Imagine This Offseason

[MileHighGrowler]

(12-03-2020, 12:32 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I was specifically addressing the character concerns (that are ancient history anyway) wrt Bieniemy. If Andy Reid is comfortable employing him then it doesn’t concern me.

That aspect doesn't bother me, either.  But there is a definite love affair with bringing Bienemy in from a LOT of people, so consider my response to the masses, not you

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(12-03-2020, 12:21 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I see him  catching a lot of heat for this, but I'm not sure people understand just how f'd up the situation is.  He's basically stuck between a rock and hard place.

Here are his options:

1.) Bench Carson Wentz and cut him after season's end. 

They can't do this.  He will account for 59 million dollars in dead space in 2021 if he is cut.  That is an absolutely insane number.  It's even more insane with the reduce salary cap.  You'd be better of keeping him, and spending the money around him and just build around a less than ideal QB.

2.) Bench Wentz and trade him after season's end.

They can't do this either.  No one is going to take on that contract.  Options 1 and 2 only leave you one choice, Carson Wentz has to be on the team in 2021.

3.) Bench Wentz and let Jalen Hurts start from here on out.

If you do this then you'll have a 34.5 million dollar backup in 2021. (Remember, Wentz has to remain on the roster.)

4.) Bench Wentz and but him the chance to start next year in a QB competition.

Sounds great, except for the fact that you may ruin any confidence he may left.  And if Hurts stinks, then you're even more screwed than you already are.  And if Hurts is decent, you're still left with a 34.5 million dollar backup.

There are no easy answer here.  What I think he's doing is the following 5th option:

5.) Keep Wentz in there and hope somehow you can get him to look like the player he's proven capable to be. 

Give him some real receiving weapons and at least a semi-decent OL tihis offseason and hope for the best.  He's been decent before, and your stuck with him for 2021.  If he stinks again next year then go with the Hurts experiment.  But don't rush the gun until you absolutely have to.

tldr; This is a complex situation.  It's not as cut and dry as most, where you bench the guy and plan to move on.

They can get him in for 15-20 plays a game, IMO; run some options, throw a few and some running plays sprinkled in here and there; especially if they're running 60 plays a game, it would help cut down on Wentz's attempts too, which would (probably) cut down on the boneheaded plays.

I also just don't see the point of stating in your PC that you are going to change things around, then you don't; just don't say anything then.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-02-2020, 05:45 PM)RiverRat13 Wrote: If you are going to dream big, dream big...

Nov/Dec - Mike Glennon catches fire and Doug Marrone knows he's going to get fired anyway, leading the Jags to improbably pull out two wins in their last five games.  Meanwhile the NYG and WFT both go 5-11, with the Giants winning the NFC East.  The Bengals lose out, "earning" the second pick.

The new Bengals front office loves Sewell, but sees the opportunity in front of it.  They throw the bulk of their cap space at Joe Thuney and Taylor Moton.  The offensive line going into the draft is Williams, Thuney, Hopkins, Spain, Moton.

The draft order is NYJ, CIN, JAX, DAL, LAC in the top 5.  WFT, DET, DEN, and CHI are 8-11 and all are rumored to want to move up to take a QB.

JAX offers #3 and #35 for #2 to ensure nobody leaps ahead of them for the non-Lawrence QB of their choice.  The Bengals happily accept.  

WAS is now desperate to get the third remaining QB.  They make an offer that the three teams behind them can't match - #8, #40, and a 2nd round pick in 2021.  The Bengals are elated.

With the 8th pick in the 2021 NFL Draft, the Bengals reunite Joe Burrow with his favorite college target - Ja'Marr Chase.

The team then uses picks #34, #35, #40, and #66 to begin rebuilding its defense and take an IOL to push/potentially replace Spain.

Like I said, if you are going to dream big...

Oh man, that would be absolutely incredible.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-03-2020, 12:31 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Oh, and one more thing regarding Pederson...

