Let's talk Tee Higgins for a minute.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-24-2020, 01:46 PM)likwit19 Wrote: His hands are really inconsistent.

I thought so early in the season, but he seems to have (mostly) cleaned that up.

[Essex Johnson]

Solid season for Higgins, he has grown improved through the season, made some great catches showed toughness as a rookie and stayed healthy , Boyd and Higgins gives Burrow as solid 1/2 punch in the North as the other 3 teams.

[fredtoast]

In prior years when Green made catches like this people said he was bailing out a lame QB.










I'll take plays like that over an "extra gear" any day.

[BengalsRocker]

I just want someone to make up banners in the stands for Tee Pain.



Hope for many seasons of him putting it on other teams !

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-24-2020, 03:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: In prior years when Green made catches like this people said he was bailing out a lame QB.










I'll take plays like that over an "extra gear" any day.

It’s weird to me you’d take a sideline catch over a TD “any day.” You dog Burrow for low TD production in comparison to Herbert, but plays like this https://youtu.be/6Mh7CnbVJI0 are part of that.

That should have been 6. And that’s the type of play I was thinking of when I said I wish he had an extra gear. Still think he’s a hell of a WR, but it’s a factor.

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

Wasted pick.

Good player, will do well for years . . . should have drafted a Guard or OT instead of a WR. There are lots of mid round WRs having as good or better seasons than Tee. I wanted them to trade down from #1 because O-line was the biggest need and they still passed on O-line until the 6th round.

The Bengals screwed themselves.

And here we are.

[Benton]

(12-24-2020, 10:20 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Wasted pick.

Good player, will do well for years . . . should have drafted a Guard or OT instead of a WR. There are lots of mid round WRs having as good or better seasons than Tee. I wanted them to trade down from #1 because O-line was the biggest need and they still passed on O-line until the 6th round.

The Bengals screwed themselves.

And here we are.

With probably the best qb drafted in the last couple years (and next couple) and a chance to draft a better tackle than was available last year?

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

(12-24-2020, 10:24 PM)Benton Wrote: With probably the best qb drafted in the last couple years (and next couple) and a chance to draft a better tackle than was available last year?

I like Burrow and I like Higgins. But would Burrow be considered the #1 pick if he was coming off of a blown out knee? He's a major question mark right now.

My biggest protest before the draft was that outside of Peyton Manning, #1 overall picks don't do well on teams that earned that pick instead of trading for it. Good QBs become gun shy from the abuse or they become like Andrew Luck and can't play or enjoy the game anymore because he got the crap beat out of him behind a much better line than Burrow's.

If he comes back, he'll have more mental hurdles to overcome than he'll have physical hurdles. One great half of a season and now he's damaged goods. Palmer never looked even close to the same after his knee injury and that memory is still too fresh to forget. He got one division title from throwing the ball everywhere and outscoring everybody and he got his next division title four years later from handing off to Cedric Benson while allowing Mike Zimmer's defense to win the games.

So to answer your question, yes. I still would have traded down to build a team BEFORE putting the future out there with a bunch of future CFL players. I've said multiple times for over two years now "I really like what Buffalo is doing. They are going about it the right way."

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-24-2020, 11:14 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: I like Burrow and I like Higgins. But would Burrow be considered the #1 pick if he was coming off of a blown out knee? He's a major question mark right now.

My biggest protest before the draft was that outside of Peyton Manning, #1 overall picks don't do well on teams that earned that pick instead of trading for it. Good QBs become gun shy from the abuse or they become like Andrew Luck and can't play or enjoy the game anymore because he got the crap beat out of him behind a much better line than Burrow's.

If he comes back, he'll have more mental hurdles to overcome than he'll have physical hurdles. One great half of a season and now he's damaged goods. Palmer never looked even close to the same after his knee injury and that memory is still too fresh to forget. He got one division title from throwing the ball everywhere and outscoring everybody and he got his next division title four years later from handing off to Cedric Benson while allowing Mike Zimmer's defense to win the games.

So to answer your question, yes. I still would have traded down to build a team BEFORE putting the future out there with a bunch of future CFL players. I've said multiple times for over two years now "I really like what Buffalo is doing. They are going about it the right way."

Not true. People seem to forget how good he was the very next season.

Pro Bowl
4035 yards
28 TD
93.9 rating

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

(12-24-2020, 11:44 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Not true. People seem to forget how good he was the very next season.

Pro Bowl
4035 yards
28 TD
93.9 rating

Completely true because you appear to forget how good he really was in 2005 when, for about three months, all of the NFL talking heads would lump Brady, Manning and Palmer together. That never happened again. It doesn't matter how "good" you think his stats were in 2006 . . . he was better before the knee injury and never looked the same again.

