Jammar Chase was wide open for a TD on the last play

[Au165]

Some of the comments here about "coaching and scheme" are laughably bad...

- The guy mentioning the "years ago" thing, that's called a sprint out. You still see it occasionally in the redzone but the reason you don't really see much league wide anymore is because you cut the field in half along with the targets (You only throw targets level to the QB and in front when on the move). NFL defenses have evolved and what teams will run now in those situations in match zone. With Match zone you can "lock" the backside receiver then play zone on the front side (sprint side) or if they go vertical it also converts to man. There just isn't much success with it in todays game.

- The guy mentioning the two backs in the backfield, we actually ran this but subbed out a back for Drew Sample (this is a bit more common today). It was fine, but it is actually harder to block in space from that upback position then on the line so having the TE in line is usually a little better. When the moved to their overload look having an extra blocker inside the tackle didn't make sense because they still have to get wide.

-Those calling for Max Protect, the Rams are slightly tougher to Max Protect against than most teams. Max Protect gives you six blockers, the issue is if they can still generate a decent pressure with 4 rushers, maybe 5, they have atleast 6 guys in the secondary for 3 receivers so you have doubles across the board. Since they have Ramsey they can single Ramsey on Tee and go doubles for Chase and Boyd with a robber for and quick hitters. Max Protect works great for blitzing teams not teams with dominant lines because it puts you at a disadvantage in the pattern.

As for the play in question, the Progression on the play looked to be Higgins>Boyd>? There was no way with the pressure he was ever going to get back over to his 3rd progression assuming it was Chase. They were showing single high with the safety shading to help Ramsey so that was probably discounted in pre snap.

[Au165]

(02-14-2022, 03:45 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I hate to say it, but isn't this basically the meme that people were using for why the Bengals should draft Sewell over Chase?
Burrow not having enough time to hit his receiver at a critical moment?

Obviously, I think Chase has been a great addition to the team and was a key part in the Bengals getting to the Super Bowl. I just know people will point to this exact moment as justification for the meme.

We don't get here to be the meme without Chase though so it's a moot point. It's easy to make those observations when they don't have to defend the counter point. It's kind of the whole schtick of internet commentary now.

[Housh]

And? Burrow got sacked

[Bengalitis]

(02-14-2022, 03:34 PM)Science Friction Wrote: I agree with this totally  but my question is how do competent football minds not know this. If we here on a message board can see it why can't a head coach and OC ?

I suspect the coaches go into the game with a mindset of what they've seen on opponents video and stick to their plan and hope their players adjust to it and can handle it, and shy away from stuff they've never practice? I suspect in this case it's the latter part.  

Heck, if it was a pass play, put Burrow 5 yards more back shotgun, he'll make it up with his arm and Chase's speed, even if it's a giveaway... better than a sack for sure.

[Whacked]

(02-14-2022, 03:31 PM)Tony Wrote: Here is one from Twitter
https://twitter.com/JayMorrisonATH/status/1493114315641012226?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1493114315641012226%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-30403313521589725626.ampproject.net%2F2201262038001%2Fframe.html

Thanks

[tms]

(02-14-2022, 03:33 PM)Tony Wrote: How is this trolling? I'm just sharing tidbits about the game... Don't take it so hard...

Yeah I didn't mean you specifically, just in general. Everything looks so simple to us in hindsight. MMQB in a nutshell. 

I have the ultimate respect for Joey's processing time but he's not a computer. Scrambling out of the pocket and glancing up: "Wait did Ramsey trip? Is Ja'Marr wide open now?! I'm gonna improvise, reach back and mortgage our season by gunning it 30 yards down the field- rather than take two more steps and slide and live to fight another day"... I'd put that even past him.

[BFritz21]

(02-14-2022, 03:45 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I hate to say it, but isn't this basically the meme that people were using for why the Bengals should draft Sewell over Chase?
Burrow not having enough time to hit his receiver at a critical moment?

Obviously, I think Chase has been a great addition to the team and was a key part in the Bengals getting to the Super Bowl. I just know people will point to this exact moment as justification for the meme.

I don't think Sewell would solve our problems by himself. Our line got destroyed last night. 

Chase is a once-in-a-generation talent and you can't pass on that.

I'm just hoping we go all-out to draft and sign FA linemen this offseason and some quality backups because this team can be unreal if we can protect Burrow and open a few holes for Mixon.

[Murdock2420]

(02-14-2022, 03:50 PM)Au165 Wrote: We don't get here to be the meme without Chase though so it's a moot point. It's easy to make those observations when they don't have to defend the counter point. It's kind of the whole schtick of internet commentary now.

We don't actually know that.

Nothing that anyone has in any stat sheet or anywhere in the twitterverse shows what happens in the alternate reality world where they draft an OL in round one that plays at a high level. We have no idea who they draft after that, we have no idea who builds chemistry with Burrow, perhaps Boyd goes over 1K and is the focus, perhaps the line gives more time and there is less sacks and a better running game. 

It's just flat out wrong to say without one guy the team isn't winning unless that one guy is the Joe Burrow.

[Tony]

(02-14-2022, 03:51 PM)Housh Wrote: And? Burrow got sacked

The point is if he had time They probably win this game..

[Oasis5055]

(02-14-2022, 04:09 PM)Tony Wrote: The point is if he had time They probably win this game..

Haha if burrow had enough time for the last play they would have had put up 40 points from about 3 other plays.