Howie Roseman has done him zero favors.  They have an absolutely garbage OL, and the receiving corp is among the worst in the league. No wonder their offense, and specifically Wentz sucks.

His (Roseman) recent free agency signings have been poor, and his recent drafting has been abysmal.  He's built out a bad team these last few years.

So it's really easy to just assume Pederson suddenly forgot to coach offense, or that he became a terrible coach overnight.  But if you remember that they're a club with an actual GM, who's pulling the strings, you might think twice about laying on the blame on him.

Doug Pederson was a great OC working side by side with Reid in Kansas City, and he helped get the ball rolling there.  

He was a more than solid NFL coach up until this year.  Obviously he won a Superbowl, but he also had 3 winning seasons in 4 years, with his worst being 7-9.  His overall record was 38-25.

So, I don't think he just forgot to coach in 2021.  I think there's a lot more going on there than that.

There are rumors out there that Pederson doesn't even care if he gets fired at this point. Since we're dreaming big and all.....

[WeezyBengal]

Everything about your post makes complete sense...and its not that hard to figure out. Just shows you how incompetent the Bengals truly are.

[WeezyBengal]

(12-02-2020, 06:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: We don't need new uniforms.

We've had the same uniforms for 15 years now. They are the worst uniforms in the league. We need new uniforms. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-03-2020, 12:44 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: We've had the same uniforms for 15 years now. They are the worst uniforms in the league. We need new uniforms. 

That’s completely subjective, but I like our uniforms. The only change I’d make is the color rush should replace our boring normal whites permanently.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(12-03-2020, 12:44 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: We've had the same uniforms for 15 years now. They are the worst uniforms in the league. We need new uniforms. 

We have among the best collection of Unis in the league by far.

Our Color Rush too, is arguably the best of ALL the Color Rush jerseys

[*bfine32*]

The last time we had a major Uniform Change (going to the stripes) we went to the Superbowl. Of course we need new uniforms.

[Wes Mantooth]

I don't understand those that are so vehemently opposed to changing the uniforms.

I would understand if they were "classic" a'la the Bears or Browns, or Packers. But they're not. Not only are they not our original uniforms, they're not even similar. They've not even our uniforms from the 80's when we had great success. They're 15 years old.

New uniforms doesn't have to mean radical changes. You can keep the helmet I suppose if you're against any change. You can even keep many of the same themes (Stripes on the shoulders, pants). But yhey still can be updated and modernized.

To me, the uniforms have become incredibly stale. And more importantly than that, they've come to represent losing. We all know how the media sees this franchise, and how many around the country see it. We know all the people that said Joe Burrow shouldn't come here. Well guess, what? That's what the current uniforms represents.

And the biggest thing... You guys ever watch players nowaways when they get new uniforms? They go apeshit. They love it. It seems like every other day I'm seeing some college team, or pro team unveiling some new uni's and the players couldn't be more excited.

Does it matter on the field? Probably not. I don't really buy into "look good, play good" or any of that. Is is the most important thing in the world? Of course not.

But why not update something that's almost two decades old? Give your players something to get excited about. Have the physical change of uniforms be symbolic change with your franchise. "This is your new Bengals".

To each their own, I just don't think are uniforms are so damn great we can never update at all. In fact, if we're being totally honest, I think they look dated, and I think a lot of players would put us near the bottom in a uniform they think looks cool. And I think a lot of fans feel the same way.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

I think most of us were mostly happy with last year's draft haul but a factor in that (besides picking before everyone else) was the time the coaches were able to spend with prospects at the senior bowl. With college schedules/scouting being severely impacted by covid, players opting out etc, how much of an advantage might this be to have this extra time with the prospects?

Could the Bengals use that to blitz this draft?

[THE Bigzoman]

Bieniemy is stupidly overhyped considering he has Reid and Mahones.


I'd rather have Marvin Lewis, Raheem Morris, or Zimmer./\

[THE Bigzoman]

(12-03-2020, 12:44 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: We've had the same uniforms for 15 years now. They are the worst uniforms in the league. We need new uniforms. 

