Perhaps Mike Brown isn't so Semi-Retired?

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(05-02-2021, 11:55 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Fair enough.

Saw it in the reply and was like... WTF? I know I was 100% team Sewell, but I've tried very hard since the draft to not be a giant downer. I've had my opinions and my thoughts but certainly have tried to not be all "the world is ending".

It's all good.

You're a Clemson fan; why would you hate the guy?

[Murdock2420]

(05-02-2021, 11:57 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote:

You're a Clemson fan; why would you hate the guy?

Exactly!

[grampahol]

You guys just don't get it..The Bengals have what could be associated directly with the Saint Jude of Novina machine under PBS..just publish it 15 times and it's never been known to fail.. Sacred heart of St Jude..bless us with the great draft of 2021!

[*Synric*]

(05-02-2021, 11:38 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I have heard that he is well respected by others but it makes me wonder what happened. 

His teaching and style and scouting clearly wasn't working here. Left here, went to Dallas and again was let go. Just don't get how he can run these camps and be so well thought of but when he gets a job on a team he fails. 

Fans have short memories and Bengals fans are specifically jaded by the Ogbuehi and Fisher picks but if you look at his entire career in Cincy he had some excellent draft picks more than he had bad ones (nobody is perfect).

I have no idea why he was fired from the Bengals or the Cowboys but I do know since then he has become the go to guy for most of the top prospects getting ready for the draft. He also teaches new scouts what to look for in offensive line prospects.

Paul Alexander also put out an online course last year for everyone. I loved it. 

[Murdock2420]

(05-03-2021, 12:13 AM)Synric Wrote: Fans have short memories and Bengals fans are specifically jaded by the Ogbuehi and Fisher picks but if you look at his entire career in Cincy he had some excellent draft picks more than he had bad ones (nobody is perfect).

I have no idea why he was fired from the Bengals or the Cowboys but I do know since then he has become the go to guy for most of the top prospects getting ready for the draft. He also teaches new scouts what to look for in offensive line prospects.

Paul Alexander also put out an online course last year for everyone. I loved it. 

I remember when he was the guy. 

I remember when this team was garbage and had bad coaches everywhere and bad players everywhere but always had a good line because of Alexander's scouting and coaching.

And that is why I have the question of what happened. When did he go from just pulling rabbits out of his hats to just missing and not getting the most out of guys anymore. 

I am not coming down on him, I am honestly curious what changed that made the line start to slip and his scouting to slip. And not just here, but also in Dallas. It just... was weird.

I do find it weird though that Mike is reaching out to a guy he fired for advice. That just seems... odd. Maybe it is common in football but.. it just seems odd.

[Benton]

(05-02-2021, 11:41 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: He absolutely worked out with Sewell AND Slater didn't work out with him, because he worked out with Duke who... guess what? CARMAN ALSO WORKED OUT WITH.

I'm disappointed in a lot of you negative pukes on this board; instead of getting behind our guys are hoping for them to be great players, this bullshit article comes up and everyone gets all pissy and become chicken littles.

Who gives a shit WHO made the pick; all that matters is that they play well, so get behind them and hope for them to live up to their draft spot.

Need some time away from here; absolute loser-mentality with the inferences made in this thread.

5 years ago, most folks thought PA and MB were negative pukes who couldn't build a line.

Now, they support a guy expected to go round three and that's obvious by the majority of the board that can't even spell his name right?

[Murdock2420]

(05-03-2021, 12:23 AM)Benton Wrote: 5 years ago, most folks thought PA and MB were negative pukes who couldn't build a line.

Now, they support a guy expected to go round three and that's obvious by the majority of the board that can't even spell his name right?

Right? 

[Benton]

(05-03-2021, 12:27 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote:


Right? 

It's just a little frustrating.

A third of the defenders (if not more) of the pick, can't even spell the dude's name right.

'Carmen is a day 1 starter.'
'Carmen was the best guard in the draft.'
'Carmen was the biggest steal.'

WTF guys. If you're going to defend someone's honor, at least spell their ****ing name right. And get his position right.

[*jason*]

(05-03-2021, 12:37 AM)Benton Wrote: It's just a little frustrating.

A third of the defenders (if not more) of the pick, can't even spell the dude's name right.

'Carmen is a day 1 starter.'
'Carmen was the best guard in the draft.'
'Carmen was the biggest steal.'

WTF guys. If you're going to defend someone's honor, at least spell their ****ing name right. And get his position right.

Until he was picked, I didn't know Carman (Lord let me get the spelling right for the sake of argument) from Adam.