[*psychdoctor*]

(02-14-2022, 02:53 PM)Tony Wrote: Wide open Ramsey fell on the last 4th and 1...
https://twitter.com/JayMorrisonATH/status/1493114315641012226?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1493114315641012226%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-30403313521589725626.ampproject.net%2F2201262038001%2Fframe.html

I think a design play with Burrow rolling outside of pocket may have worked.  The only reason Chase was open on that last play IMO was Ramsey stumble.  

[Roland]

Against anyone else Burrow probably gets the extra second he needs to complete that. But once again, the Bengals make the SB only to be stopped by a future Hall of Famer getting his moment.

I hope I'll get to see them flip that script some day. Obviously job one now is keeping Burrow alive for it.

[*ochocincos*]

(02-14-2022, 03:58 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: I don't think Sewell would solve our problems by himself. Our line got destroyed last night. 

Chase is a once-in-a-generation talent and you can't pass on that.

I'm just hoping we go all-out to draft and sign FA linemen this offseason and some quality backups because this team can be unreal if we can protect Burrow and open a few holes for Mixon.

I completely agree.
I just find it interesting that that exact play was the meme to a T

[Au165]

(02-14-2022, 04:01 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: We don't actually know that.

Nothing that anyone has in any stat sheet or anywhere in the twitterverse shows what happens in the alternate reality world where they draft an OL in round one that plays at a high level. We have no idea who they draft after that, we have no idea who builds chemistry with Burrow, perhaps Boyd goes over 1K and is the focus, perhaps the line gives more time and there is less sacks and a better running game. 

It's just flat out wrong to say without one guy the team isn't winning unless that one guy is the Joe Burrow.

Sewell wasn’t even the best rookie offensive lineman, arguably not too 3. If you want to argue we screwed up not taking Humphrey or Smith I’m here for it and think that could have been enough to win the SB. Without Chase every defense plays us differently and frankly Burrow isn’t as good. Chase is a top 10 WR in the league right now, no one thinks Sewell is a top 10 or even 20 tackle.

Taking Chase off this team is in line with taking Adams, Hill or Kupp off their teams.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(02-14-2022, 04:01 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: We don't actually know that.

Nothing that anyone has in any stat sheet or anywhere in the twitterverse shows what happens in the alternate reality world where they draft an OL in round one that plays at a high level. We have no idea who they draft after that, we have no idea who builds chemistry with Burrow, perhaps Boyd goes over 1K and is the focus, perhaps the line gives more time and there is less sacks and a better running game. 

It's just flat out wrong to say without one guy the team isn't winning unless that one guy is the Joe Burrow.

Chase straight up won us at least a 3-4 games this season (MIN, BAL, KC). We don’t even sniff the playoffs without him. You’re talking about hypothetical chemistry Burrow might have had with some other WR, but so many of our biggest plays this season were a result of the already established chemistry between Burrow and Chase. Burrow literally went from being one of the worst deep ball passers in the entire league to one of the best by adding that “one guy.”

You really should leave the draft squabbles and personal vendettas behind and just embrace the kid. He’s already one of the best players in the league, and was a huge factor in the Bengals having their best season in 30+ years.

We’re all united on “team OL” now. But don’t downplay the impact that Chase made.

[Oasis5055]

How did the bengals give up 1 sack the first half and 6! The second. The rams made adjustments the bengals didn’t. Offensive line has gotten worse the last 3 years. The offensive scheme has
More to do with their failure La than their talent.

Someone said Taylor is still young and learning on the job so we should cut him some slack? Maybe. But hasn’t he been around football his whole life. If he still needs to learn adjustments and schemes that’s just scary

[Bengalpool]

Seen this earlier today. I'm 50/50 on it. One half of me is saying "wow, we were so close". The other half is saying "we're literally an o-lineman or 2 away..."

[*Go Cards*]

(02-14-2022, 09:26 PM)Takedown Wrote: Seen this earlier today. I'm 50/50 on it. One half of me is saying "wow, we were so close". The other half is saying "we're literally an o-lineman or 2 away..."

Think we are 2 or 3 away still

 and would tell every single one of them that no jobs are guaranteed and must been won next season and competition is being brought in as well. 

[THE PISTONS]

(02-14-2022, 08:55 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote:

Chase straight up won us at least a 3-4 games this season (MIN, BAL, KC). We don’t even sniff the playoffs without him. You’re talking about hypothetical chemistry Burrow might have had with some other WR, but so many of our biggest plays this season were a result of the already established chemistry between Burrow and Chase. Burrow literally went from being one of the worst deep ball passers in the entire league to one of the best by adding that “one guy.”

You really should leave the draft squabbles and personal vendettas behind and just embrace the kid. He’s already one of the best players in the league, and was a huge factor in the Bengals having their best season in 30+ years.

We’re all united on “team OL” now. But don’t downplay the impact that Chase made.

This. We might have won 5-7 games without Chase. Our offense struggled a lot at times and then he'd pop a long TD.

I was probably more team Sewell, but Chase was the right pick. Not that Sewell would be bad, but Chase is a gamebreaker.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(02-14-2022, 09:54 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: This. We might have won 5-7 games without Chase. Our offense struggled a lot at times and then he'd pop a long TD.

I was probably more team Sewell, but Chase was the right pick. Not that Sewell would be bad, but Chase is a gamebreaker.

Nate Burleson put it best the night we drafted Chase - he basically said the Bengals were thinking about the big picture of competing in the AFC with teams like the Chiefs when they drafted Chase. He was right, and we beat the Chiefs twice, and proved we can beat anyone in the AFC with the weapons we have.

Now they need to think big picture/long term about protecting Burrow. And that means in FA, not lottery tickets ie draft picks. They still should draft OL, but only in addition to FA. Not the whole plan.