The worst according to whom? I like the stripes.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-02-2020, 04:43 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Note: Before I start, please know that I understand that any and all of this is incredibly unlikley to happen, to the point of being almost impossible.  It's just meant to be for fun.  If a thead like this isn't your idea of fun, no biggie.  I just don't need reminding it's a waste of time.  Also, know that everything I'm about to say isn't calling for the moon, or becoming the Dallas Cowboys, these are reasonable developments for an average spending franchise.  This is how a normal franchise might approach this offseason, to counter the disgust by their fanbase.

---

--January 3rd (Shortly After Ravens Game):  Bengals put out a press release, essentially saying that they understand fans frustrations with the disappointment that was 2020, and that they will be having a press conference the following day, Monday, January 4th, to discuss it.

--January 4th (Press Conference):  Bengals announce the hiring of a new GM (this has been in the works for weeks).  They also announce that they're parting ways with Zac Taylor, and will let their new GM and new HC build out their staff.  Any existing coaches are free to explore other options if they choose to not to wait to see if they make the cut.

--Mid January to Early Feb:  New GM (insert your favorite name here) announces the hiring of Eric Bienemy (or your favorite) to be your next coach of the Cincinnati Bengals.

--Throughout Jan to Mid Feb:  GM, and Bienemy (or Joe Brady, or whoever you like) build out their coaching staff.  Qualified and name coaches are hired, signifying that a.) Guys want to be here and b.) Spending didn't prohibit us from attracting talent

--Feb-March--Team slowly announces additions to the scouting department, and state they'll continue looking for for talent they believe can help their ball club in this department

--Feb-March--Press Release: The new slogan is: The Dey is Now.  They attatch a well put together release that backs this up and creates excitement.

--Feb-March--Press Release: Bengals Unveil new uniforms that they worked with Nike.  They're cool as shit, and show that a new era is upon us.

--Creating space: Bengals move a ton of money off the books by moving on from Geno, Bobby Hart, Uzomah and Erickson (Frees up roughly 22 million) Maybe rework Gio deals with an extension to bring the annual hit down.

--Free Agency -- Team signs two guards for a combined total of 15-20 mil per.  Sign a 10 mil LB or a 10 mil TE. Fills out depth with decent, cheaper vets eager to come up on board.  Most of all, they're creativem they're and active like last year.

--Draft: Take Sewell at #3.  Take a speedy WR in the 2nd or stud DL.  May make trade to target a player higher than their position.

--OL now looks like this: Sewell, Free Agent G, Hopkins, Free Agent G, Jonah Williams.

--Press Release: Team announces a team Hall of Fame that will be constructed on the PBS grounds.  Announce members, and invite names like Munoz, Boomer, Collinsworth, Dillon, Chad Johnson, Willie Anderson, etc. to ground breaking ceremony at a later date.

--July: Hold a Fan Fest to kick off the season at PBS that emcompsasses the stadium and/or lots.  Former players are on hand, and there's plenty of entertaiment for both the die-hards and for families. 

--August: Joe Burrow is cleared to play for the start of 2021 season.

--Sept: Profit????

---

There's obviously a lot of holes in this and it's lacking specifics (Which FA's do we sign, which coaches, who do we draft in rounds 3-7, etc.)  This is just an outline of an offseason that could energize this fanbase to the point of creaming their paints.

New GM, Bienemy (or your favotie), quality asst. coaches, more scouts, new uniforms, a hall of fame, a fun fan event, a healthy Joe Burrow.  None of this would really be that hard to do.  

I love it and think you mailed the slogan.  My only gripes would be that I like Uzomah and you don't release Hart after developing him and in his prime (as much as so many can't stand him).  The new uniforms would be awesome.  The addition of a HoF at PBS would be awesome.  Fan Fest would be awesome.  

I give you credit for taking the time and showing your enthusiasm.  Many will poo-poo it and say "never going to happen" and maybe it won't.  I still liked it.  