2005 Career high and led the league in completion percentage with 67.8 . . . 2006 . . . 62.3

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all gone.

That 93.9 rating is pretty good. It's the 2nd highest rating in his career as a Bengal . . . his highest rating as a Bengal was a 101.1 in 2005

2005 421 points . . . Defense 350 - 11-5
2006 373 points . . . Defense 331 - 8-8

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all of it . . . gone and you can't find any of that in a stat book.

Anyone still want to guess why I wanted to trade down, especially with this supporting cast?

[Benton]

(12-25-2020, 05:04 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Completely true because you appear to forget how good he really was in 2005 when, for about three months, all of the NFL talking heads would lump Brady, Manning and Palmer together. That never happened again. It doesn't matter how "good" you think his stats were in 2006 . . . he was better before the knee injury and never looked the same again.

2005 Career high and led the league in completion percentage with 67.8 . . . 2006 . . . 62.3

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all gone.

That 93.9 rating is pretty good. It's the 2nd highest rating in his career as a Bengal . . . his highest rating as a Bengal was a 101.1 in 2005

2005 421 points . . . Defense 350 - 11-5
2006 373 points . . . Defense 331 - 8-8

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all of it . . . gone and you can't find any of that in a stat book.

Anyone still want to guess why I wanted to trade down, especially with this supporting cast?

Palmer, brady, warner and other qbs had good runs after knee injuries. 

Yeah, it would've been great to have a decent line in front of him. We haven't drafted well on the ol in several years. I don't get the logic is passing on one of the best qb prospects in years to draft line prospects that weren't that good. Honestly, it was a great time to draft a QB, a bad time to draft a lineman.

If I'm remembering right, the first tackle off the board on 2020 has been around the worst starting tackles in 2020.

I don't disagree with your logic, but the timing was great for a qb, horrible for building a line

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-25-2020, 05:04 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Completely true because you appear to forget how good he really was in 2005 when, for about three months, all of the NFL talking heads would lump Brady, Manning and Palmer together. That never happened again. It doesn't matter how "good" you think his stats were in 2006 . . . he was better before the knee injury and never looked the same again.

2005 Career high and led the league in completion percentage with 67.8 . . . 2006 . . . 62.3

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all gone.

That 93.9 rating is pretty good. It's the 2nd highest rating in his career as a Bengal . . . his highest rating as a Bengal was a 101.1 in 2005

2005 421 points . . . Defense 350 - 11-5
2006 373 points . . . Defense 331 - 8-8

2005 32 TDs led the league . . . 2006 4 less TDs on 11 more attempts but he did go from 19 sacks to 36 because he didn't look the same after the knee injury. The fire, the zip, the excitement . . . all of it . . . gone and you can't find any of that in a stat book.

Anyone still want to guess why I wanted to trade down, especially with this supporting cast?

So we just going to pretend 2015 didn’t happen? Career high in TD with 35. Career high passer rating with 104.6. Career high in yards with 4671. Career high in wins with 13 (and a playoff win). And in the MVP race.

So no, not completely true.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-25-2020, 05:14 AM)Benton Wrote: Palmer, brady, warner and other qbs had good runs after knee injuries. 

Yeah, it would've been great to have a decent line in front of him. We haven't drafted well on the ol in several years. I don't get the logic is passing on one of the best qb prospects in years to draft line prospects that weren't that good. Honestly, it was a great time to draft a QB, a bad time to draft a lineman.

If I'm remembering right, the first tackle off the board on 2020 has been around the worst starting tackles in 2020.

I don't disagree with your logic, but the timing was great for a qb, horrible for building a line

Deshaun Watson also seems to be doing alright for himself...

[Nicomo Cosca]

You can build an OL (at least partially) in FA. You can’t just go out and get a franchise QB. You have to massively overpay to get an even halfway decent one. Just ask Minnesota.

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

(12-25-2020, 05:14 AM)Benton Wrote: Palmer, brady, warner and other qbs had good runs after knee injuries. 

Yeah, it would've been great to have a decent line in front of him. We haven't drafted well on the ol in several years. I don't get the logic is passing on one of the best qb prospects in years to draft line prospects that weren't that good. Honestly, it was a great time to draft a QB, a bad time to draft a lineman.

If I'm remembering right, the first tackle off the board on 2020 has been around the worst starting tackles in 2020.

