My final pre-draft thoughts on Chase/Sewell

[Burma]

The line of thinking with waiting to address the O-line is a bit baffling to me. It's like listening to someone who drives a La Ferrari reasoning why he has second hand salvage yard tires. "You see, this engine? She has been hand tuned by blind Norwegian nuns from Albania. They have spent 62 years learning to tune by sound alone!! And this suspension!! Made from the finest angel wing sinew and bouyed by the bottled dreams of war orphans!! I do not need to spend high Euro amounts on tires! Tires are boring! You can't even read them when this machine is in motion! The sheer performance characteristics of this car will make the tires better! And my tire rotator, he is the most respected tire rotator in the world! He has taken Nexens and made them able to perform like a Michelin! Michelins!"

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-27-2021, 06:48 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: If you listen to interviews with Burrow, he didn't come out of his apartment execpt to practice or work out.  Some of the nicest people I know have done some things I would have never guessed.  You just never know what happens,.

It also sounds like it was probably under Les Miles if you read the article Bfine linked:

This is the second lawsuit filed this month against LSU and its leadership.

Lewis earlier filed a federal racketeering lawsuit accusing university officials of retaliating against her for reporting racist remarks and inappropriate sexual behavior by former coach Les Miles. The lawsuit also accuses LSU officials of working with a law firm to cover up allegations against Miles, including one that he engaged in "explicit sex acts" with a student. Miles and his attorney have denied any wrongdoing.

Hopefully Ed Orgeron is a better person, and was running a tighter ship.

[Hammerstripes]

(04-27-2021, 06:55 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: It also sounds like it was probably under Les Miles if you read the article Bfine linked:

This is the second lawsuit filed this month against LSU and its leadership.

Lewis earlier filed a federal racketeering lawsuit accusing university officials of retaliating against her for reporting racist remarks and inappropriate sexual behavior by former coach Les Miles. The lawsuit also accuses LSU officials of working with a law firm to cover up allegations against Miles, including one that he engaged in "explicit sex acts" with a student. Miles and his attorney have denied any wrongdoing.

Hopefully Ed Orgeron is a better person, and was running a tighter ship.

I would hope so.  I think a lot of this goes back to Guice.

[Murdock2420]

(04-27-2021, 06:32 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: If only we had an inside source into the LSU program...

Cause Joe would know what every guy on the team does on his free time??

Do you know what your closest friend does every moment?

That is a terrible take Nico.

Chase could very well be involved and if so, I'm pretty sure he wouldn't walk up to Burrow and be like, hey Joe guess what I did last night....

I'm not saying he was or wasn't involved but it would just be the Bengals' luck that we draft Chase and then this scandal gets rolling and he ends up being involved.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-27-2021, 09:18 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Cause Joe would know what every guy on the team does on his free time??

Do you know what your closest friend does every moment?

That is a terrible take Nico.

Chase could very well be involved and if so, I'm pretty sure he wouldn't walk up to Burrow and be like, hey Joe guess what I did last night....

I'm not saying he was or wasn't involved but it would just be the Bengals' luck that we draft Chase and then this scandal gets rolling and he ends up being involved.

I think it’s a little naive to think this stuff doesn’t get around. The whole story is about how the girls came forward but the school covered it up. For years. This was not a case of one or two isolated incidents.

And yes, I can vouch for my best friend not being a rapist.

[Shake n Blake]

(04-27-2021, 02:02 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I said I wouldn't respond, but since you insist on being disrespectful in your reply, I guess I'll respond one time. A back and forth with you can go on til draft day, so this is only to clarify that one point that you selected to pick at.

Imo, teams don't often pay a star QB and a pair of high priced WRs. If you can give me several current examples, I'll stand corrected. Until then, your snarky dismissal is just more of you campaigning for Chase.

On the other hand, teams commonly pay 2 tackles.

(04-27-2021, 02:33 PM)Whatever Wrote: Teams currently paying 2 WR's $15+ mil APY

Browns
Buccaneers

Teams currently paying 2 WR's $10+ mil APY

Giants
Rams
Dolphins

Teams currently paying 2 OT's $15+ mil APY

none

Teams currently paying 2 OT's $10+ mil APY

Broncos
Cowboys

I will apologize for being snarky, but your statement is obviously untrue.

You might want to re-read my statement.  

