How is Carlos Dunlap Still Here?

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-27-2020, 02:24 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: But seriously, they can't reward him for his temper tantrum.

What about rewarding themselves?  They can reward themselves by getting rid of a cancer and distraction, and also save 4 million bucks in the process.

Paying Carlos Dunlap millions of more dollars just to prove a point seems terribly unwise.  Our focus should be on what helps this team.  

[Hoofhearted]

(10-27-2020, 02:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: According to this coaching staff he is worse than scrubs we can sign off the street.

If they are correct then we will not get anything in trade, but we will save money if we release him and be able to sign someone better off the street.

We did it with Preston Brown last year, so why not just cut Dunlap if he is as bad as the coaches think.

Clearly they think this, but doesn't mean other teams do. He is just removed from a decent season last year, though it was only half a year he played well. Teams know that he just doesn't care, not that he lacks talent. They could also try to swing a trade before the draft.They could find a way to get out of dead money by releasing him for breaking his contractual clauses. Just a lot of different scenarios they could be preparing for, and it's smart to (again) get anything at all for him. 

I am fine if they simply release him. It makes sense considering his value and situation. But I would try hell and high water to get bag of footballs for him if someone were to offer it. 

[Hoofhearted]

(10-27-2020, 02:40 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: What about rewarding themselves?  They can reward themselves by getting rid of a cancer and distraction, and also save 4 million bucks in the process.

Paying Carlos Dunlap millions of more dollars just to prove a point seems terribly unwise.  Our focus should be on what helps this team.  

They can do that and possibly get an asset in return. I want to maximize what little value he has. A 5-6th round pick helps this team. Not arguing it's unwise to pay him to sit at home, but it's also unwise to not look at every possible scenario that helps the team win moving forward. You already made the bed by paying him so much, so you're really only left with trying to get anything of value for that. 

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-27-2020, 02:55 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: They can do that and possibly get an asset in return. I want to maximize what little value he has. A 5-6th round pick helps this team. Not arguing it's unwise to pay him to sit at home, but it's also unwise to not look at every possible scenario that helps the team win moving forward. You already made the bed by paying him so much, so you're really only left with trying to get anything of value for that. 

Just to be clear, we're in agreement.  If they can get something for him then they should.

But in the meantime, at least fine him, suspend him, or make a statement that clearly admonishes him.

As far as getting something for him, I think they should have generally idea now whether that's going to be possible or not.  One would assume they've had talks.  They've got one week left to get something done, so they if they're going to do something it's gonna have to be soon.

I'm not getting my hopes up.  I just don't see him having any value. 

[The Caped Crusader]

I'm honestly a bit surprised he is here. Clearly we aren't finding what we want in return. The irony is we have nothing by keeping him, other than someone who is unhappy that you're paying. This is where the organization makes no sense.

[WhodeyRay]

(10-27-2020, 02:40 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: What about rewarding themselves?  They can reward themselves by getting rid of a cancer and distraction, and also save 4 million bucks in the process.

Paying Carlos Dunlap millions of more dollars just to prove a point seems terribly unwise.  Our focus should be on what helps this team.  

Shit give me the 4 mill! I will through a fit and kick everyone in the front office right in the nutsack! This includes Katie as well.

[CJD]

My guess is that Brown is not willing to cut him, so he'll only remove him from the team if we can trade him, but we are asking a 2nd rounder for him (or some other ridiculous price tag) and teams are, obviously, not willing to offer that much because they see he isn't producing and they also see that he will leave this team soon regardless because his situation here has become so toxic.

When you have no leverage, you can't really get a deal done.

[J24]

Were not a well run organization that's why he still is here.

[fredtoast]

If the Bengals get a draft pick in exchange for Dunlap they will be admitting that he had more value than scrubs you can sign off the street.

In other words it will make the judgement of their coaches look bad.

That is why they won't do it. It would embarrass the coaches.

[Luvnit2]

(10-27-2020, 01:27 PM)BengalChris Wrote: I believe it's really simple. The only option is to trade Dunlap at this point, otherwise the team gets nothing at all.

Unfortunately, the team is known of its stubborness and unrealistic trade demands, not to mention that they move very slowly on trades because there has to be a committee meeting to decide anything and someone is bound to bring up some reason or other to throw the committee into an indecision.

I do believe a trade will occur. Unfortunately, I don't believe the front office is capable of discussing more than one trade at a time and they have Ross and AJ to deal away also, possibly even Willie Jackson as well.

This much committee action could send them all into brain lock.

Didn't the Jags trade a very unhappy Jalen Ramsey? I know Dunlap is not Ramsey, but if they keep him on roster or suspend him without pay), the likely he brings a 3rd or 4th round comp pick as someone will pay him and sign him.

Bigger point is an attorney or 2 or 3 of the Bengals is looking at the contract right now. Can they suspend him without pay an dthen win in court? At same time, they are trying to trade him. Again, some needy playoff teams would love Dunlap for 2020 and 2021 in my opinion.

Other option is cut him and then team that signs him (he could talk to all 31 teams to get best deal for him), any contract he gets from them in 2020 offsets the Bengals contract leaving Bengals on the hook for only the difference.

[Luvnit2]

(10-27-2020, 03:08 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Just to be clear, we're in agreement.  If they can get something for him then they should.

But in the meantime, at least fine him, suspend him, or make a statement that clearly admonishes him.