I can't help but wonder if autocorrect might not be to blame for a third ( maybe two thirds ) of the board misspelling the new guy's name...

Full disclosure... I didn't know Chase' s name had an apostrophe in it til we drafted him.

[Benton]

(05-03-2021, 12:45 AM)jason Wrote: Until he was picked, I didn't know Carman (Lord let me get the spelling right for the sake of argument) from Adam.

I can't help but wonder if autocorrect might not be to blame for a third ( maybe two thirds ) of the board misspelling the new guy's name...

Full disclosure... I didn't know Chase' s name had an apostrophe in it til we drafted him.

It's just... Weird.

People are like 'You don't liky Carmen!? Carmen was the top rated guard! Carmen is a day 1 starter! You're just jealous!'

And it's like, Carman was a mid ranked tackle who nobody thought would've started. And his name is Carman.

[bengaloo]

Very interesting stuff here. First off, all I want right now is for Jackson Carman to play well, and grow as a player and person in life. We drafted him and he's a Bengal now. That being said, I was definitely a Sewell or tradeback for Darrisaw/Slater guy, but it didnt pan out that way. Probably because Mike Brown is indeed still running the show and Burrow to Chase will sell tickets, get many fans back on board, and get national media hype moreso than any OL ever will. Not to undersell Chase because he is a great WR and worthy of a top 5 pick for sure. But we do have 2 very good WRs already. It is what it is.

So now we have Jackson Carman. I didnt know a lot about him except where he was being picked in mock simulators, which was usually later than the 2nd round, but honestly I think he has potential to be a good NFL OLman like Alexander is saying based on watching some of his film out there and learning more about him. I think he could turn out to be a good RT for us honestly. My only real concern right now is the move to G this year. He looks to have the ability for sure, but that backfired on us last year when we tried to make Fred Johnson a G and it was one of the most pathetic things I've seen on the Bengals playing field, but when he played OT he was much better. Same with Billy Price, who is a C but gets put in at G, and it didnt work out at all. He was not good at G and in fact pretty terrible. But then he plays C against the Titans, and played way better at C. I have no idea if this was because those players are not position versatile, or if Jim Turner sucked so bad that he couldnt teach them proper. But I really hope that Jackson Carman picks up the OG position really fast and turns out to be a real upgrade, because we need it very badly in this division.

It wont matter if we have Chase on the team if Burrow is getting hit like he did last year. And after a major knee injury, if the OL doesnt improve greatly and instantly compared to last year, it could do damage to Burrow's mental game as well. Not too mention we need to run the damn ball lol. Burrow is a tough dude, but after major knee surgery, if he starts getting hit all the time, it could really derail a promising young career and hurt in confidence and mental game. I do think getting Pollack, Reiff and Spain will help already, but we really need to hit on Jackson Carman for Joe Burrow's sake.

All I'm gonna do is try to keep the faith and hope we put a good NFL caliber OL out there this year. When you look at what the Chargers have done to protect Herbert, it seems like we should be doing all we can for Burrow. Herbert got hit a lot but ended up ROY while Burrow was on crutches. Hoping and praying we've made the right moves and the OL starters stay healthy. Thats all.

[2MinutesHate]

(05-03-2021, 12:19 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I do find it weird though that Mike is reaching out to a guy he fired for advice. That just seems... odd. Maybe it is common in football but.. it just seems odd.

Mike Brown you can bet is still calling the shots on draft day.  I am willing to bet it was Mike Brown that allowed the media to write up feel good stories about Katie, Troy, Duke and whoever taking over.  When the fans start not coming to the games anymore (I think that's been pretty evident for awhile now), they probably needed to give fans a reason to believe their was changes coming.  I think they had no choice because the fans have been blaming MB for the Bengals failures since 91.  They had to shake things up to take some of the heat off.

While others may have additional duties, you can bet your ass  nobody's getting drafted without MB's stamp of approval.  It's not surprising that MB would reach out to someone who's been loyal to him for 20+ years.  His trust in Paul runs quite deep I'm sure.

MB will remain the top dog with the final say as long as he's above ground, just like his dad did.  Any of you who believe otherwise are just fooling yourselves.  

[leonardfan40]

(05-03-2021, 12:45 AM)jason Wrote: Until he was picked, I didn't know Carman (Lord let me get the spelling right for the sake of argument) from Adam.

I can't help but wonder if autocorrect might not be to blame for a third ( maybe two thirds ) of the board misspelling the new guy's name...

Full disclosure... I didn't know Chase' s name had an apostrophe in it til we drafted him.

(05-03-2021, 01:17 AM)Benton Wrote: It's just... Weird.