[Wes Mantooth]

(12-04-2020, 09:28 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Bieniemy is stupidly overhyped considering he has Reid and Mahones.

Bieniemy designs a lot of the plays, worked with Reid on building the entire scheme and does actually call plays, depsite popular belief.  He's also the one who communicates with Mahomes the most.

Fwiw, Doug Pederson had Andy Reid too, and worked in the same role as Bienemy is now.  He only went on to win a Superbowl in his 2nd season is Philly.

Mahomes is great now no doubt.  But is it crazy to think that Bienemy might have at least a little part in helping him end up being the player is now?

[Wes Mantooth]

https://arrowheadaddict.com/2020/12/02/john-dorsey-eric-bieniemy-package-deal-new-team/

The upcoming hiring season should begin in the next few weeks in the NFL as one of several frustrated teams hungry for new leadership will make the first move to hire a new regime. For one team, it could include a reunion of former and current Kansas City Chiefs employees.

Matt Lombardo, National NFL columnist for FanSided, has word that former Chiefs general manager John Dorsey and current offensive coordinator Eric Bieniemy might make themselves available as a package deal of sorts for a team looking to recreate the stable success of Kansas City. Lombardo writes:

Executives and sources around the league tell FanSided that former Kansas City Chiefs and Cleveland Browns general manager John Dorsey will likely be among the most sought after GMs, and it’s highly likely that he’ll be bringing Chiefs offensive coordinator Eric Bienemy with him as head coach.

Lombardo goes on to mention that three teams in particular stand out from sources: the Jacksonville Jaguars, Houston Texans, and Atlanta Falcons.

It’s no secret that Bieniemy is a favorite to win a head coaching job this offseason after taking several interviews over the last two years to no avail. Bieniemy now has eight season on staff with Andy Reid and the Chiefs and three full years as the team’s offensive coordinator. He’s earned the respect of his players and fellow coaches, and Reid himself has stated on multiple occasions how ready Bieniemy is for the task.

Some questions about Bieniemy’s background and the question of just how much he handles the Chiefs offense have reportedly held him back from actually winning a job outright, which makes the idea of a package deal even more interesting.

Dorsey is no stranger to questions or concerns despite a body of work that also speaks to his tremendous eye for talent. A team looking to turn things around could do much worse than turn their roster over to Dorsey, who honestly deserves far more credit than he receives around Chiefs Kingdom—from savvy signings of Mitchell Schwartz, to Travis Kelce‘s extension, to the perfectly placed trade to sneak in and take Patrick Mahomes from every other interested team in the 2017 NFL Draft.

Yet Dorsey was also reportedly hard to deal with in K.C., a man with communication issues who can be abrasive and the cap concerns that piled up for the Chiefs certainly didn’t help. There was a reason the Chiefs allowed Dorsey to walk after helping to resurrect the franchise. Despite leaving a loaded roster, team owner Clark Hunt made the decision to move on and re-sign only Andy Reid to a new extension. He instead promoted Brett Veach to run the front office.

Both Bieniemy and Dorsey might come with some questions or concerns, but that’s true of any new hire (whether “unproven” or not). Both men have been a part of a very successful organization. Dorsey has a proven track record to unearth talent and create a competitive roster rather quickly. Bieniemy is a proven motivator who has learned from a Hall of Fame coach for nearly a decade. Together, they might just resurrect a moribund franchise.

[Nicomo Cosca]

That would literally be my dream scenario.

[MileHighGrowler]

(12-04-2020, 12:11 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Bieniemy designs a lot of the plays, worked with Reid on building the entire scheme and does actually call plays, depsite popular belief.  He's also the one who communicates with Mahomes the most.

Fwiw, Doug Pederson had Andy Reid too, and worked in the same role as Bienemy is now.  He only went on to win a Superbowl in his 2nd season is Philly.

Mahomes is great now no doubt.  But is it crazy to think that Bienemy might have at least a little part in helping him end up being the player is now?

