Simmons on punt returners

[*pally*]

Bengals ST coordinator Darrin Simmons said WR Trent Taylor is a front-runner for the punt return position. Also referenced RB Pooka Williams as someone built for that spot and is working to make up for the lack of experience.

— Ben Baby (@Ben_Baby) June 16, 2021

[GreenCornBengal]

Why does Brandon Wilson get overlooked for punt returns? Want him fresh for kickoffs? Just seems strange.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(06-16-2021, 03:13 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: Why does Brandon Wilson get overlooked for punt returns? Want him fresh for kickoffs? Just seems strange.

2 anecdotal stories; one came from someone who went to TC and saw him muff almost all of the punts he had a chance at (in 2019, hence why he hasn't even tried the past 2 years), the other came from another coach (for some strange reason, I remember it being Callahan, but I may be completely wrong) saying that it's a different beast that needs to catch punts and that Wilson is more-suited to KOs.

I think it's why very few guys in NFL history who have done both consistently, were actually good at both (Hester, Mitchell, Milburn, Deion, for example).

Cordarelle Patterson can't do punts either, neither can:

- Tony Pollard
- Boston Scott
- Dion Lewis
- Corey Ballentine
- Joe Reed
- Danny Johnson

All their teams' top guys in returns last year, that had 1 or less punts.

You also see the inverse, though not as often:

- Hunter Renfroe
- James Proche
- Greg Ward
- Peppers
- Christian Kirk
- Lamb

All their respective teams' top PR guys, had 1 or less KRs, last year.

[*pally*]

(06-16-2021, 03:13 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: Why does Brandon Wilson get overlooked for punt returns? Want him fresh for kickoffs? Just seems strange.

He's never been overlooked.  He's gotten a tryout each training camp and loses it.  His 2 biggest advantages as a KR are his speed and his ability to read the field from a distance so he can follow the right line.  A punt doesn't give him time to use those skills or maybe he gets the yips trying to catch the ball with someone in his face

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-16-2021, 03:52 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: 2 anecdotal stories; one came from someone who went to TC and saw him muff almost all of the punts he had a chance at (in 2019, hence why he hasn't even tried the past 2 years), the other came from another coach (for some strange reason, I remember it being Callahan, but I may be completely wrong) saying that it's a different beast that needs to catch punts and that Wilson is more-suited to KOs.

I think it's why very few guys in NFL history who have done both consistently, were actually good at both (Hester, Mitchell, Milburn, Deion, for example).

Cordarelle Patterson can't do punts either, neither can:

- Tony Pollard
- Boston Scott
- Dion Lewis
- Corey Ballentine
- Joe Reed
- Danny Johnson

All their teams' top guys in returns last year, that had 1 or less punts.

You also see the inverse, though not as often:

- Hunter Renfroe
- James Proche
- Greg Ward
- Peppers
- Christian Kirk
- Lamb

All their respective teams' top PR guys, had 1 or less KRs, last year.

Nice post Truck I thought these were the reasons why Wilson hasn't been returning Punts.

I think Trent Taylor can be an upgrade over Erickson we will see. Just don't muff any Punts man.

I really like Pooka's speed as well and his hands. Darius Phillips was a great returner in college.

[*pally*]

(06-16-2021, 05:55 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post Truck I thought these were the reasons why Wilson hasn't been returning Punts.

I think Trent Taylor can be an upgrade over Erickson we will see. Just don't muff any Punts man.

I really like Pooka's speed as well and his hands. Darius Phillips was a great returner in college.

Later in the press conference Simmons went back and apologized for forgetting to mention Darius Phillips who is also in the running for PR

[GreenCornBengal]

(06-16-2021, 03:52 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: 2 anecdotal stories; one came from someone who went to TC and saw him muff almost all of the punts he had a chance at (in 2019, hence why he hasn't even tried the past 2 years), the other came from another coach (for some strange reason, I remember it being Callahan, but I may be completely wrong) saying that it's a different beast that needs to catch punts and that Wilson is more-suited to KOs.

