If We Go Into the Season with Uzomah and Sample...

[Sled21]

(03-18-2021, 10:11 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Did any other team get less than 2 TD’s from their entire TE group last year?

Did any other team have as shitty an oline as we did last year? 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(03-18-2021, 10:13 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Did any other team have as shitty an oline as we did last year? 

Yes. The Chargers OL was equally as awful as ours. Yet their TE’s still had 8 TD. Just one example.

Btw have we done anything to fix that shitty OL yet? Maybe I missed it...

[BenZoo2]

There are other good te’s in the draft. They may not be Pitts, but could certainly be better than what we have.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wes Mantooth]

(03-18-2021, 10:11 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Did any other team get less than 2 TD’s from their entire TE group last year?

Now, now, remember for this thread Fred has set to debate to center around receptions and receptions alone.  Yards, TD's, and other relevant measurables are to be completely ignored.

Let's stay on track...

[Fulcher_33]

(03-18-2021, 10:16 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Yes. The Chargers OL was equally as awful as ours. Yet their TE’s still had 8 TD. Just one example.

Btw have we done anything to fix that shitty OL yet? Maybe I missed it...

Reiff has been there all day on a visit. I think they locked him in the broom closet and forcing him to listen to Mike Browns stories until he signs his contract

[BengalsRocker]

(03-18-2021, 11:04 PM)Fulcher_33 Wrote: Reiff has been there all day on a visit. I think they locked him in the broom closet and forcing him to listen to Mike Browns stories until he signs his contract

He's being hot-boxed by a Skyline engorged Geno right now. 

Gotta get that ink somehow.

[Fulcher_33]

(03-18-2021, 11:28 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: He's being hot-boxed by a Skyline engorged Geno right now. 

Gotta get that ink somehow.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(03-18-2021, 05:12 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: If we go into the season we Uzomah and Sample I'm going to lose my shit.

Fwiw, I'm starting to believe we will but I'm just bitching about it ahead of time so I don't accussed of looking for things to complain about, or using hindsight or anything else. And if it matters, I've been beating this drum ever since the middle of last year.

Uzomah is in his last year deal. He carries very little in dead space if he were to be cut. The guy has accomplished virtually nothing in his 6 year career (under 200 yards a seaon, under 1.2 TD's a seaon). And if all that isn't enough to realize we might want to move, he's coming off a torn achilies.

Then you have Drew Sample. Look, I've made my opinion well know on this guy (bum). He has offers nothing in the pass game. He's nowhere near starter level, and he's a middle of the road backup at best.

Would anyone disagree that these two being your top two TE's would mean you have an absolute bottom of the barrell TE group? Does anyone dispute that? These two guys are among the worst duo's you can find at the position.

So one would think, with Uzomah being so easy cut, with us having cap space, and with the position being so below average that we would look to upgrade it, right? I mean, seriously, why would you not?

Well let's take a look at some of the Tight Ends that are already off the board this early in free agency (as far as I know we didn't pursue a single one of them)...

-Hunter Henry
-Jonnu Smith
-Kyle Rudolph
-Gerald Everett
-Jared Cook

Alright, so maybe you think a player or two is too expensive. Maybe one is too old. Maybe you just think a couple of they are overrated. That's all fair, but I think as this list grows it's going to be harder and harder to ignore the opportunity missed.

If we pass on all these guys, if we pass on trying to trade for Evan Engram, if we pass on trying to trade for Ertz, if we don't at least make a play at Gronk, and if we pass on Kyle Pitts, then what the hell are we doing?

There's a lot of things I complain about when it comes to the Bengals. Something like this would be near the top. You can't just completely ignore a position of need when there's this many different options (expensive, middle tier, cheap, trade, draft). There's a lot of different ways we could get better here. Keeping Uzomah and Sample is about the laziest of laziest moves.

I'll wrap it up here. I know that for whatever reason, people are perfectly fine with Uzomah and Sample but I'll never understand why. Uzomah gets cuts on 31/32 teams in this league. So I hope the Bengals surprise me here and make a run at someone giving us a legitimate option at TE.

Please, Bengals.... Please, please, please upgrade your Tight End!

I know it was a long time ago as Uzomah was injured during the second game of the season but one thing I think you are forgetting is that Uzomah seemed to have good chemistry with Burrow. It showed up throughout training camp, he was obviously Burrow's first NFL TD pass and at the time of Uzomah's injury he was - other than forcing the ball at AJ - probably Burrow's favorite and most successful target. Then once Burrow went down injured as well Joe was rehabbing with CJ. That's not to say don't get in an extra TE (I would be excited to see Pitts in stripes) but Uzomah isn't the obvious cut you make him out to be.

