I believe and so do players

[*jason*]

(01-04-2021, 09:28 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: The bottom line for me - when you haven't won a playoff game in 30 years, have 5 straight losing seasons and 7 total wins in your last 40 games as a franchise - there should be zero room for patience, complacency or acceptance. This front office has a level of comfortability with failure that is truly mind boggling at times. 

The stands are gonna look awfully Covid - ish next season... Whether it's over or not.

[TheBengalsMind]

Zac Taylor "We are a better team than we showed."

If we take Zac at his word, then why is this team not performing to their potential?

Is it the coaches or is it the players?

The blame for 6-25-1 has to be on one of the two, if not both.

You don't end up with what is arguably and objectively one of the worst two season starting records by a coach in NFL history by happenstance.

Something well done, is always better then something well said.

Because without actually growth, progress and substance, such words as improvement, achievement, success and winning have no meaning.

People will buy into Zac for another year, but not if there isn't some significant changes to the coaching staff. It'd be a slap in the face to fans.

As for Joe Burrow almost nothing can stop a man, no THE man, with this kind of mental attitude and fortitude from achieving his goal.

If he says I can do this, then the team will believe they can do it. That's the kind of leader he is.

[Yojimbo]

Offense - 29th
Defense - 26th

[felis tigris]

(01-04-2021, 10:04 PM)TheBengalsMind Wrote: Zac Taylor "We are a better team than we showed."

If we take Zac at his word, then why is this team not performing to their potential?

Is it the coaches or is it the players?

The blame for 6-25-1 has to be on one of the two, if not both.

You don't end up with what is arguably and objectively one of the worst two season starting records by a coach in NFL history by happenstance.

Something well done, is always better then something well said.

Because without actually growth, progress and substance, such words as improvement, achievement, success and winning have no meaning.

People will buy into Zac for another year, but not if there isn't some significant changes to the coaching staff. It'd be a slap in the face to fans.

As for Joe Burrow almost nothing can stop a man, no THE man, with this kind of mental attitude and fortitude from achieving his goal.

If he says I can do this, then the team will believe they can do it. That's the kind of leader he is.

To be fair, COVID has made things more difficult for a developing team versus an established one.  Nonetheless, 2-14 last year, 4-11-1 this year, if we go 8-8 next, that's an exponential curve ... 16-0 in 2022, baby!

Really, though, the thing I find most disturbing is the report that the front office is making coaching staff decisions for Zac.  Frankly, that would be my biggest measuring stick of him.  Evaluate the coaching staff independently, give ZT as much rope as he wants in making retention/firing decisions on his staff and then decide what to do with him based on that.  He's had two years with the 2nd one admittedly being really strange.  The one thing he should have total control over is whether he has the right staff.  If you don't think he's effectively managing that, let him go.  If the FO is taking that out of his hands, they're also taking their best evaluation yardstick out of their own hands.  (then again, should we be surprised?)

[GodFather]

(01-04-2021, 06:55 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Conspiracy theory: The Bengals are having interns do online damage control by saying positive stuff about Zac.

Conspiracy Theory Part 2: DennyG is on this board and has multiple accounts!

[SuperBowlBound!]

(01-04-2021, 06:34 PM)Amalone002 Wrote: So many outsiders and fans wanting to change and fire everyone.  

Says alot that Burrow and Boyd, two of our best players don't want a new coach and believe in zac. We need consistency and when you fire coaches too early (see Cleveland) it's hard and the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

I'm alone here but I also agree with Mike browns message and like what we are building.  We need to get healthy and add more free agents which it sounds like they are going to do and will be fine.  

Not sure if Lou is gone or not,  I see he is taking alot of heat from fans. Is he a good DC? I don't know.  I do know he did well with what he had to work with,  we had 3rd stringers, practice squad guys out there on D vs the ravens no matter what your not stopping Lamar with those players.  We had maybe 3 good players on D in our last game,  not enough to stop the ravens. When M. Hunt is looking like one of our best players its not a good sign.  

Even in the Texans game, we gave up alot of rushing but you got to give up something in order to not let Watson beat you,  especially with our banged up defense, I think we did ok.

Zac has been calling good games as of late, team sucked as a whole Sunday though.  But he was getting all the praise the last few weeks now a bad loss fans turn again.  But I was expecting this response from fans would happen if we got whooped Sunday,  we fans are emotional.  As a Sacramento Kings fan we started off 3-0 everyone was hyped about the coach players and thinking we're a playoff team now we lose a few games.... the coach should be fired,  trade everyone etc its just funny really lol

To anyone still bringing up gase record vs Taylor.  Both are different.  Not sure if the jets had as many injuries but gase has been a head coach before he's expected to do better right out the gate.  Taylor wasn't,  if he did cool even better but he's a first time HC and they were already prepared to give him some leash, even more so with all the injuries.  

