Updated Pro Bowl votes

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(12-04-2021, 10:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Perfect example of the stats not telling the true story.  

I'm pretty sure that you just need to say "Kirk Cousins". Lol

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-04-2021, 02:03 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I don't know of 9 but there are 7 that you can make an argument for pretty easily.

Brady
Rodgers
Kyler Murray
Jackson (duel threat)
Matthew Stafford
Josh Allen
Patrick Mahomes

Then on name you have Russel Wilson still as an 8th and Dak with the Dallas fanbase and when healthy, the guy is good.

With you on Brady, Rogers, and Murray...

Jackson would only be on here because of his 700 yards rushing...

Here is how Joe Burrow stands up against the others you mentioned:



Joe Burrow           69.3%      2895 yards       22 TD        12 INT      101.6 rating
Josh Allen             66.8%      3071 yards       25 TD        10 INT       99.1 rating
Mahommes           65.5%      3200 yards      25 TD        11 INT       94.7 rating
Jackson                64.2%        2616 yards       15 TD        12 INT       87.5 rating

Yes, you could "make an arguement" for those others, but if everyone watched all the games, they would see that Joe is more of a down the field passer, with greater completion %, and he has been handing the ball off much more the past two weeks or he would be leading in yardage as well.   

Lamar's TD/INT ratio is poo poo.  

[Frank Booth]

(12-04-2021, 11:01 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I'm pretty sure that you just need to say "Kirk Cousins". Lol

Kirk Cousins is having a fantastic year

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(12-04-2021, 11:51 AM)Frank Booth Wrote: Kirk Cousins is having a fantastic year

Kirk Cousins is always having a fantastic year... statistically. That's why I made the joke about his name in response to stats not telling the whole story.

[Frank Booth]

(12-04-2021, 11:55 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Kirk Cousins is always having a fantastic year... statistically. That's why I made the joke about his name in response to stats not telling the whole story.

Kirk cousins, man.

Even when he’s good, people think he sucks. I don’t get it

[fredtoast]

(12-04-2021, 11:55 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Kirk Cousins is always having a fantastic year... statistically. 

I don't know why people blame Cousins for the poor record of his teams.  He often has very good games when they lose.  Just look at his game against us earlier this year.  The Vikings defense is 30th in yards allowed this year and were 27th last year.

His three years as a full time starter in Washington he had a winning record with a team that was 25th in scoring defense and 28th in rushing.  

[Frank Booth]

(12-04-2021, 12:17 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't know why people blame Cousins for the poor record of his teams.   

Because people just follow the media narrative

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-04-2021, 12:17 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't know why people blame Cousins for the poor record of his teams.  He often has very good games when they lose.  Just look at his game against us earlier this year.  The Vikings defense is 30th in yards allowed this year and were 27th last year.

His three years as a full time starter in Washington he had a winning record with a team that was 25th in scoring defense and 28th in rushing.  

I think he is a bit "Baker Mayfielded" because people see Dalvin Cook, Jefferson, and Adam Thielen and think he should automatically be doing well.  


He's a solid QB and he has been getting progressively better throughout his career.  He has pooped his pants in some big game moments, though, and I think that stick with him.

Most recently, failed final drive against 49ers
Got the ball (INT) at his 38 in OT against the Rats and went 3 and out.
Had the ball down 6 with a minute left against Dallas at their 25 and didn't get 20 yards.
Got the ball at his 30 against the Browns down 7 with a minute left, failed to get to the red zone.
He did have his team in position to kick a game winning FG against Zona, but because they didn't get a TD, they missed the kick and lost.  Not really his fault.  

[*rfaulk34*]

(12-04-2021, 12:14 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: Kirk cousins, man.

Even when he’s good, people think he sucks. I don’t get it

It is crazy how his name is never brought up when talking about top QBs on any given year. 

Career 67 comp%, 30,000+ yards, 200+ tds, <100 ints and a 98+ rating. 

[TecmoBengals]

(12-04-2021, 12:56 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: It is crazy how his name is never brought up when talking about top QBs on any given year. 

Career 67 comp%, 30,000+ yards, 200+ tds, <100 ints and a 98+ rating. 

I think it comes down to the whole argument that you need an elite NFL QB to win the Super Bowl. Thus, the good guys get overlooked for their accomplishments. Cousins exemplifies a good, but not elite talent.