(03-18-2021, 05:15 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Evan Engram and Kyle Pitts after the Reiff signing is my call.

Maybe then you would quit bitching Wes lol

Unlikely.

[NATI BENGALS]

Sample is going to be a big time player for us this year.

[TJ528]

(03-18-2021, 05:12 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: If we go into the season we Uzomah and Sample I'm going to lose my shit.

Fwiw, I'm starting to  believe we will but I'm just bitching about it ahead of time so I don't accussed of looking for things to complain about, or using hindsight or anything else.  And if it matters, I've been beating this drum ever since the middle of last year.

Uzomah is in his last year deal.  He carries very little in dead space if he were to be cut.  The guy has accomplished virtually nothing in his 6 year career (under 200 yards a seaon, under 1.2 TD's a seaon).  And if all that isn't enough to realize we might want to move, he's coming off a torn achilies.

Then you have Drew Sample.  Look, I've made my opinion well know on this guy (bum).  He has offers nothing in the pass game.  He's nowhere near starter level, and he's a middle of the road backup at best.

Would anyone disagree that these two being your top two TE's would mean you have an absolute bottom of the barrell TE group?  Does anyone dispute that?  These two guys are among the worst duo's you can find at the position.

So one would think, with Uzomah being so easy cut, with us having cap space, and with the position being so below average that we would look to upgrade it, right?  I mean, seriously, why would you not?

Well let's take a look at some of the Tight Ends that are already off the board this early in free agency (as far as I know we didn't pursue a single one of them)...

-Hunter Henry
-Jonnu Smith
-Kyle Rudolph
-Gerald Everett
-Jared Cook

Alright, so maybe you think a player or two is too expensive.  Maybe one is too old.  Maybe you just think a couple of they are overrated.  That's all fair, but I think as this list grows it's going to be harder and harder to ignore the opportunity missed.

If we pass on all these guys, if we pass on trying to trade for Evan Engram, if we pass on trying to trade for Ertz, if we don't at least make a play at Gronk, and if we pass on Kyle Pitts, then what the hell are we doing?

There's a lot of things I complain about when it comes to the Bengals.  Something like this would be near the top.  You can't just completely ignore a position of need when there's this many different options (expensive, middle tier, cheap, trade, draft).  There's a lot of different ways we could get better here.  Keeping Uzomah and Sample is about the laziest of laziest moves.

I'll wrap it up here.  I know that for whatever reason, people are perfectly fine with Uzomah and Sample but I'll never understand why.  Uzomah gets cuts on 31/32 teams in this league.  So I hope the Bengals surprise me here and make a run at someone giving us a legitimate option at TE.  

Please, Bengals....  Please, please, please upgrade your Tight End!

Wes, I think thats exactly what the Bengals go into 2021 with is Sample and Uzomah.  The FO likes them both and so does the coaching staff.  

I dont think either one gives you much except for maybe some blocking.  Neither one put the fear of life into you as a receiver nor a blocker but I don't think Pitts is a strong blocker either and I'm just saying have you looked at the Bengals OL recently? :) lol 

My guess is they stick with Uzomah and Sample to stay in and block and give Burrow protection. 

[Wes Mantooth]

(03-19-2021, 10:13 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Sample is going to be a big time player for us this year.

[fredtoast]

(03-18-2021, 10:47 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: You bring up Uzomah in 2018 (one year out of six).  So you pick a career year.  That's fine I suppose.  But that really doesn't mean much when we're evaluating him now coming off an achilies tear and a decent cap hit now does it.


If you're trying to convince that a guy who is coming off a significant injury once has statitistics that would have put him 25th in the league in receiving yards then you're doing a terrible job

I am not bring up anything about Uzomah being 25th in the league in receiving yards.

I am pointing out that in 2018 that among TEs he finished 16th in receptions, 18th in yards, and 17th in tds, 

Not a big star, but very solid numbers.  If he is healthy then he is no where near the "absolute" bottom of the barrel as a starting TE.

Now I know how upset you get when I disagree with what you actually say because apparently you never say what you really mean, but it is silly to say that a guy who had a year like this has "accomplished virtually nothing" in his career.

