Keep in mind - 2023 and beyond

[casear2727]

With the talk of signing Bates to top market money and all these great oline signings everyone wants, keep in mind those salaries roll forward. 2023 and 2024 will be interesting, after 2025 could be a major disaster with many signings we do this offseason ending that season.


Top Free Agents:

2023
Jonah - could use that 5th year and risk losing him.

Pratt - no idea what number he will be looking for?

Von Bell - again, not sure?



2024
Higgins - will he want WR1 money?

Burrow smash is coming if not in 2023.

DJ Reader - ?

Tyler Boyd - must go lower

Logan Wilson - ?


2025
Hendrickson - ?

Mixon - gone

Chase - smash

Hilton - ?

Shooter - $5M min

Carmen - ?

Every oline signed this year?

Ossai - ?

[Jhowdy54]

It’s 2022 and your worried about 2025

[phil413]

It's good you put the names out there. If anything we should be trying to front load guaranteed money for some of the UFA's we have been discussing. Higgins is a big question mark. I'm sure he will get the stats in a productive offense and get paid as a #1 on the open market.

Short term though this is further reason Bates likely gets tagged as he likely wants 4yr. They're going to have to make some tough decisions but having a good young guard like Daniels locked into those years at 8 or 9M is still a wise move.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 12:45 AM)Jhowdy54 Wrote: It’s 2022 and your worried about 2025

Yes. 

You want to know why the front office makes decisions the way they do?  This is why.  Each signing impacts the next year and the next year. Each year has new free agents that will leave or need to be resigned.  Not to mention the smash Burrow is bringing in 23 or 24.

Average fans dont have to care about the repercussions and voice their opinions on who we should get without any knowledge of the impact. But those who want to look at our options in a more realistic manner will want to know the impact of potential signings.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 12:50 AM)phil413 Wrote: It's good you put the names out there but if anything we should be trying to front load guaranteed money for some of the UFA's we have been discussing.  Higgins is a big question mark as I'm sure he will get the stats in a productive offense and get paid as a #1 on the open market.  

Short term though this is further reason Bates likely gets tagged as he likely wants 4yr.  They're going to have to make some tough decisions but having a good young guard like Daniels locked into those years at 8 or 9M is still a wise move.

Agree on every point, all though I've moved to Corbett over Daniels after the Sans film review.  Daniels is still a major upgrade and can play C.

[phil413]

(02-24-2022, 12:54 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Agree on every point, all though I've moved to Corbett over Daniels after the Sans film review.  Daniels is still a major upgrade and can play C.

Yeah there are like a handful of guards that are still worth the money crossing into a 3rd or 4th year in their deal.  We should be wary of how we spend future money, but we should resist the temptation to patchwork the OL because of the big deals in the future.  

[*bfine32*]

(02-24-2022, 12:52 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Yes. 

You want to know why the front office makes decisions the way they do?  This is why.  Each signing impacts the next year and the next year. Each year has new free agents that will leave or need to be resigned.  Not to mention the smash Burrow is bringing in 23 or 24.

Average fans dont have to care about the repercussions and voice their opinions on who we should get without any knowledge of the impact. But those who want to look at our options in a more realistic manner will want to know the impact of potential signings.

True...it's why I said if you want to pay Bates as an elite Safety, be prepared to say bye bye to Bell. 

It's OK if that's the route you want to go.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 01:03 AM)phil413 Wrote: Yeah there are like a handful of guards that are still worth the money crossing into a 3rd or 4th year in their deal.  We should be wary of how we spend future money, but we should resist the temptation to patchwork the OL because of the big deals in the future.  

OLine should be top notch... to a point (not multiple $18M per year guys)

We need 2 DTs

We need 1 CB

We need 1 FS

We need 1 TE


The most expensive player on defense could a FS rated #37 this year with 1 int and 3 pass break ups, just kill me. If Bates was a Top 3 guy all season long, maybe..... but we will never get Troy Palamalu or Ed Reed out of Bates.



The most expensive player on offense is a RB (11-13M) , the Chiefs and Rams do not pay any RB over 2M.

The 2nd highest paid player on offense is a WR3, with 4 catches per game. 


I get that our QB and WR's are on rookie deals, but the next priority after these 2 spots, and over RB and WR3, is Oline.  Every single position on the oline would be paid more than RB, TE and WR3.... if I were the GM.

But I may be an idiot.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 01:11 AM)bfine32 Wrote: True...it's why I said if you want to pay Bates as an elite Safety, be prepared to say bye bye to Bell. 

It's OK if that's the route you want to go.

At $16-17M for Bates to be honest, it could be more than just Bell down the line.

[leonardfan40]

All this tells us is our window in is NOW. Time to go all in for the next few seasons. If there was ever a time to push the cap and restructure contracts it’ll be 2-3-4 years from now to keep our window open as long as possible.

We have a good team, young team and cap space. We can’t worry so much about the future we prevent ourselves from being the best team we can in 2022-2024. If we continue to draft and develop well a lot of these decisions will be made and problems solved in the draft before we lose these guys.

Additionally there is no telling how these players will be playing by 2024-2025. Hendrickson? We could be excited to get him off the books by then.
Mixon/Hilton may not have anything left in the tank by then either.

As far as Bates and safety go, there is no way we should let him walk for nothing this offseason. We have the cap space to tag/sign him and fix o line. Draft a S (I like this S class personally). And see where we are next offseason. May be able to let him walk (if tagged) based on our rookie. Or may be able to let Bell walk after giving a rookie a year in the system if we sign Bates long term. This goes with my above point-put the best team possible out there in 2022. You can have plans for the future without sacrificing next season with a less than optimal team.