Looking forward to free agency and the draft.  Who dey!

Count me in with you as well. I am with you as well. 

[SuperBowlBound!]

(01-04-2021, 07:36 PM)BrownAssClown Wrote: Even if Taylor were to pull off an 8-8 record next season, he would still have a dismal record as head coach here. Mike Brown would see this as improvement and most likely hand Taylor an extension though. I'm not eating any crow unless Taylor and crew can deliver a record like 12-4 or better and get us into the playoffs NEXT YEAR. Since he's being brought back, against most fans wishes I might add, anything less in my eyes will be deemed as a failure. Again what I and most of you think and what the front office does, year in and year out, are two different things.

12-4 is really what you expect?
5 teams did as good if not better this year than 12-4.

Please list the new head coach you would like.
I want to see if he goes 12-4 next year.

[SuperBowlBound!]

(01-04-2021, 07:59 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: The end of the lense that is actually clear.  8-8 is no accomplishment for any coach beyond his 1st year.  

You've already gotten your wish that we retain this assclown when no one else would.  Now you're already leading with the idea that 8 wins next year is quite the accomplishment.

Yet a 7 win coach (Anthony Lynn), who had 9 wins his 1st year, and 12 wins his 2nd year, just got fired yesterday.  I guess here we'll always have lowered standards by some.  14 wins over 3 years would earn a year 4 in your mind.

Question: What is the minimum amount of games you think Taylor must win next year to earn another season?  5?  6?  7?  I'd love to know.

16 teams were 8-8 or better this year.

With your logic 16 coaches should be fired this year.

In our division 8-8 would be a pretty good year.

[MileHighGrowler]

(01-05-2021, 12:33 AM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: 16 teams were 8-8 or better this year.

With your logic 16 coaches should be fired this year.

In our division 8-8 would be a pretty good year.

In the AFC, other than the Bengals I think there's one team that was below 8-8, and it was the Pats, who have enough history with Bill B to not fire him after this season.  Every other team in the conference that dropped below that 8-8 mark is replacing their coach.  

Also, 8-8 would be a pretty good year in this division?  Are we hoping for the participating trophy or winning a SB?  You can't win out very easily if you can't get out of your own division.  Absolutely I would not accept 8-8 as a final record, this division or not.  We've got a HC going into his third year now.  They better do a lot better than 8-8 / mediocrity.  

[Amalone002]

(01-04-2021, 11:59 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: 12-4 is really what you expect?
5 teams did as good if not better this year than 12-4.

Please list the new head coach you would like.
I want to see if he goes 12-4 next year.

Lol I have high expectations next year but 12-4 will be pretty tough in this division.  If we were in any other division maybe.  
But still think we can get in the playoffs if we have luck with injuries and depending on what we get in free agency and draft especially at OL.

[fredtoast]

(01-04-2021, 06:34 PM)Amalone002 Wrote:  

Says alot that Burrow and Boyd, two of our best players don't want a new coach and believe in zac. We need consistency and when you fire coaches too early (see Cleveland) it's hard and the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

(01-04-2021, 06:36 PM)wildcatnku24 Wrote: You definitely aren't alone!  I completely agree with all this!!! Rep!

(01-04-2021, 11:57 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Count me in with you as well. I am with you as well. 

Question for you three guys.

How many games does Taylor have to win next year to keep his job?

[wildcatnku24]

(01-04-2021, 10:56 PM)felis tigris Wrote: To be fair, COVID has made things more difficult for a developing team versus an established one.  Nonetheless, 2-14 last year, 4-11-1 this year, if we go 8-8 next, that's an exponential curve ... 16-0 in 2022, baby!

Really, though, the thing I find most disturbing is the report that the front office is making coaching staff decisions for Zac.  Frankly, that would be my biggest measuring stick of him.  Evaluate the coaching staff independently, give ZT as much rope as he wants in making retention/firing decisions on his staff and then decide what to do with him based on that.  He's had two years with the 2nd one admittedly being really strange.  The one thing he should have total control over is whether he has the right staff.  If you don't think he's effectively managing that, let him go.  If the FO is taking that out of his hands, they're also taking their best evaluation yardstick out of their own hands.  (then again, should we be surprised?)

In today's press conference, Zac was very bluntly clear that the staff decisions are his to make, and he will be making them by the end of the week.

[BrownAssClown]

(01-04-2021, 11:59 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: 12-4 is really what you expect?
5 teams did as good if not better this year than 12-4.

Please list the new head coach you would like.
I want to see if he goes 12-4 next year.

Why not 12-4. We sure have sucked long enough, when the hell does the gravy train start to flow for us?

As far as which new coach I would like doesn't matter because they wouldn't come here anyway.

Now good sir, please answer a question for me.

