We Would Have Won If Dunlap and Atkins Played

[*ochocincos*]

(10-26-2020, 11:34 AM)Wyche Wrote: I get it, but they're both making a ton of money to be impact players. They haven't been thus far, although Geno has been hurt. Carlos has either lost a couple steps, or he's sandbagging. Either way, too much money tied up for that. Hopefully we see more Atkins as he heals, and he becomes at least a little disruptive. I think the ship has sailed on Dunlap, and it pains me to say that. I've always been a fan. I'm not gonna go out and diminish anything he's done in the past in Cincy, but it's time to cut bait.

I agree.
I'm just pointing out they are not getting the snaps. It's impossible for them to earn their pay if they are benched.

[Yojimbo]

(10-26-2020, 11:38 AM)WychesWarrior Wrote: I wouldn't say I'm upset, but it speaks to a lack of maturity on his part. As long as he's been in this league, he should know how the business operates by now. A simple "trade me" would suffice. Sending out pics of the depth chart, and putting your house up for sale is pretty Bush League in my opinion.

Yeah, I'd like to know that myself. Lou should be on a very hot seat, to be clear. Dunlap shouldn't even be able to sit in his seat at this point.

I’m trying not to make assumptions about what has been discussed behind closed doors, if anything was, before he went public, but for all we know he started with a simple “trade me” and they said no.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 11:49 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: The Enquirer podcast I listened to yesterday, from Friday morning, said Geno’s snaps have been coming as a 1-technique NT. Can anybody confirm or debunk this? That’s a terrible misuse of his skills if true.

Hard to tell....when they go to that 3-4 look, that'd be where he lined up. Sunday I saw him at his normal position, as we were running the 4-3 predominantly.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 11:49 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I agree.
I'm just pointing out they are not getting the snaps. It's impossible for them to earn their pay if they are benched.

Absolutely....with Dunlap, we saw him playing a great deal early on, and he was largely ineffective, save for one game. With Geno, it's hard to say with the injury. I hope we see more and more of him as the season progresses, and he can play at least 75% of what he was. That's better than anyone else inside at the moment.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-26-2020, 11:49 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: The Enquirer podcast I listened to yesterday, from Friday morning, said Geno’s snaps have been coming as a 1-technique NT. Can anybody confirm or debunk this?

If that's true, I imagine it's because of being primarily in a 3-4 and the team not feeling he fits well enough at DE.
I would need to go watch the All-22 film to confirm that that's why he's getting snaps at NT though.

[Yojimbo]

(10-26-2020, 11:41 AM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Also, guys like Reggie White, that guy on the Colts whose name escapes me at the moment, Harrison, and several other pass rush specialists had their snaps cut way down as they aged, but they still got out there and made plays when called upon, cold legs or not.

Players come in all different flavors and motors. I’ve heard over and over again from players across several sports about the need to “warm up” or “get in a rhythm” to be effective. Other guys’ motors run at 100% all the time even off the field. If Dunlap and Atkins are the former type of players, this scheme won’t work for them.

Mathis or Freeney?

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 11:52 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: I’m trying not to make assumptions about what has been discussed behind closed doors, if anything was, before he went public, but for all we know he started with a simple “trade me” and they said no.

Could be, but he could've also put that on Twitter, instead of all this drama stuff. I'm not a fan of him posting the depth chart publicly.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-26-2020, 11:54 AM)Wyche Wrote: Absolutely....with Dunlap, we saw him playing a great deal early on, and he was largely ineffective, save for one game. With Geno, it's hard to say with the injury. I hope we see more and more of him as the season progresses, and he can play at least 75% of what he was. That's better than anyone else inside at the moment.

I personally think they aren't fitting well as the team converts more and more to a 3-4.
The team seems to think Dunlap is best at OLB when in a 3-4, but I personally think he's a better fit at 3-4 DE.
For Atkins, he doesn't fit at 3-4 NT, but perhaps the team feels he's too short and/or heavy for DE.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 11:56 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: Players come in all different flavors and motors. I’ve heard over and over again from players across several sports about the need to “warm up” or “get in a rhythm” to be effective. Other guys’ motors run at 100% all the time even off the field.  If Dunlap and Atkins are the former type of players, this scheme won’t work for them.

Mathis or Freeney?

Good point....about the motor, maybe they should ride the bike on the sidelines...lol.

I believe it was Mathis....but now I'm confused, because I forgot about Freeney. Getting old sucks...lol.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 11:58 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I personally think they aren't fitting well as the team converts more and more to a 3-4.
The team seems to think Dunlap is best at OLB when in a 3-4, but I personally think he's a better fit at 3-4 DE.
For Atkins, he doesn't fit at 3-4 NT, but perhaps the team feels he's too short and/or heavy for DE.

Yes, there is something to be said for this....and it appears that the team is trying to move to a 3-4 scheme. As it is now, it looks like a hybrid. If the team is indeed moving to a 3-4, the Reader acquisition looks even smarter now...but there will definitely be growing pains as the personnel has been geared to a 4-3 for almost 20 years. If they can't adapt, then you need to move them.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-26-2020, 12:04 PM)Wyche Wrote: Yes, there is something to be said for this....and it appears that the team is trying to move to a 3-4 scheme. As it is now, it looks like a hybrid. If the team is indeed moving to a 3-4, the Reader acquisition looks even smarter now...but there will definitely be growing pains as the personnel has been geared to a 4-3 for almost 20 years. If they can't adapt, then you need to move them.