As far as getting something for him, I think they should have generally idea now whether that's going to be possible or not.  One would assume they've had talks.  They've got one week left to get something done, so they if they're going to do something it's gonna have to be soon.

I'm not getting my hopes up.  I just don't see him having any value. 

It is hard to disagree, but AB and Ramsey both got jobs quickly in the NFL after locker room BS.

[BengalChris]

(10-27-2020, 03:51 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Didn't the Jags trade a very unhappy Jalen Ramsey? I know Dunlap is not Ramsey, but if they keep him on roster or suspend him without pay), the likely he brings a 3rd or 4th round comp pick as someone will pay him and sign him.

Bigger point is an attorney or 2 or 3 of the Bengals is looking at the contract right now. Can they suspend him without pay an dthen win in court? At same time, they are trying to trade him. Again, some needy playoff teams would love Dunlap for 2020 and 2021 in my opinion.

Other option is cut him and then team that signs him (he could talk to all 31 teams to get best deal for him), any contract he gets from them in 2020 offsets the Bengals contract leaving Bengals on the hook for only the difference.

I believe, due to Dunlaps age and service length that the Bengals would get nothing more than a 5th round comp pick, plus he's contracted through next season. You would not see a comp pick until 2023 and after not playing for a season and a half, Dunlap wouldn't bring enough to get any comp pick at all.

Why go through all of that when he could be traded now?

If you trade him his contract will go with him, provided that's part of the deal. The Bengals could agree to eat some of the salary for a higher pick. But Mikey is cheap, so he'll want the higher pick and the contract gone. This will drag the Bengals' committee into indecision.

If you cut him, you eat the dead money.

 

[Sled21]

Watt is disgruntled in Texas, they are both over the hill Defensive Ends who have seen their best days behind them. Even swap, give both new scenery....

[fredtoast]

(10-27-2020, 03:56 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Watt is disgruntled in Texas, they are both over the hill Defensive Ends who have seen their best days behind them. Even swap, give both new scenery....

Watt ($15.5 mil) is making almost twice as much as Dunlap ($8.8)

[Hoofhearted]

(10-27-2020, 03:08 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Just to be clear, we're in agreement.  If they can get something for him then they should.

But in the meantime, at least fine him, suspend him, or make a statement that clearly admonishes him.

As far as getting something for him, I think they should have generally idea now whether that's going to be possible or not.  One would assume they've had talks.  They've got one week left to get something done, so they if they're going to do something it's gonna have to be soon.

I'm not getting my hopes up.  I just don't see him having any value. 

Yea, we're on the same page. Only part I disagree with is the bolded. They will (and should) keep all this in house like Dunlap should have done. Be professional about it. I don't know what fines they could levy against him for arguing with coaches and whining on social media. The suspension part I have no answer for other than waiting to see what they do this week. Don't see any way they can have him on the active roster.  

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-27-2020, 03:43 PM)fredtoast Wrote: If the Bengals get a draft pick in exchange for Dunlap they will be admitting that he had more value than scrubs you can sign off the street.

In other words it will make the judgement of their coaches look bad.

That is why they won't do it.  It would embarrass the coaches.

You keep making this same point over and over.  And yet you refuse to even consider the possibility that there is more going on here than a question of talent.

Just because the coaches are choosing to play other guys over him that does not have to mean they consider them overall better players.  Dunlap's effort could have more to do with this situation than his talent.

Dave Lapham has talked quite a bit recently about how's dogging it out there.  I've seen and read other things where others (both local and national) have said very similar things.  One writer actually described his play as "not even trying half the time". 

The effort just isn't there.  And if it isn't there duing games, what do you think it's like in practice and in meetings?

Now you can disagree with this.  You're more than welcome to speculate as much as anyone else.  But what you shouldn't do is present your argument, that the coaches are poor judges of talent, as pure fact.  You do NOT what all is going into their decision, nor will you even consider the possibility that there is more that can play into it.

If a player is giving poor effort and not producing, then it makes perfect sense for a coaching staff to play a lesser caliber player.  If only to send a message.  And if someone else chooses to take a gamble on Dunlap that doesn't automatically make oue staff idiots.  It may very well mean that they feel like a change of scenery and a fresh start will result in greater effort than what he's given here.

[WestCoastBengalsFan]

Is this thread a joke? Here's here because Mikey B doesn't let anyone force his hand, only time that happened is with Palmer when he "retired" and that's a completely different situation. If you think Mikey B is going to be pushed around to do anything he doesn't want to do you haven't been paying attention the past 30 years.

[Sled21]

(10-27-2020, 04:04 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Watt ($15.5 mil) is making almost twice as much as Dunlap ($8.8)

Well, he's twice the player.... sooooo.....

[BURROWorBUST]

(10-27-2020, 01:37 PM)Sled21 Wrote: They say JJ Watt is disgruntled and making noise in Texas. Maybe a straight up washed up DE for another washed up DE and a change of scenery would do them both good.

Throw in John Ross. It's not like the Texans don't need WRs. 

[GodFather]

(10-27-2020, 04:16 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: You keep making this same point over and over.  And yet you refuse to even consider the possibility that there is more going on here than a question of talent.

Thats because people with their opinions on here are like news channels(Fox, CNN, MSNBC) They have a particular view/opinion and will only reference things to support that and ignore all other possibilities as if it doesn't exist.