I would have zero complaints bringing Bienemy in.  My question is whether his expected skillset makes him a HC or an OC.  He can be a phenomenal player developer, scheme creator and overall offensive genius.  But does that mean he should be driving the entire team, on both sides of the ball, and have the relationships in the league/college to bring in the right staff around him?  I just don't know.  He could be the second coming, but I guess I'd almost rather see him in a role where he could focus on the offense alone.  Sometimes the "promotion" to HC just doesn't work.  

Now the deal with him going as a HC somewhere with a GM as a packaged deal is very interesting to me, as the GM would be responsible for helping to fill the other coaching roles, so Bienemy wouldn't be on an island.  

[t3r3e3]

(12-02-2020, 04:43 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Note: Before I start, please know that I understand that any and all of this is incredibly unlikley to happen, to the point of being almost impossible.  It's just meant to be for fun.  If a thead like this isn't your idea of fun, no biggie.  I just don't need reminding it's a waste of time.  Also, know that everything I'm about to say isn't calling for the moon, or becoming the Dallas Cowboys, these are reasonable developments for an average spending franchise. This is how a normal franchise might approach this offseason, to counter the disgust by their fanbase.

---

--January 3rd (Shortly After Ravens Game):  Bengals put out a press release, essentially saying that they understand fans frustrations with the disappointment that was 2020, and that they will be having a press conference the following day, Monday, January 4th, to discuss it.

--January 4th (Press Conference):  Bengals announce the hiring of a new GM (this has been in the works for weeks).  They also announce that they're parting ways with Zac Taylor, and will let their new GM and new HC build out their staff.  Any existing coaches are free to explore other options if they choose to not to wait to see if they make the cut.

--Mid January to Early Feb:  New GM (insert your favorite name here) announces the hiring of Eric Bienemy (or your favorite) to be your next coach of the Cincinnati Bengals.

--Throughout Jan to Mid Feb:  GM, and Bienemy (or Joe Brady, or whoever you like) build out their coaching staff.  Qualified and name coaches are hired, signifying that a.) Guys want to be here and b.) Spending didn't prohibit us from attracting talent

--Feb-March--Team slowly announces additions to the scouting department, and state they'll continue looking for for talent they believe can help their ball club in this department

--Feb-March--Press Release: The new slogan is: The Dey is Now.  They attatch a well put together release that backs this up and creates excitement.

--Feb-March--Press Release: Bengals Unveil new uniforms that they worked with Nike.  They're cool as shit, and show that a new era is upon us.

--Creating space: Bengals move a ton of money off the books by moving on from Geno, Bobby Hart, Uzomah and Erickson (Frees up roughly 22 million) Maybe rework Gio deals with an extension to bring the annual hit down.

--Free Agency -- Team signs two guards for a combined total of 15-20 mil per.  Sign a 10 mil LB or a 10 mil TE. Fills out depth with decent, cheaper vets eager to come up on board.  Most of all, they're creativem they're and active like last year.

--Draft: Take Sewell at #3.  Take a speedy WR in the 2nd or stud DL.  May make trade to target a player higher than their position.

--OL now looks like this: Sewell, Free Agent G, Hopkins, Free Agent G, Jonah Williams.

--Press Release: Team announces a team Hall of Fame that will be constructed on the PBS grounds.  Announce members, and invite names like Munoz, Boomer, Collinsworth, Dillon, Chad Johnson, Willie Anderson, etc. to ground breaking ceremony at a later date.

--July: Hold a Fan Fest to kick off the season at PBS that emcompsasses the stadium and/or lots.  Former players are on hand, and there's plenty of entertaiment for both the die-hards and for families. 

--August: Joe Burrow is cleared to play for the start of 2021 season.

--Sept: Profit????

---

There's obviously a lot of holes in this and it's lacking specifics (Which FA's do we sign, which coaches, who do we draft in rounds 3-7, etc.)  This is just an outline of an offseason that could energize this fanbase to the point of creaming their paints.