[Big_Ern]

(12-03-2021, 09:04 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't know about any meme.  What I heard was that there were no known names to vote for at guard and Adeniji gets the default votes because he is listed first on the ballot (alphabetical).

But that does not make a lot of sense either.

You also have to vote for every position, most people don't know much about the guards so are likely just picking the first listed gut and clicking through. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(12-04-2021, 01:08 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I think it comes down to the whole argument that you need an elite NFL QB to win the Super Bowl. Thus, the good guys get overlooked for their accomplishments. Cousins exemplifies a good, but not elite talent.

He's definitely elite (top 5) when it comes to career passer rating but not known, like ShracerX stated, for being a guy that makes the throws late to win games. 

He's easily the caboose in 4th qtr comebacks and game winning drives for guys drafted all around him that have played at least 7 seasons.

1. Tannehill
2. Dalton
3. Wilson
4. Carr
5. Luck
6. Newton
7. Cousins (13 4th qtr comebacks, 19 GWD)

[fredtoast]

(12-04-2021, 01:42 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: You also have to vote for every position, most people don't know much about the guards so are likely just picking the first listed gut and clicking through. 

I understand the theory.  I just don't remember it ever happening before.

[TecmoBengals]

(12-04-2021, 01:44 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: He's definitely elite (top 5) when it comes to career passer rating but not known, like ShracerX stated, for being a guy that makes the throws late to win games. 

He's easily the caboose in 4th qtr comebacks and game winning drives for guys drafted all around him that have played at least 7 seasons.

1. Tannehill
2. Dalton
3. Wilson
4. Carr
5. Luck
6. Newton
7. Cousins (13 4th qtr comebacks, 19 GWD)

I suppose it raises the question what constitutes elite? The eye test tells me it is guys like Brady, Rodgers, and Mahomes. Cousins has stats to match, but then he also has unique indicators that lead to people not viewing him as elite like the 4th qtr comebacks you mentioned and I think, the worst Monday night football W/L record. Plus, he's not won the big game, the Super Bowl.

He's a good player though and has had a great career.

[Big_Ern]

(12-03-2021, 10:19 AM)motoarch Wrote: Tom Brady
Aaron Rogers
Kirk Cousins (look at the numbers)
Lamar Jackson (as much as we may not like it)
Justin Herbert (until Burrow beats him head to head this weekend)
Patrick Mahomes
Dak Prescott
Kyler Murray
Josh Allen

In no particular order.  These may not even be the guys with votes in front of him.  For all I know Stafford has more.  Im just giving my quick thoughts on who I think might be on that list.

We could debate out of these 10 (including Burrow) who's better than who but and I think anyone could make a good argument for reorganizing this list any number of ways.

Im happy we got a guy that belongs in the conversation and think that has he continues to prove how good he is the media and fans from other teams will bump him up that list but for now just be happy he's in the top 10.

Interesting Stat https://twitter.com/PFF/status/1466459687772209158 showing Burrow is tied with Tom Brady in passing grade from a clean pocket

[*rfaulk34*]

(12-04-2021, 02:35 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I suppose it raises the question what constitutes elite? The eye test tells me it is guys like Brady, Rodgers, and Mahomes. Cousins has stats to match, but then he also has unique indicators that lead to people not viewing him as elite like the 4th qtr comebacks you mentioned and I think, the worst Monday night football W/L record. Plus, he's not won the big game, the Super Bowl.

He's a good player though and has had a great career.

Yup. Strictly by the numbers, he belongs at the top but that doesn't take into consideration what he's won or not won. 

[Destro]

Kirk Cousins just has a face that makes you not want to like him.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-04-2021, 10:55 PM)Destro Wrote: Kirk Cousins just has a face that makes you not want to like him.

Among other things…

[Shake n Blake]

(12-04-2021, 10:55 PM)Destro Wrote: Kirk Cousins just has a face that makes you not want to like him.

(12-04-2021, 11:32 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Among other things…

He's always seemed like a nice guy to me. Of course, I don't hate people for having certain views. Good player, nice guy who is very charitable.

[SladeX]

(12-04-2021, 12:14 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: Kirk cousins, man.

Even when he’s good, people think he sucks. I don’t get it

The one time I trust him on my FF team, and he blows it. He's weirdly inconsistent.