I think it's why very few guys in NFL history who have done both consistently, were actually good at both (Hester, Mitchell, Milburn, Deion, for example).

Cordarelle Patterson can't do punts either, neither can:

- Tony Pollard
- Boston Scott
- Dion Lewis
- Corey Ballentine
- Joe Reed
- Danny Johnson

All their teams' top guys in returns last year, that had 1 or less punts.

You also see the inverse, though not as often:

- Hunter Renfroe
- James Proche
- Greg Ward
- Peppers
- Christian Kirk
- Lamb

All their respective teams' top PR guys, had 1 or less KRs, last year.

Thanks for the breakdown. Not sure why, but felt that a lot more guys played both roles. You’re right though, the skill set is different and very few guys can do both.

[*SHRacerX*]

(06-16-2021, 05:59 PM)pally Wrote: Later in the press conference Simmons went back and apologized for forgetting to mention Darius Phillips who is also in the running for PR

Interesting.  Phillips is a guy that is the epitome of inconsistent.  He has moments of wow, both good and bad.  Like Ross at the end, he must annoy the piss out of the coaches in some way because no one ever seems to praise the guy and he seems locked in as a "backup" without much potential to win a starting job.  This being his contract year, I hope the guy puts it all together and pushes Waynes for a starting role, but I'm not holding my breath.  

I know injuries have been a part of his issues, but I still find it odd.  The guy is a really odd follow on Twitter.  Not Bobby Hart odd, but odd in an immature and "wanting attention" manner.  Seems like the kind of guy that Bates or Hubbard should try to bring in to the fold, as he has a ton of talent, but is just as inconsistent as he is talented.  

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(06-17-2021, 08:25 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Interesting.  Phillips is a guy that is the epitome of inconsistent.  He has moments of wow, both good and bad.  Like Ross at the end, he must annoy the piss out of the coaches in some way because no one ever seems to praise the guy and he seems locked in as a "backup" without much potential to win a starting job.  This being his contract year, I hope the guy puts it all together and pushes Waynes for a starting role, but I'm not holding my breath.  

I know injuries have been a part of his issues, but I still find it odd.  The guy is a really odd follow on Twitter.  Not Bobby Hart odd, but odd in an immature and "wanting attention" manner.  Seems like the kind of guy that Bates or Hubbard should try to bring in to the fold, as he has a ton of talent, but is just as inconsistent as he is talented.  

He had that called-back (which was BS) KO return TD in 2019, then got hurt that game. Since then, on all his returns (I did a post either last year or at the end of the 2019 season, can't remember), where I posted all of his return opportunities since he got hurt (INTs, actual returns, etc.) and his vision seems to have disappeared. On one of his INT returns in 2019, he got, "blindsided," (wasn't a blindside, but the way he got hit/reacted, it looked like a blindside hit) by a guy who was right in front of him the whole time he was returning.

I think for that reason, he may also be more-suited to KR and not PR, hence why he's been a decent KR in the chances he's gotten, but his PR stats since his injury are 3 returns for 8 yards, with a long of 9 (which means he LOST yards on 2 of his 3 returns).

[Joelist]

Where's Tyler Shelvin?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-17-2021, 09:34 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: He had that called-back (which was BS) KO return TD in 2019, then got hurt that game. Since then, on all his returns (I did a post either last year or at the end of the 2019 season, can't remember), where I posted all of his return opportunities since he got hurt (INTs, actual returns, etc.) and his vision seems to have disappeared. On one of his INT returns in 2019, he got, "blindsided," (wasn't a blindside, but the way he got hit/reacted, it looked like a blindside hit) by a guy who was right in front of him the whole time he was returning.

I think for that reason, he may also be more-suited to KR and not PR, hence why he's been a decent KR in the chances he's gotten, but his PR stats since his injury are 3 returns for 8 yards, with a long of 9 (which means he LOST yards on 2 of his 3 returns).

Punt Returner can be tough as you say, it can get in your head when things go bad similar to being a Kicker...