New GM, Bienemy (or your favotie), quality asst. coaches, more scouts, new uniforms, a hall of fame, a fun fan event, a healthy Joe Burrow.  None of this would really be that hard to do.  

Only way they accomplish item 1 (or any other item) is if Mike croaks in the next 3 weeks and Katie/Troy/rest of the family decide to sell the team and retire to the Swiss Alps. The points you list are literally every fans’ dream scenario. Since we have arguably the worst ownership/front office this side of the Jets and Knicks, I reckon we can expect the status quo to continue.

[kalibengal]

(12-02-2020, 04:43 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Note: Before I start, please know that I understand that any and all of this is incredibly unlikley to happen, to the point of being almost impossible.  It's just meant to be for fun.  If a thead like this isn't your idea of fun, no biggie.  I just don't need reminding it's a waste of time.  Also, know that everything I'm about to say isn't calling for the moon, or becoming the Dallas Cowboys, these are reasonable developments for an average spending franchise.  This is how a normal franchise might approach this offseason, to counter the disgust by their fanbase.

---

--January 3rd (Shortly After Ravens Game):  Bengals put out a press release, essentially saying that they understand fans frustrations with the disappointment that was 2020, and that they will be having a press conference the following day, Monday, January 4th, to discuss it.

--January 4th (Press Conference):  Bengals announce the hiring of a new GM (this has been in the works for weeks).  They also announce that they're parting ways with Zac Taylor, and will let their new GM and new HC build out their staff.  Any existing coaches are free to explore other options if they choose to not to wait to see if they make the cut.

--Mid January to Early Feb:  New GM (insert your favorite name here) announces the hiring of Eric Bienemy (or your favorite) to be your next coach of the Cincinnati Bengals.

--Throughout Jan to Mid Feb:  GM, and Bienemy (or Joe Brady, or whoever you like) build out their coaching staff.  Qualified and name coaches are hired, signifying that a.) Guys want to be here and b.) Spending didn't prohibit us from attracting talent

--Feb-March--Team slowly announces additions to the scouting department, and state they'll continue looking for for talent they believe can help their ball club in this department

--Feb-March--Press Release: The new slogan is: The Dey is Now.  They attatch a well put together release that backs this up and creates excitement.

--Feb-March--Press Release: Bengals Unveil new uniforms that they worked with Nike.  They're cool as shit, and show that a new era is upon us.

--Creating space: Bengals move a ton of money off the books by moving on from Geno, Bobby Hart, Uzomah and Erickson (Frees up roughly 22 million) Maybe rework Gio deals with an extension to bring the annual hit down.

--Free Agency -- Team signs two guards for a combined total of 15-20 mil per.  Sign a 10 mil LB or a 10 mil TE. Fills out depth with decent, cheaper vets eager to come up on board.  Most of all, they're creativem they're and active like last year.

--Draft: Take Sewell at #3.  Take a speedy WR in the 2nd or stud DL.  May make trade to target a player higher than their position.

--OL now looks like this: Sewell, Free Agent G, Hopkins, Free Agent G, Jonah Williams.

--Press Release: Team announces a team Hall of Fame that will be constructed on the PBS grounds.  Announce members, and invite names like Munoz, Boomer, Collinsworth, Dillon, Chad Johnson, Willie Anderson, etc. to ground breaking ceremony at a later date.

--July: Hold a Fan Fest to kick off the season at PBS that emcompsasses the stadium and/or lots.  Former players are on hand, and there's plenty of entertaiment for both the die-hards and for families. 

--August: Joe Burrow is cleared to play for the start of 2021 season.

--Sept: Profit????

---

There's obviously a lot of holes in this and it's lacking specifics (Which FA's do we sign, which coaches, who do we draft in rounds 3-7, etc.)  This is just an outline of an offseason that could energize this fanbase to the point of creaming their paints.

New GM, Bienemy (or your favotie), quality asst. coaches, more scouts, new uniforms, a hall of fame, a fun fan event, a healthy Joe Burrow.  None of this would really be that hard to do.  

You had me at new GM....and I shot my load