When was the last time we hired a head coach with prior head coaching experience that had a winning record before coming here?
Before you say Bruce Coslet, he had a losing record with the Jets 26-38.

Good established head coaches do not come here. Examples: A Bill Parcels type would never come here. Bill Cowher either. I think most know why.

We have had coaches with no prior head coaching experience have success here, most hired by Paul Brown only one hired by Mike Brown and I'm not referring to Zac Taylor.

BTW, I didn't say we were going 12-4 next year. I said that or better would make me eat crow. By some miracle Taylor and Amarumo manage to pull off an 8-8 record don't be surprised if Brown gives them an extension and I'm sure some on here would lap it up.

[wildcatnku24]

(01-05-2021, 01:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Question for you three guys.

How many games does Taylor have to win next year to keep his job?

Hey Fred!  

I won't specifically mention a number, as to me that's not what it'll take.  I want to see growth and improvement.  This year the team did look better and seemed to be more competitive from game to game.  Heck, we beat the Steelers in primetime, then the following week beat Houston.  That was two proverbial monkeys off the franchise's back in two weeks!  Oh, and we did it without our #1OA and so many more players it's ridiculous.

It's also a tough division, which is an obvious statement, but I think our division is quite literally possibly as tough as it's ever been.  Big Ben hopefully retires after this year, and I don't believe they found their franchise with Mason.  Here's hoping they don't find a way to move up in the draft and get Fields.  

Anywho, let's say at least 8 wins next year.  It'd be double his previous year's wins, so I think that's fair.  

EDIT: It turns out I did mention a number, despite first stating I wouldn't. Apologies.

[Amalone002]

(01-05-2021, 01:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Question for you three guys.

How many games does Taylor have to win next year to keep his job?

About 9 or 10 is good. 

[Devils Advocate]

(01-04-2021, 07:57 PM)BrownAssClown Wrote: You sir have been conditioned. 8-8 in a head coaches third year is NOT a major step forward. PERIOD! 8-8 would not get you a playoff spot in our division. PERIOD. As much as I hate the Steelers, they are the gold standard in our division. Ask ANY Steelers fan if they would be happy in ANY season going 8-8. PERIOD.

Exactly. In this 3rd year it’s playoffs or bust. I’m at the point where if Zac doesn’t win the first game- he should be fired. Doesn’t matter if Joe is playing or not.

[SladeX]

JHC, you could change the relevant names in these threads and retrofit them for 25 years ago, and you'd have the same damn thread.
Shula will turn it around, the players love him except for the douchebag Dunlap, er, Reasons,
No he won't
Yes he will

<sigh>

[Sled21]

(01-05-2021, 01:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Question for you three guys.

How many games does Taylor have to win next year to keep his job?

You didn't ask me, but as someone who supports giving him his 3rd year, my number is 9

[XenoMorph]

(01-04-2021, 06:34 PM)Amalone002 Wrote: So many outsiders and fans wanting to change and fire everyone.  

Says alot that Burrow and Boyd, two of our best players don't want a new coach and believe in zac. We need consistency and when you fire coaches too early (see Cleveland) it's hard and the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

I'm alone here but I also agree with Mike browns message and like what we are building.  We need to get healthy and add more free agents which it sounds like they are going to do and will be fine.  

Not sure if Lou is gone or not,  I see he is taking alot of heat from fans. Is he a good DC? I don't know.  I do know he did well with what he had to work with,  we had 3rd stringers, practice squad guys out there on D vs the ravens no matter what your not stopping Lamar with those players.  We had maybe 3 good players on D in our last game,  not enough to stop the ravens. When M. Hunt is looking like one of our best players its not a good sign.  

Even in the Texans game, we gave up alot of rushing but you got to give up something in order to not let Watson beat you,  especially with our banged up defense, I think we did ok.

Zac has been calling good games as of late, team sucked as a whole Sunday though.  But he was getting all the praise the last few weeks now a bad loss fans turn again.  But I was expecting this response from fans would happen if we got whooped Sunday,  we fans are emotional.  As a Sacramento Kings fan we started off 3-0 everyone was hyped about the coach players and thinking we're a playoff team now we lose a few games.... the coach should be fired,  trade everyone etc its just funny really lol

To anyone still bringing up gase record vs Taylor.  Both are different.  Not sure if the jets had as many injuries but gase has been a head coach before he's expected to do better right out the gate.  Taylor wasn't,  if he did cool even better but he's a first time HC and they were already prepared to give him some leash, even more so with all the injuries.  

Looking forward to free agency and the draft.  Who dey!

Zach hasnt really been calling good games......

[Sled21]

(01-05-2021, 10:14 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: Zach hasnt really been calling good games......

He's called some good ones and some bad ones. And in many we really don't know because the line didn't hold up enough for any play to develop.