that and see how he does. He still has them playing hard after all."

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-19-2020, 10:49 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I have said before in other threads, Taylor is not going anywhere.  The team played well enough to beat the Colts, and that is what Mike Brown will see as progress.  Not Wins.  Progress.  NOT WINS!  

Also, Taylor still has some dead wood to cut from this team and open up some cap space.  I will let you guess what and who that dead would would be.

I totally get what you're saying Dr. But at some point, and to me it's already been reached, moral victories just aren't cutting it anymore. 

What's going to be the excuse next season ? "Well we're getting closer but blah, blah, blah happened so..........

[Sled21]

(10-19-2020, 11:14 AM)Geno_Can_Dunk Wrote: I see it like this:

If we had a vastly improved roster, one in which the highest paid players were actually contributing, would this coaching staff still put a losing team on the field? I don't know, I really don't. And for all the phony expertise that flies around this board, I don't think any of us here do.

If we had the coaching staff so many around here want, let's say Bienemy and his choice of assistants, would they make a winning team out of this roster, with so much cap space going to basically useless players? No. That much I can confidently say.

That is to say IOW that our roster really holds us back. Old Core guys like Green, Dunlap and Atkins sucking up cap room and not producing is a ball and chain that has been waiting us down as long as ZT has been here. (Reader and Waynes too but that's due to injury).

I figure we'll win 3 more games this year. The FO will say "hey, we knew there'd be growing pains, but we didn't know it'd be with such a ball and chain around his ankle. Let's get rid of that and see how he does. He still has them playing hard after all."

One more draft and free agency..... then they will evaluate him.

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-19-2020, 11:14 AM)Geno_Can_Dunk Wrote: I see it like this:

If we had a vastly improved roster, one in which the highest paid players were actually contributing, would this coaching staff still put a losing team on the field? I don't know, I really don't. And for all the phony expertise that flies around this board, I don't think any of us here do.

If we had the coaching staff so many around here want, let's say Bienemy and his choice of assistants, would they make a winning team out of this roster, with so much cap space going to basically useless players? No. That much I can confidently say.

That is to say IOW that our roster really holds us back. Old Core guys like Green, Dunlap and Atkins sucking up cap room and not producing is a ball and chain that has been waiting us down as long as ZT has been here. (Reader and Waynes too but that's due to injury).

I figure we'll win 3 more games this year. The FO will say "hey, we knew there'd be growing pains, but we didn't know it'd be with such a ball and chain around his ankle. Let's get rid of that and see how he does. He still has them playing hard after all."

I think we're right back where we were before. The only chance we have is for the players to overcome the far less than stellar coaching.

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-19-2020, 11:17 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: I totally get what you're saying Dr. But at some point, and to me it's already been reached, moral victories just aren't cutting it anymore. 

What's going to be the excuse next season ? "Well we're getting closer but blah, blah, blah happened so..........

I am not saying I agree with this approach.  Wins matter to most franchises and sports.  But MIKE BROWN does not measure progress by wins.  Never has.  

Mike Brown will view Bengals performance in the first quarter against the NFL's number 1 defense as significant progress.  Hell, even twitter was exploding at how awesome the OL, defense, everything was clicking.  I think the Colts were in shock.  

[fredtoast]

(10-19-2020, 02:07 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote:

How many times did you post this before the free agency period this last offseason?

I am not denying Mike Brown's history, but that history is out the window.

No one is going to say we should dump Taylor right now, and I agree.  So they are going to support him until he is fired.  I don't have much faith in Taylor, but any first time head coach deserves at least 2 full seasons.  

But after the front office spent all that money on free agents I don't think they are going to keep a head coach who makes no progress with them.

[fredtoast]

(10-19-2020, 11:37 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I am not saying I agree with this approach.  Wins matter to most franchises and sports.  But MIKE BROWN does not measure progress by wins.  Never has.  

Yes he has.  That is why Dick LeBeau only got two drafts and two full seasons as head coach.

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-19-2020, 11:56 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes he has.  That is why Dick LeBeau only got two drafts and two full seasons as head coach.

I believe Brown saw the disrespect by other teams, like the Ravens beat down and decided to let LeBeau go.  That is why when the Ravens (ironically) beat down the Bengals this year I thought Taylor would be in trouble.  But After  the Colts game, at least for one Quarter, the Bengals looked amazing on all phases.  Yes, they did not win, but Brown will focus on that as progress.  

I think Bengals will win 4-5 games this year, I had them winning 6 games and thought they would beat the Colts.  so essentially, Taylor goes 2 wins first year, 5 wins or so second (progress), third year he would need to make playoffs or win 10 or so games.  

[*psychdoctor*]

The one stat that may be Taylor's undoing is one-score losses.

I think Chargers, Eagles, Browns, now Colts have been one score losses or tie, which dating back to 8 last year brings the total 12 losses and 1 tie.

[Bengalholic]

(10-19-2020, 11:56 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes he has.  That is why Dick LeBeau only got two drafts and two full seasons as head coach.

Not really. He was under a ton of pressure to make a change and attendance was becoming a major issue...and maybe the biggest factor - it was easier for him to move on from LeBeau because his contract expired and he didn't have to fire him.

Even in that situation though, Mike was defensive about making the change: 'We're better than our won-loss record would indicate. I can say the things I'm saying, and really nobody wants to hear them. I can believe it, but no one else cares.'

[*Nately120*]

Spin it!

[Sled21]

(10-19-2020, 11:54 AM)fredtoast Wrote: How many times did you post this before the free agency period this last offseason?

I am not denying Mike Brown's history, but that history is out the window.

No one is going to say we should dump Taylor right now, and I agree.  So they are going to support him until he is fired.  I don't have much faith in Taylor, but any first time head coach deserves at least 2 full seasons.  

But after the front office spent all that money on free agents I don't think they are going to keep a head coach who makes no progress with them.

With the exception of Alexander and Bell, all of those free agents are not on the field due to injury. Not exactly Taylor's fault. And how many DT's have we lost now... 6?

[WhodeyRay]

I look at Taylor like Syphilis. They said it could not be cured then came penicillin. May someone please step up and be our penicillin.

[*ochocincos*]

Can we keep Taylor the HC but get rid of Taylor the offensive playcaller?
Can we get rid of Jim Turner?
Can we get rid of Lou Anarumo (although not before the above two)?
What about Nick Eason (DL coach) or Al Golden (LB coach)?