Bucs QB - Tom Brady - $10.5 million cap hit
Browns - Baker Mayfield - $10.5 million cap hit
Giants - Daniel Jones - $7.1 million cap hit

The Rams are the only ones paying a QB and a pair of WRs, but both of those WR's are making less than $6 million this year. If they don't produce big time with Stafford, Woods can be cut next year, and Kupp can be cut in 2023, according to Spotrac.

With the Cowboys, who is your 2nd WR making 10+ average? I see Amari Cooper and that's it. CeeDee Lamb is 2 years into a 4 year/14 million deal.

Btw, you should use cap hits for 2021 if you want to prove anything, because who knows how the Rams situation (your only semi-valid example) will turn out once Woods and Cupp's big money kicks in, and the Rams can get out from under at least one of them. They'd better produce big time this year.

-------------

As for the 2 tackles, Jonah really hasn't proven he'll get a big contract yet anyway. Dude can't stay healthy. The Bills are paying $11.4 million for one Tackle, and $6.1 million for the other (2021 cap hits), and I could see a similar situation here...if Jonah can actually stay healthy and produce.

The Browns are paying 3 linemen over $10 million in 2021. But only one Tackle. So you got me on a technicality.

The Cowboys are paying 3 linemen between $6.8 million and $10 million.

The Broncos are paying a Tackle $13 million and a Guard $11.6 million.

The Colts are paying their Center and 2 Guards a total of $30 million.

I only went through 14 teams and found all these examples. I'm sure you'll say "but they're not 2 Tackles"...but here's the thing: The Bengals don't value interior line. If they dump money on 2 linemen, it's going to be the 2 Tackles.

[Murdock2420]

(04-27-2021, 09:57 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I think it’s a little naive to think this stuff doesn’t get around. The whole story is about how the girls came forward but the school covered it up. For years. This was not a case of one or two isolated incidents.

And yes, I can vouch for my best friend not being a rapist.

Could you in college?

Cause I'm going to be completely real. There were guys I was close to in college that I don't hang out with anymore because I learned things about them that they were good at hiding or maybe at 20 and 21 I just wasn't paying attention to. 

The only way Burrow 100% would know would be if he spent every moment with Chase, and I can promise you that wasn't the case.

Also, "this stuff doesn't get around?"

Well it's been quiet for years as it happened and just now came out. Pretty sure the guys involved aren't tweeting about this. 

Hell, look locally. We still have no clue what really happened with UC basketball and the coach was fired. Nothing is getting around, the players involved are coming out and saying this is what happened. So it isn't naive to think it could be hidden, I think the only naive stance is to believe that there is no possible way a guy could be involved because he is your preferred player in a draft....

 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-27-2021, 10:21 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Could you in college?

Cause I'm going to be completely real. There were guys I was close to in college that I don't hang out with anymore because I learned things about them that they were good at hiding or maybe at 20 and 21 I just wasn't paying attention to. 

The only way Burrow 100% would know would be if he spent every moment with Chase, and I can promise you that wasn't the case.

Also, "this stuff doesn't get around?"

Well it's been quiet for years as it happened and just now came out. Pretty sure the guys involved aren't tweeting about this. 

Hell, look locally. We still have no clue what really happened with UC basketball and the coach was fired. Nothing is getting around, the players involved are coming out and saying this is what happened. So it isn't naive to think it could be hidden, I think the only naive stance is to believe that there is no possible way a guy could be involved because he is your preferred player in a draft....

 

That’s bullshit and you know it. You are continually going completely off the rails with this stuff (wanting them to miss on picks to “teach them a lesson”) and now you’re accusing me of something pretty gross here. Take a breath, buddy. Take a step back. IT’S ONE DRAFT PICK. There is no reason for it to get this ugly.

All I said is its nice that we have a close tie to Chase in Burrow. And that goes to vouching for his character even before this.

[*rfaulk34*]

(04-26-2021, 02:17 PM)Gamma Ray Tan Wrote: Bengals will trade back with QB needy Denver at 9 and get a 1st in 2022. Bengals select Slater or Darrisaw with 9th pick, whoever falls to them. Mark it down.

Better use a pencil. There's no freaking way they miss out on one of the big 3.

[Murdock2420]

(04-27-2021, 10:32 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: That’s bullshit and you know it. You are continually going completely off the rails with this stuff (wanting them to miss on picks to “teach them a lesson”) and now you’re accusing me of something pretty gross here. Take a breath, buddy. Take a step back. IT’S ONE DRAFT PICK. There is no reason for it to get this ugly.