If the team moves to full-time or majority 3-4, I like Reader as starting NT with Tupou as backup.
Hubbard and Lawson are fine at OLB, but they need an actual quality pass rusher or two at DE to help.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-26-2020, 12:14 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If the team moves to full-time or majority 3-4, I like Reader as starting NT with Tupou as backup.
Hubbard and Lawson are fine at OLB, but they need an actual quality pass rusher or two at DE to help.

Yep, that would be critical...and would probably make the unit look totally different. Pass rush is the biggest weakness I've seen from them. It just kills everything else.

[Wire22Wire]

Next year, I would like to see us make plays at:

Solomon Thomas - coming off acl injury, SF declined his 5th year option, hes a young, skilled, powerful DT/DL

Brandon Scherff OG

More to come, but there is a start

[*ochocincos*]

(10-26-2020, 12:19 PM)Wire22Wire Wrote: Next year, I would like to see us make plays at:

Solomon Thomas - coming off acl injury, SF declined his 5th year option, hes a young, skilled, powerful DT/DL

Brandon Scherff OG

More to come, but there is a start

I would agree on Solomon Thomas only if they go back to primarily a 4-3.
I think Thomas's best fit is 4-3 UT, not a 3-4 DE or NT.

[J24]

(10-26-2020, 11:58 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I personally think they aren't fitting well as the team converts more and more to a 3-4.
The team seems to think Dunlap is best at OLB when in a 3-4, but I personally think he's a better fit at 3-4 DE.
For Atkins, he doesn't fit at 3-4 NT, but perhaps the team feels he's too short and/or heavy for DE.

He could play nose in a 3-4 he is strong enough to do so. I Remember Jay Rattlf did it for the Cowboys. Anyways the 3-4 vs 4-3 should not be that big of a deal considering were in Nickle 70% of the time anyways.

[coachmcneil71]

(10-26-2020, 11:00 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I guess playing at a top tier level might have this team 5-2 and not in the market to trade them.  

Perhaps, but the point is that they obviously want out of here. Something is going on internally. I'm pretty sure that it's under qualified coaching.

The HC is a young c***sure bullshitter that has managed to fool someone in the FO. And, the DC was terrible even when there were no injuries. I'm really tired of hearing the injury excuses. This team is going on two years of total ineptitude on the defensive side of the ball.

The HC should be holding the DC accountable, he isn't. That's on the HC. Obviously, neither is doing their job.

[PCB Bengal Fan]

(10-25-2020, 06:24 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Can't wait to get our two stud DL back. Would have been a for sure W today if we had one of our highest priced players make even one play today. We need that veteran leadership on D.

Has anyone thought that maybe the play calls on defense is the culprit for all this? I counted 2 pass blitzes the whole game. Contain the quarterback & make him beat you through the air? Which he did. I will side with players over Anouwhatshisname every time. In over his head.

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-25-2020, 06:24 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Can't wait to get our two stud DL back. Would have been a for sure W today if we had one of our highest priced players make even one play today. We need that veteran leadership on D.

Care to take a guess on how many times i've heard "we would have won if..." in the last 40+ years?

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-25-2020, 06:28 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: I thought the sarcasm was obvious. Apparently not obvious enough for some any.

Fixed

[*SHRacerX*]

(10-26-2020, 03:10 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: Perhaps, but the point is that they obviously want out of here. Something is going on internally. I'm pretty sure that it's under qualified coaching.

The HC is a young c***sure bullshitter that has managed to fool someone in the FO. And, the DC was terrible even when there were no injuries. I'm really tired of hearing the injury excuses. This team is going on two years of total ineptitude on the defensive side of the ball.

The HC should be holding the DC accountable, he isn't. That's on the HC. Obviously, neither is doing their job.

Stop it, dude.  You aren't in the locker room and I, for one, think it is pretty cool that some of the other players are standing up for the coaching staff.  

Look at what this young bullshitter has done to this offense adding only Burrow and Higgins (and Jonah Williams)....all essentially rookies and all with no preseason.  The team is throwing up 30 burgers on anyone not named ratbirds.  

How much do you expect the DC to accomplish when his best DE is an out-of-shape malcontent.  His best 3T is opting out without opting out.  His best NT is out injured for the season.  His 2nd best DE is out injured.  He had two backup DT lost due to injury and a 3rd opted out.  He is playing without his best CB this past week, and without his biggest money FA CB all season thus far.  I'm sure you will call these excuses, but are they not at least the smallest bit legitimate gripes?  And don't forget that Logan Wilson, ADG, and Khalid Kareem are all getting significant playing time and doing quite well despite being rookies with no preseason.

I get this loss stings, but look across the field:  The Browns had Miles Garrett and Denzel Ward out there and couldn't stop Burrow ONCE.  NO PUNTS.  Defense isn't easy.  

Like I said, I think this team is 5-2 if Dunlap is playing like he did at the end of last season and we had an interested Geno playing next to Reader.  As it is, there will be no fools gold this year.  They are evaluating the young talent and will know who can be counted on next year and who should be traded or released.