[*pally*]

If I am confident of 1 thing, it is that Katie Blackburn understands the cap about as well as GM in the NFL. She will never put the Bengals in cap hell and while we speculate, she knows the impact of each and every contract for its entire length not only as it affects the cap but how it impacts every other player

[Soonerpeace]

(02-24-2022, 01:22 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: All this tells us is our window in is NOW. Time to go all in for the next few seasons. If there was ever a time to push the cap and restructure contracts it’ll be 2-3-4 years from now to keep our window open as long as possible.

We have a good team, young team and cap space. We can’t worry so much about the future we prevent ourselves from being the best team we can in 2022-2024. If we continue to draft and develop well a lot of these decisions will be made and problems solved in the draft before we lose these guys.

Additionally there is no telling how these players will be playing by 2024-2025. Hendrickson? We could be excited to get him off the books by then.
Mixon/Hilton may not have anything left in the tank by then either.

As far as Bates and safety go, there is no way we should let him walk for nothing this offseason. We have the cap space to tag/sign him and fix o line. Draft a S (I like this S class personally). And see where we are next offseason. May be able to let him walk (if tagged) based on our rookie. Or may be able to let Bell walk after giving a rookie a year in the system if we sign Bates long term. This goes with my above point-put the best team possible out there in 2022. You can have plans for the future without sacrificing next season with a less than optimal team.

I think that being realistic about the Browns shows they are unique. They are extremely loyal and really care about their players. They are also too conservative. But now’s not the time to be ultra-conservative. I sure don’t want them to go sign a 20 million FA tackle.

What we really need is to be better identifying talent on the OL in FA and the draft. We need Carman to come through. My understanding is there are some in the OL which the effort is not there. Don’t know who. As good as scouting and developing has been elsewhere on the roster it’s not been in the OL.

[TigerStripes]

(02-24-2022, 01:11 AM)bfine32 Wrote: True...it's why I said if you want to pay Bates as an elite Safety, be prepared to say bye bye to Bell. 

It's OK if that's the route you want to go.

The smart thing to do may be to tag Bates, and look to take a safety pretty early in the draft....  See if the draft pick can grow into an at least competent Bates replacement, at a fraction of the cost.  Would he be "as good" as Bates??  Likely not.  

But would a, then, 2nd year safety, plus money to throw at Bell and help fill out the roster be better than Bates??  Maybe....  It's certainly up for debate, and I understand why the Bengals aren't willing to just give  Bates a blank check.  It's a tough decision, and I expect negotiations to continue to be slow because of it.

[Brownshoe]

Isn't the cap going to go up an insane amount the next couple of years? I thought I heard something about it going up almost 50%. Hopefully that will help us keep most of our players

[Essex Johnson]

We are finding out though that WRs much easier to replace than Oline, pay the Oline worry about skilled positions down the road. If Burrow is going to be a top end QB, he does not need elite at every position but he does need sometime more than mediocre or bad especially at the Oline which is the hardest to fill.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 07:30 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Isn't the cap going to go up an insane amount the next couple of years? I thought I heard something about it going up almost 50%. Hopefully that will help us keep most of our players

Yes, TV deal kicks in 2023, not sure if Cap goes way up then or the year after.

[casear2727]

(02-24-2022, 07:59 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: We are finding out though that WRs much easier to replace than Oline, pay the Oline worry about skilled positions down the road.  If Burrow is going to be a top end QB, he does not need elite at every position but he does need sometime more than mediocre or bad especially at the Oline which is the hardest to fill.

Exactly, can anyone name the $10M WR3 or $11M RB that played with Brady every Super Bowl?  No. They didnt.

Patriots invested in oline and defense with Brady.  We have Burrow, Chase, Higgins, oline - TE, RB, WR3 can be just good players.  

[reuben.ahmed]

(02-24-2022, 01:22 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: All this tells us is our window in is NOW. Time to go all in for the next few seasons. If there was ever a time to push the cap and restructure contracts it’ll be 2-3-4 years from now to keep our window open as long as possible.

We have a good team, young team and cap space. We can’t worry so much about the future we prevent ourselves from being the best team we can in 2022-2024. If we continue to draft and develop well a lot of these decisions will be made and problems solved in the draft before we lose these guys.

I made this comment that our window is now, not later, and my steelers friend said the steelers never seem to lose their window. I told him watch what happens when you don't have a QB.

With Burrow we need to make the playoffs every year (wild card or not) just to see if he can string 4 games in a row. Unless we get a bye I don't care what happens in the regular season anymore (we either make the playoffs or don't and it resets).

[*pally*]

There is an intangible with Bates that we have to remember…virtually every single one of his teammates has publically said they want him re signed. This is the first big negotiation of the so-called new era. Jessie is a team captain and leader. The vast majority of fans want him re signed. What will it say about the team if they don’t get it done? What message will it send to his teammates and potential free agents if the player consistently held up as someone who does things the right way doesn’t get his money? The Bengals credibility is on the line.

[Bengalpool]

There's reason to worry about these sorts of things now, but only to an extent. It depends a lot on that players production in his contract year. Tee may not be performing as a WR1 in his contract year, maybe because of that he doesn't get WR1 money. Of course injuries play a factor too. If we have to draft another receiver to replace Tee then we will. The Bengals don't bust much on WR's (excluding Ross). For me, its a wait and see for a lot of these guys.