All I said is its nice that we have a close tie to Chase in Burrow. And that goes to vouching for his character even before this.

Off the rails?

You said it was naive to think the stuff doesn't get around. So, I used the same language and you get offended.

I think it is naive to believe that Burrow knows everything anyone he played football with does every moment of the day. You are defending him (when no one is even accusing him of doing anything at all) like someone personally insulted you. 

This all started when I said I wish it came out three weeks earlier so we'd know if Chase was involved or for that matter any LSU player in the draft. And bam... here you come Captain Chase defender saying Burrow could vouch for what Chase does. How the hell would Burrow know what Chase did this entire year? Chase was on campus but opted out of football. I would hope Burrow was focused on more important things then what the hell Chase was doing last year.

If you can't even consider that this could be an issue, then that is a total you issue. It may be absolutely nothing, but if you can't at least look at this in the same light as I did with the sense of, "Damn wish this would have come out sooner just to be in the clear" then that is a you issue. 

Read that again... "Wish this had come out sooner just to be in the clear, to make sure he isn't involved, to make sure this won't be a problem."

No where am I saying I think he did, hope he did, anything. But, if you look at this and go... ehhh, no worries not possible, then yes you are naive.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-27-2021, 10:42 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Off the rails?

You said it was naive to think the stuff doesn't get around. So, I used the same language and you get offended.

I think it is naive to believe that Burrow knows everything anyone he played football with does every moment of the day. You are defending him (when no one is even accusing him of doing anything at all) like someone personally insulted you. 

This all started when I said I wish it came out three weeks earlier so we'd know if Chase was involved or for that matter any LSU player in the draft. And bam... here you come Captain Chase defender saying Burrow could vouch for what Chase does. How the hell would Burrow know what Chase did this entire year? Chase was on campus but opted out of football. I would hope Burrow was focused on more important things then what the hell Chase was doing last year.

If you can't even consider that this could be an issue, then that is a total you issue. It may be absolutely nothing, but if you can't at least look at this in the same light as I did with the sense of, "Damn wish this would have come out sooner just to be in the clear" then that is a you issue. 

Read that again... "Wish this had come out sooner just to be in the clear, to make sure he isn't involved, to make sure this won't be a problem."

No where am I saying I think he did, hope he did, anything. But, if you look at this and go... ehhh, no worries not possible, then yes you are naive.

Was he even at LSU? I know the EXOS training he did was at least 12 weeks, and since he’s not graduating idk why he’d stay on campus.

[Murdock2420]

(04-27-2021, 11:31 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Was he even at LSU? I know the EXOS training he did was at least 12 weeks, and since he’s not graduating idk why he’d stay on campus.

I believe he was still living on campus for at least part of the 2021 LSU season and would have needed to be around to be part of the Pro Day.

[The Clapp]

(04-27-2021, 11:47 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I believe he was still living on campus for at least part of the 2021 LSU season and would have needed to be around to be part of the Pro Day.

Did this stuff happen in the last 2 yrs? The names i saw were Guice and someone named Drake.... maybe i missed something

[Murdock2420]

(04-27-2021, 11:58 PM)The Clapp Wrote: Did this stuff happen in the last 2 yrs? The names i saw were Guice and someone named Drake.... maybe i missed something

According to the 118-page document, the women attended the Baton Rouge campus at some point from 2013 to 2021.


So... no clue. Again this is why I said I wish this came out three weeks ago so there would be more clarity. Maybe a smaller time frame is established, maybe it clears the guys in the draft. At no point did I accuse or even imply Chase was involved. I just stated I wished there was time to be certain either way and 2 days isn't enough time. 


Not too mention in these types of cases usually once the damn breaks a lot more pours out. 

[Bengal Dude]

My feelings are this are simple. Between Sewell and Chase, I would rather take Sewell. I firmly believe the team will take Chase and I feel like he'll be good player for us. I am nervous about landing an OL in the 2nd round. My fear is that there's a run in the end of the first/early second so the Bengals go in a different direction. Then we get to the third round and miss out on another OL or we just say F it and take whatever one is the highest ranked on our board, no matter how big of a reach it is.

[Whatever]

(04-27-2021, 10:02 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: You might want to re-read my statement.  