[fredtoast]

(03-18-2021, 10:47 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Again, some teams have multiple Tight Ends who play a significant amount.  Sometimes they even play at the same time.  that was not the case here.  It was the Drew Sample show from the 2nd half of the 2nd game and on.

And again you refuse to acknowledge that sample will be our #2 TE with Uzomah back.

Sample was thrust into the #1 TE position and still outproduced several #1 TEs from other teams.  That does not mean he is great, but when you sre talking about a duo of Sample and Uzomah you should be comparing Sample to the #2 TE from other teams.

[fredtoast]

Here is the most pathetic thing about debating you.

I use direct quotes when addressing your arguments, and you get upset because I should understand that you don't really mean exactly what I say.  But when I say this.  .  .  

(03-18-2021, 06:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Would I complain about the Bengals getting an upgrade at TE?  No.  I admit that our TEs are not among the best in the league. 

You can't deal with it so instead you make up a total bullshit false quote out of thin air like this.

(03-18-2021, 05:12 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: "Our TE who was 5th in the league in snaps, who played on a team with the 13th most pass attempts, finished 24th in receptions!!!  Why would we want to upgrade here???"

If you want to continue this debate please grow up and address what I actually say.

In Uzomah we have a solid starting TE.  Not near the top but he has shown that he can be more productive than many TEs starting for other teams.  It is absurd to claim that he would be cut by every team in the league except the Bengals.  We also have Drew Sample who is a middle of the road TE.  Obviously not near the top, but when thrust into the #1 role he outperformed the best TEs on several other NFL teams.  Not a downfield threat, but very dependable.  His catch% of 75.5 actually ranked 5th in the league among the 31 TEs with at last 30 receptions.

So I would not mind an upgrade at TE.  But if we have both of these guys healthy as a duo they are FAR from the ABSOLUTE bottom of the barrel.  In fact I would say they are above average.

[Wes Mantooth]

(03-19-2021, 11:41 AM)fredtoast Wrote: but it is silly to say that a guy who had a year like this has "accomplished virtually nothing" in his career.

The man has played in this league for SIX years and has career totals of 1,084 yards and 8 TD's.

Believe it or not, I'm very careful in how I word things.  Or at least I try to be.  Prefacing "nothing" with "virtually" is pretty significant IMO.  There's a difference.  Had I said he accomplished "nothing" that means something entirely different than "virtually nothing".

I'm sorry, big picture, entirity of his career, he has accomplished very little.  If you take exception to "virtually nothing" then you can pick your word choice or expression. 

Same goes for "bottom of the barrel".  I use that to mean among the worst, not the worst (maybe I'm using it wrong).  Similar to how I would say Natty Light is a bottom of the barrel beer.  I don't mean that to mean it's 100% the worst beer, I mean it falls in that category that is filled with Busch Ice, Steel Reserve, Milwaukees Best, etc. They're all shitty beers, and they're all among the worst.

[Wes Mantooth]

(03-19-2021, 12:09 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But if we have both of these guys healthy as a duo they are FAR from the ABSOLUTE bottom of the barrel.  In fact I would say they are above average.

[Wes Mantooth]

(03-19-2021, 12:09 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It is absurd to claim that he would be cut by every team in the league except the Bengals.

In this current situation, no I don't think it is.

Due 6.3 million dollars, with his career production, in the last year of his contract, coming off an achilies tear, and on a team that has no other quality receiving Tight End....  I think that gets cut him pretty much anywhere.

But maybe I'm wrong.  I'll be glad to admit that there is no way to prove this.  Hell, there might be a team or two out there that is just as stupid as we would be if we keep this guy at that dollar amount.

But whether he gets cuts by 31 teams, or 30 teams, or 28 teams, or even he cuts by most teams, I don't think that really changes the argument all that much.  It's pretty much semantics.

But here, I'll change to something more digestable for you:  "There are very few teams that would keep CJ Uzomah on the books this year in this situation."

You don't make a guy who has averaged less than 200 yards receiving a year, and is coming off a major injury the 15th highest paid Tight End in the league, which is what he will be if we choose to keep him.  That's just a ridiculous waste of  money.

[*bfine32*]

I think folks are going to be surprised with CJ this year. Before he went down (small sample size; pun not intended) he was on a 60 catch 700 yard 8 TD season and this was before Joe hit his stride.

Often when asked about rehab; Joe mentions the benefit it has been rehabbing with CJ; I think we'll see a connection. As to Sample: He's one of the most WTF picks I've seen from the organization; but it is sunk cost.