People are like 'You don't liky Carmen!? Carmen was the top rated guard! Carmen is a day 1 starter! You're just jealous!'

And it's like, Carman was a mid ranked tackle who nobody thought would've started. And his name is Carman.

While this discussion on one letter in a players name is certainly adding a lot and supporting your argument that he was a bad pick, Jason is right. Typing on my phone, Carman changes to Carmen every time. Didn’t even notice until you pointed it out. I’ll try my best to delete and re-type the last two letters from now on.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-02-2021, 09:35 PM)TheBengalsMind Wrote: It's pretty impressive that 25 of the 46 draft prospects taken in the draft this year all sought out Paul Alexander to prepare them for the draft.

Most of them we're all top prospects. The more studious of the bunch seem to seek out both Willie and Paul. I'm glad for both.

Carman also worked with Duke Manyweather. He’s literally trained with all the top private guys in the business.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-03-2021, 12:13 AM)Synric Wrote: Fans have short memories and Bengals fans are specifically jaded by the Ogbuehi and Fisher picks but if you look at his entire career in Cincy he had some excellent draft picks more than he had bad ones (nobody is perfect).

I have no idea why he was fired from the Bengals or the Cowboys but I do know since then he has become the go to guy for most of the top prospects getting ready for the draft. He also teaches new scouts what to look for in offensive line prospects.

Paul Alexander also put out an online course last year for everyone. I loved it. 

There were more bad OL picks than just Ogbuehi and Fisher, but those two probably stick out the most.

Other OL drafted in the first four rounds since 2000 that were whiffs:
Russell Bodine (really never did anything since leaving CIN)
Jonathan Luigs
Eric Ghiacuic
Stacy Andrews

However, he did hit on the following:
Levi Jones
Eric Steinbach
Whitworth
Anthony Collins (kinda)
Andre Smith
Clint Boling
Kevin Zeitler

Given the last guy that was a "hit" came from 2012, it leads a lot of people to believe the game just passed Alexander by.

[BleedNOrange]

I really want to be convinced on Carman but recent stories/interviews keep challenging it.

This article is one of those. This was Mike Brown pick. Couple this with the interview with Pollack where he says he did not go to Clemson's pro day and never even met Carman in person. Hobson even stated how Pollack likes to physcial get his hands on prospects but didn't in this scenario.

Willie vouching for him is the only thing giving some confidence. On a positive side, if Carman was always "the guy", trading back and still getting him was a great move.

[Southpaw Frerotte]

(05-03-2021, 10:09 AM)ochocincos Wrote: There were more bad OL picks than just Ogbuehi and Fisher, but those two probably stick out the most.

Other OL drafted in the first four rounds since 2000 that were whiffs:
Russell Bodine (really never did anything since leaving CIN)
Jonathan Luigs
Eric Ghiacuic
Stacy Andrews

However, he did hit on the following:
Levi Jones
Eric Steinbach
Whitworth
Anthony Collins (kinda)
Andre Smith
Clint Boling
Kevin Zeitler

Given the last guy that was a "hit" came from 2012, it leads a lot of people to believe the game just passed Alexander by.

Not debating the number of overall whiffs, but I would argue Stacy Andrews was a solid pick for a 4th rounder.  7 year career and landed a large 2nd contract.  

[*ochocincos*]

(05-03-2021, 10:16 AM)Southpaw Frerotte Wrote: Not debating the number of overall whiffs, but I would argue Stacy Andrews was a solid pick for a 4th rounder.  7 year career and landed a large 2nd contract.  

I don't remember him being that good with CIN, but maybe that was just too long ago.
I remember him playing for PHI and wasn't good.
Apparently, he only lasted a year there and then bounced to SEA, and then NYG.

[*bfine32*]

(05-03-2021, 12:37 AM)Benton Wrote: It's just a little frustrating.

A third of the defenders (if not more) of the pick, can't even spell the dude's name right.

'Carmen is a day 1 starter.'
'Carmen was the best guard in the draft.'
'Carmen was the biggest steal.'

WTF guys. If you're going to defend someone's honor, at least spell their ****ing name right. And get his position right.

Four Reel?

[*jason*]

(05-03-2021, 08:59 AM)leonardfan40 Wrote: While this discussion on one letter in a players name is certainly adding a lot and supporting your argument that he was a bad pick, Jason is right. Typing on my phone, Carman changes to Carmen every time. Didn’t even notice until you pointed it out. I’ll try my best to delete and re-type the last two letters from now on.

Remember when Joe Burrows had that magical 2019 season at LSU?... My phone gave me fits on his last name.