I don't disagree with your logic, but the timing was great for a qb, horrible for building a line

It didn't have to be the first tackle off of the board. The highest team that was seriously trying to get Burrow was Carolina at #8. I wanted to trade down with them, pick up at least a 1st rounder next year and their 2nd round pick this year . . . and then shop the #8 for another trade down to the late teens or early 20s to hopefully pick up yet another 1st rounder for next years draft. I'm with Fred about Hart. I felt that he was better last year than this year or his first year. I wanted the top interior linemen drafted for Mixon and if a tackle falls to the 3rd, great. The first Center went to the Saints at #24 and the first Guard selected was taken right after the Panthers 2nd round pick, which I assume would have been Cincinnati's.

What bothered me on the 2nd day is that they took the 6th rated WR over the top guard when OL was a pressing need. He's good, 3rd most receptions for rookies, 3rd most yards and tied for 3rd in TDs, but this team needed OL.

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

(12-25-2020, 05:56 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: So we just going to pretend 2015 didn’t happen? Career high in TD with 35. Career high passer rating with 104.6. Career high in yards with 4671. Career high in wins with 13 (and a playoff win). And in the MVP race.

So no, not completely true.

Awesome.

Let's hope that Burrow doesn't take 10 years and two more teams before he regains that magic with a real coach.

Keep digging.

[Essex Johnson]

(12-25-2020, 06:05 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: You can build an OL (at least partially) in FA. You can’t just go out and get a franchise QB. You have to massively overpay to get an even halfway decent one. Just ask Minnesota.

Two points. NFL has shown you dont need a franchise QB to compete in the NFl and yes you can go out and get good QBs and compete. I've seen alot of $$ thrown at FA tackles that seem over paid

As for Minn I guess from your comment then Burrow is below half way decent looking QB this year since he was on pace for 23 TDs and 90 passer rating where as Cousins in his 3 years on pace to avg. 29/30 tds and a rating of 103. If you are going to blame Cousins for this bad season I guess blame Burrow also since Minn defense is ranked worse than Bengals.

Cousins is not a half way decent QB and with your pay logic, if Burrow does what Cousins has done over next 3 yrs we need to offer  a mid range contract since he will have played halfway decent correct?

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-25-2020, 10:45 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Two points. NFL has shown you dont need a franchise QB to compete in the NFl and yes you can go out and get good QBs and compete. I've seen alot of $$ thrown at FA tackles that seem over paid

As for Minn I guess from your comment then Burrow is below half way decent looking QB this year since he was on pace for 23 TDs and 90 passer rating where as Cousins in his 3 years on pace to avg. 29/30 tds and a rating of 103. If you are going to blame Cousins for this bad season I guess blame Burrow also since Minn defense is ranked worse than Bengals.

Cousins is not a half way decent QB and with your pay logic, if Burrow does what Cousins has done over next 3 yrs we need to offer  a mid range contract since he will have played halfway decent correct?

I’m blaming Cousins contract (not his play he’s good not great) for hampering what they could do with the rest of the team. They had to let go a ton of starters because of it, including the 2 CB’s we signed, Xavier Rhodes, Diggs, etc. 33 million a season is just insane for a non-elite QB. But it’s what teams who can’t hit on their own QB’s in the draft (like Minnesota) have to do.

There is nothing more valuable in the current NFL than a QB on a rookie contract. It’s why we can’t wait around for your boy Zac to figure out how to coach.

[Essex Johnson]

(12-25-2020, 10:59 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I’m blaming Cousins contract (not his play he’s good not great) for hampering what they could do with the rest of the team. They had to let go a ton of starters because of it, including the 2 CB’s we signed, Xavier Rhodes, Diggs, etc. 33 million a season is just insane for a non-elite QB. But it’s what teams who can’t hit on their own QB’s in the draft (like Minnesota) have to do.

There is nothing more valuable in the current NFL than a QB on a rookie contract. It’s why we can’t wait around for your boy Zac to figure out how to coach.

 you stated that Cousins was a halfway decent one and his performance is much better than that.. again by your standard if your boy "Burrow" performs like Cousin which would be halfway decent QB .. he by your standard is a not a Franchise QB...

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-25-2020, 04:11 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote:  you stated that Cousins was a halfway decent one and his performance is much better than that.. again by your standard if your boy "Burrow" performs like Cousin which would be halfway decent QB .. he by your standard is a not a Franchise QB...

SIGH. Look, I just threw Cousins out as an example of an extremely overpaid FA QB. Who cares whether he’s halfway decent or good or really good, the point was you have to overpay QB’s in FA. Massively. And the play of Burrow (who should be all Bengals fans boy btw) has nothing to do with Cousins. And no it’s not comparable to an OT. Laremy Tunsil is the highest paid OT in the league at 22 million a year. That’s low end QB money. That would basically get you Teddy Bridgewater.