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(12-18-2020, 02:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I think Burrow needed ever snap he could get to learn and get better. He has great potential but he is from a finished product. He has a lot he needs to improve.
I think Burrow is far closer to a finished product then people realize. It isn't like we took a red shirt sophomore at the age of 21 1OA.
Burrow is a grown man by NFL QB terms. Older than many of the up and coming darling QB's we see in the league now.
No shade thrown at Burrow. I think we can win with him as is. But expecting a leap like you would a 21 year old rookie to their 24 year old year isn't likely and unrealistic.
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He reminds me more of Andrew Luck than Mariota.
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From the beating he took maybe.
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I’d be more worried about the deep ball if I didn’t witness drops on perfectly thrown deep passes throughout this year. AJ, Sample, Higgins all dropped some perfectly thrown deep passes that would’ve helped his numbers. Joe has work to do to improve there, but I don’t think it’s a lack of ability to do it.
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(12-18-2020, 12:13 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I think it speaks to Burrows need for coaching. Some fans think that Burrow will come in and make Taylor succeed. QB's, not matter how good of a prospect need to be in the right system.
Putting Burrow in a system where throws take a long time to develop behind a bad offensive line is not that system for him.
Agreed, but the 5 wide sets are what Joe likes. We just don't have the line to execute it. Coaching leaves a lot to be desired as well.
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(12-18-2020, 04:13 PM)Wyche Wrote: Agreed, but the 5 wide sets are what Joe likes. We just don't have the line to execute it. Coaching leaves a lot to be desired as well.
Is it that we don't have the line to execute (we don't). Or is the bigger issue we aren't in a division where a finesse offense like that will work against our "rivals". That's my fear. We have to be competitive in our physical division first an foremost.
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(12-18-2020, 02:34 PM)RiverRat13 Wrote: Goodberry is mainly countering the idea that Joe had an all-time rookie season (which people have Tweeted to him). He had a very good rookie season, but it was by no means unprecedented.
He threw 13 TD passes. That is nowhere near an all-time rookie season.
He couldn't complete deep passes either. His stats look good because they threw A LOT of passes.
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(12-18-2020, 05:11 PM)jj22 Wrote: Is it that we don't have the line to execute (we don't). Or is the bigger issue we aren't in a division where a finesse offense like that will work against our "rivals". That's my fear. We have to be competitive in our physical division first an foremost.
We're literally outcoached and out game-planned in every game we're in within our division.
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(12-18-2020, 05:16 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: We're literally outcoached and out game-planned in every game we're in within our division.
I agree. And TBH, I think a lot of the success we've seen on the field with Burrow was audibled.
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(12-18-2020, 03:42 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I’d be more worried about the deep ball if I didn’t witness drops on perfectly thrown deep passes throughout this year. AJ, Sample, Higgins all dropped some perfectly thrown deep passes that would’ve helped his numbers. Joe has work to do to improve there, but I don’t think it’s a lack of ability to do it.
It’s for sure not a lack of ability. He threw plenty of gorgeous deep balls at LSU. Especially to Chase.
(12-18-2020, 05:13 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: He threw 13 TD passes. That is nowhere near an all-time rookie season.
He couldn't complete deep passes either. His stats look good because they threw A LOT of passes.
His stats look good because he’s super accurate and has great ball placement. Not every rookie can go out there and complete 65.3% of their passes. For comparison the year before Murray completed 64.4% and he won OROY.
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(12-18-2020, 03:30 PM)jj22 Wrote: I think Burrow is far closer to a finished product then people realize. It isn't like we took a red shirt sophomore at the age of 21 1OA.
Burrow is a grown man by NFL QB terms. Older than many of the up and coming darling QB's we see in the league now.
No shade thrown at Burrow. I think we can win with him as is. But expecting a leap like you would a 21 year old rookie to their 24 year old year isn't likely and unrealistic.
It's not so much about his age. It's about experience.
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(12-18-2020, 03:30 PM)jj22 Wrote: I think Burrow is far closer to a finished product then people realize. It isn't like we took a red shirt sophomore at the age of 21 1OA.
Burrow is a grown man by NFL QB terms. Older than many of the up and coming darling QB's we see in the league now.
No shade thrown at Burrow. I think we can win with him as is. But expecting a leap like you would a 21 year old rookie to their 24 year old year isn't likely and unrealistic.
Joe’s idol Drew Brees didn’t really start playing like the Drew Brees we know today until his age 25 season.
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(12-18-2020, 10:04 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Joe’s idol Drew Brees didn’t really start playing like the Drew Brees we know today until his age 25 season.
There was a good article during the offseason where a bunch of QBs had a major jump in production at 23 years old. For some at 23, they were in the pros. Others like Burtow were in college.
Nothing definitive, but interesting.
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(12-18-2020, 10:12 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: There was a good article during the offseason where a bunch of QBs had a major jump in production at 23 years old. For some at 23, they were in the pros. Others like Burtow were in college.
Nothing definitive, but interesting.
Most players come in at 21 or 22. So that would make sense since it's their second or third year as a pro...I'm betting that 1 or 2 years of experience is more important than the actual age.
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I'd say this held true for Mariota. Major injuries derail this.
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I find it hard to believe that Burrow has scratched his full potential under the worst coach in league history. Oh yeah, and Brown is the worst GM in league history as well. Dalton just hung ludicrous points on these guys with the Cowboys. Pairing Burrow with even an average HC/GM combo could yield outstanding results.
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I believe Dalton was also 23ish when he was drafted. His big jump camp in year three- 2013 season. I'm going to guess the experience is more important than age, unless your truly just considering maturity, then age probably plays a factor.
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(12-18-2020, 11:29 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Don't know who this Goodberry is, but he sure seems to be rooting for Burrow's failure.
No, he's just being realistic. Jalen Hurts has one start and still has as many wins as JB! Just as capable as a passer and he's more mobile. Tua? Winning. Herbert? Winning. Hurts? Winning.
JB plays for arguably the worst managed franchise in the NFL.... Blown out knee. Losing!!!
He's just calling it like it is.
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(12-19-2020, 12:43 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: No, he's just being realistic. Jalen Hurts has one start and still has as many wins as JB! Just as capable as a passer and he's more mobile. Tua? Winning. Herbert? Winning. Hurts? Winning.
JB plays for arguably the worst managed franchise in the NFL.... Blown out knee. Losing!!!
He's just calling it like it is.
You get it.
Major injuries derail development. Happened with Mariota. Wentz's too.
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(12-18-2020, 02:49 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I think from a playstyle standpoint it was more Mariota and Russell Wilson as being closer, except that Wilson got drafted into a better situation.
Also Wilson learned that you can run, but you need to avoid taking hits. Run if it's open, but slide before taking a big hit because the hit isn't worth the extra 1 yard if that 1 yard isn't on 4th down or for a TD. Also that sometimes the best play is throwing it away rather than holding it and getting crushed for a sack.
That's something that Burrow needs to learn, too (a need independent to the need for a better OL). Unnecessary hits are just that, unnecessary. Hopefully he learns it quickly. I know we saw that awful "slide" attempt a week after he got absolutely lit up due to not sliding. Sadly the knee injury means it's unlikely he will be able to practice sliding this offseason but hopefully he still takes the hits he took to heart to study how to avoid some of them. A healthy Burrow will be the best Burrow.
It's crazy how many QBs don't know how to slide. Like, not that they're always fighting for extra yards, but literally don't know how to slide like even the most elementary little league baseball player.
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