Bucs QB - Tom Brady - $10.5 million cap hit
Browns - Baker Mayfield - $10.5 million cap hit
Giants - Daniel Jones - $7.1 million cap hit

The Rams are the only ones paying a QB and a pair of WRs, but both of those WR's are making less than $6 million this year. If they don't produce big time with Stafford, Woods can be cut next year, and Kupp can be cut in 2023, according to Spotrac.

With the Cowboys, who is your 2nd WR making 10+ average? I see Amari Cooper and that's it. CeeDee Lamb is 2 years into a 4 year/14 million deal.

Btw, you should use cap hits for 2021 if you want to prove anything, because who knows how the Rams situation (your only semi-valid example) will turn out once Woods and Cupp's big money kicks in, and the Rams can get out from under at least one of them. They'd better produce big time this year.

-------------

As for the 2 tackles, Jonah really hasn't proven he'll get a big contract yet anyway. Dude can't stay healthy. The Bills are paying $11.4 million for one Tackle, and $6.1 million for the other (2021 cap hits), and I could see a similar situation here...if Jonah can actually stay healthy and produce.

The Browns are paying 3 linemen over $10 million in 2021. But only one Tackle. So you got me on a technicality.

The Cowboys are paying 3 linemen between $6.8 million and $10 million.

The Broncos are paying a Tackle $13 million and a Guard $11.6 million.

The Colts are paying their Center and 2 Guards a total of $30 million.

I only went through 14 teams and found all these examples. I'm sure you'll say "but they're not 2 Tackles"...but here's the thing: The Bengals don't value interior line. If they dump money on 2 linemen, it's going to be the 2 Tackles.

Brady has a 2 year $50 mil deal.  He restructured his deal to give Tampa extra cap room this year, but he's still getting that money.  Reread what you wrote.  You said paid, not cap hit.  Teams do creative accounting to create cap room all the time. That doesn't mean the players aren't getting paid.  

The Cowboys weren't listed as a team paying 2 WR's $10+ mil.  They are one of only 2 teams paying 2 T's $10+ mil.  They would also be the only example of a team paying 2 T's $10+ mil and paying high end QB money.

If Jonah, hasn't earned a big contract yet, what makes you think Tee, Burrow, Sewell, and/or Chase all will?

You didn't say 2 OL.  You said teams commonly pay two tackles.  Which they don't.  You know how many teams I can add if I average out salaries like you did?  Paying one guy $15 mil and another guy $5 mil is not anyone's definition of paying 2 T's.You know how many teams I can add if expand WR to pass catcher like you expanded T to OL?

Even with all this strawmanning aside, the fact remains that you're wrong.  There are not more teams out there paying for 2 top T's than 2 top WR's, whether they're paying top QB money or not.  There's no factual evidence behind your point, whatsoever.  

[Murdock2420]

If anyone wants these for Thursday

Download 8.5" x 11" PDF to print your card out! Tag me in your post with the hashtag, #TeamChase #TeamPitts or #TeamSewell ?

Link:https://t.co/HC41oUVsSF pic.twitter.com/8UDKyb3Dko

— ??????™ (@DaltonSignature) April 27, 2021

Pretty slick work

[*bfine32*]

They were interviewing one of the National Scouts today "Greer" and the talk turned to Bengals. He said no team has sent coaches to more workouts for 2nd tier olinemen than Cincinnati. He said he's "almost certain" Bengals are not going oline in Rd 1. Conversely teams like Detriot and Chargers definitely are.

[*Synric*]

(04-28-2021, 03:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: They were interviewing one of the National Scouts today "Greer" and the talk turned to Bengals. He said no team has sent coaches to more workouts for 2nd tier olinemen than Cincinnati. He said he's "almost certain" Bengals are not going oline in Rd 1. Conversely teams like Detriot and Chargers definitely are.

Good I hope they take two lol.

[Hammerstripes]

(04-28-2021, 03:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: They were interviewing one of the National Scouts today "Greer" and the talk turned to Bengals. He said no team has sent coaches to more workouts for 2nd tier olinemen than Cincinnati. He said he's "almost certain" Bengals are not going oline in Rd 1. Conversely teams like Detriot and Chargers definitely are.

The Charger going O-line is not surprising at all.  They are going all in with Herbert and are doing everything they can to protect him.  Linsley in the offseason and then a guy like Sewell or Slater.

Pretty much the blueprint for a young franchise QB.