The positions are nothing alike but you know what I mean.

[SunsetBengal]

(06-17-2021, 09:34 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: He had that called-back (which was BS) KO return TD in 2019, then got hurt that game. Since then, on all his returns (I did a post either last year or at the end of the 2019 season, can't remember), where I posted all of his return opportunities since he got hurt (INTs, actual returns, etc.) and his vision seems to have disappeared. On one of his INT returns in 2019, he got, "blindsided," (wasn't a blindside, but the way he got hit/reacted, it looked like a blindside hit) by a guy who was right in front of him the whole time he was returning.

I think for that reason, he may also be more-suited to KR and not PR, hence why he's been a decent KR in the chances he's gotten, but his PR stats since his injury are 3 returns for 8 yards, with a long of 9 (which means he LOST yards on 2 of his 3 returns).

Yeah, the last thing you need as a punt returner, is to get "gun shy".  Once you get rocked, and start hearing footsteps, that's when the fumbles begin..

[wolverine515151]

Hopefully he won't fair catch it at the 20 all the time like Erickson. Fair catch Erickson was hard to watch

[*SHRacerX*]

(06-17-2021, 09:34 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: He had that called-back (which was BS) KO return TD in 2019, then got hurt that game. Since then, on all his returns (I did a post either last year or at the end of the 2019 season, can't remember), where I posted all of his return opportunities since he got hurt (INTs, actual returns, etc.) and his vision seems to have disappeared. On one of his INT returns in 2019, he got, "blindsided," (wasn't a blindside, but the way he got hit/reacted, it looked like a blindside hit) by a guy who was right in front of him the whole time he was returning.

I think for that reason, he may also be more-suited to KR and not PR, hence why he's been a decent KR in the chances he's gotten, but his PR stats since his injury are 3 returns for 8 yards, with a long of 9 (which means he LOST yards on 2 of his 3 returns).

Good stuff, Truck.  I hadn't remembered you posting that.  

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(06-18-2021, 09:45 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Good stuff, Truck.  I hadn't remembered you posting that.  

Yeah, here it is:

http://thebengalsboard.com/Thread-Punt-Return-Game?pid=888760#pid888760

Seriously, prior to his injury in 2019, he looked superb on all return opportunities. Since then? He looks completely lost.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-17-2021, 08:31 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yeah, the last thing you need as a punt returner, is to get "gun shy".  Once you get rocked, and start hearing footsteps, that's when the fumbles begin..

Is Adam still in shape? That sure never happened with him, if he muffed a Punt, he picked it up, made people miss and could
go to the house. One thing I can always say about Adam Jones is he was the most fearless Punt Returner I have ever seen.

[3wt]

(06-18-2021, 01:15 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Is Adam still in shape? That sure never happened with him, if he muffed a Punt, he picked it up, made people miss and could
go to the house. One thing I can always say about Adam Jones is he was the most fearless Punt Returner I have ever seen.

Truth.   Loved him back there!

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-18-2021, 03:05 PM)3wt Wrote: Truth.   Loved him back there!

Honestly I think he is the best Punt Returner of all time, him and Deion.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(06-18-2021, 03:11 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Honestly I think he is the best Punt Returner of all time, him and Deion.

Hester or Mitchell, for me; Adam was incredible and we all loved him, but I would put him in a class, below those two.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-18-2021, 03:47 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Hester or Mitchell, for me; Adam was incredible and we all loved him, but I would put him in a class, below those two.

Hester is the greatest Kick Returner of all time for sure in my eyes. Adam and Deion, best Punt Returners.

Must not of seen as much of Mitchell, are we forgetting about the dude from the Chiefs back in the day? Hall?

Sproles also was a fantastic Returner on both Kicks and Punts from what I remember.

There was a guy named Drummond on the Lions who lit it up for a sec, but I only think that was like 1 year.

For what Hester did is pretty incredible as long as he did it. Same with Deion and Adam (especially with his off the field issues) lol