Linderbaum

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(04-13-2022, 05:57 PM)Boomer Anderson Wrote: Many mock drafts have Linderbaum falling to us at 31. I’d like to grab him if this happens. It would give us much more flexibility at C and LG with Karras Carman and Linderbaum. Would he help or do we go defense or TE?

It would be a VERY tough call for me if it came down to Booth or Linderbaum.  

On one hand, depth at CB is paper thin and I like Booth a great deal.  Premium position that just saw Ward get $100 million over 5 years...but on the other hand, I think Linderbaum is a PERFECT fit for our offensive blocking scheme.  He tipped the scales at 305 at his pro day and although his arms are on the short side, he is so athletic and tough as nails.

I heard from one of the guests on "Hear that podcast Growlin" (forget which, sorry, I was driving) that Linderbaum may give up 30-50 lbs to some of the monster NTs in the AFC North, but his redshirt freshman year at Iowa, he was only 265 and he was a DOMINANT starter against guys in the Big 10 that were all 40 lbs (or more) bigger than him.  

I look at Linderbaum as such a great fit, I might prefer to go with him and sign another street FA CB that has a little experience but won't break the bank...probably also draft a CB in rds 3 or 4.  

[Whatever]

(04-19-2022, 01:56 AM)pulses Wrote: In 2 or 3 years maybe before that  Hurts and Baker will both be backups so it won't matter.

Scherff may very well be in the same boat by that point with all his injuries.

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(04-14-2022, 02:08 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: My list of desires at 31 are:
1. Tyler Linderbaum
2a. Andrew Booth Jr
2b. Kaiir Elam
3. Zion Johnson
4. Kenyon Green
5. George Karlaftis

--Trade down exploration --

6. Logan Hall
7. Kyler Gordon
8. Arnold Ebektie
9. Travis Jones
10. Lewis Cine/Daxton Hill/Jaquan Brisker (whoever the coaches prefer)

6, 7, 8 and 9 are really close for me and ones that I switch day to day. For now I've settled on Hall being at the top of the board because there just are not a lot of 3Ts in this draft, so if you don't take one now, you may not get the chance later. CB is closer in terms of the depth, but there are some later round guys who you could convince yourself you can develop like Alontae Taylor.  ANd then DE is last because I think it's the lesser need of the 3, but also the depth at DE in this class is much better than at 3T or CB. I have Jones at the bottom because a NT is not really a need, but Jones could maybe play 3T? I am not sure, which is why the other 3 are ahead of him.

This is, of course, assuming the top players at the different positions are taken by now (Hutch, Thibs, Walker, Johnson at DE, Stingley, McDuffie, Gardner at CB, Wyatt and Davis at DT, Hamilton at S, Cross, Raimann, Penning, Ekwonu and Neal at OT.)

That's 28 players between the ones I assume are gone and the ones I would be willing to take at 31. That means as long as 3 WRs, QBs or LB are taken in the top 30, one of those players will be available. And I think it's fairly clear that at least 2 to 3 of them will be there.

If Karlaftis is there at 31, I am all over him.  Have him above all those other guys.  An immediate impact guy with positional versatility.  Love him.  

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(04-15-2022, 08:38 AM)Bengalpool Wrote: "Fool me once, shame on you....."

A lot of "experts" still say we should've taken Sewell over Chase. Even after Chase having the season that he did. My point is, the Bengals have proven once to think sexy over smart (to clear the air here, I was team Chase and I stand by that today. I'm just playing devil's advocate for arguments sake). Meaning, what's more important right now? Solidifying your OL and protecting Joey Franchise? OR, go after CB/DE which proved to be pretty good last year with most of that core returning? The biggest loss was Ogunjobi. Which is a loss. 

I think it's a toss up, but if Zion or Linderbaum are there, I feel like you have to take one of them. If Booth is there too, I wouldn't be upset if he was the pick. As long as we don't reach for a Travis Jones or Logan Hall, I won't be pissed. 

Travis Jones is a beast, but I hope they aren't considering him before a 2nd round selection (and a late one at that) as he is most likely a NT and we already have Reader, Tupou, and Shelvin as big DTs but no depth at 3T.  That isn't Jones's position.  He could be a value grab to develop BEHIND Reader, but I wouldn't do that in Round 1 with other guys likely to be there that are of greater talent at positions where we don't  have near that depth...and at so-called "premium positions" (CB, WR, OT).  

I know that is what you are saying.  I am just agreeing with you.  

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(04-16-2022, 06:18 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: For sure. Iowa, Bama, Wisconsin, Georgia, Penn State put out good OL.

Not saying OSU puts out terrible OL but they sure haven't been putting out good ones like these teams lately.

Kind of an interesting observation:  It is like since their offense went off and is wide open, the quality of the linemen they have rolled out has seemingly deteriorated.  

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(04-17-2022, 07:08 AM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: Tristan Whirfs has a bunch of pro bowls.  Very cool and all but the buckeyes have a ton of offensive lineman starting or on 53 man rosters throughout the league and there's never been a point in time this wasn't the case for many decades now.
Other than qb osu is a machine that produces so much nfl talent their olinemen get over looked but they're there, they always have been.
Ppl think other big ten schools who aren't factories like state have better linemen....no, its just that if Wisconsin puts a guy in the first round, its almost always an olinemen.
Which Hawkeye other than linderbaum coming out this year?  If petit frere was states only prospect you'd be more aware of him.  Wilson and Olave are the main buckeyes you're hearing about but Petit Frere might be going in the first round too.

Interesting note:  Years ago, Linderbaum beat Wirfs in a wrestling match.  They were HS rivals.  

https://www.facebook.com/HawkeyesAllAccess/videos/590877045368390/

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(04-17-2022, 12:43 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: QB is a totally different animal. There aren’t really any schools you could call “QB U” like you can with other positions.

Ironically, Ohio State may be trending that way with taking some credit for Burrow, but getting Haskins, Burrow, and Fields all first round picks and it sure looks like Stroud is trending that way.  Such a transformation from their past. 

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(04-17-2022, 03:18 PM)bfine32 Wrote: fine example; WTS, we'll see what happens without Lincoln Riely. He's now at what used to be QB-U

Good point.  And I think a lot of his genius was scheme and read simplification.  Not dismissing Baker and Kyler, but it appears they struggle a bit when forced to go beyond primary read.  

I sure wouldn't want to face a Lincoln Riley offense, though.  Dude is crazy creative and always adapting.  His defenses largely sucked, though, so they rarely went far in the playoffs.  

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(04-19-2022, 12:39 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: None. Yet…

Anyway, idc enough about guys like Baker Mayfield (who isn’t currently even a starter btw) or Jalen Hurts to keep debating who has the stronger case for “XX U” between Iowa and Oklahoma. I just know that I’ve seen Iowa referred to as “OL U” whereas I’ve never heard “QB U” for the latter. But I guess you could make such a case.

The thing that makes Iowa linemen more enticing to me is their coach.  He spends a LOT of time with his offensive line...  That is his number one unit for his NFL-style offense.  (although the college game is now spreading in the NFL...see what I did there?  Spreading?   )

[Bilbo Saggins]

Historically short arms, shotgun snap issues, scheme specific skill set, more of a premium run blocker than pass protector...I'd say that I've cooled on Linderbaum. He has a lot of bust potential and this class looks deep with developmental centers who may be able to start after a redshirt year. 

[CJD]

(04-19-2022, 10:33 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: If Karlaftis is there at 31, I am all over him.  Have him above all those other guys.  An immediate impact guy with positional versatility.  Love him.  

I think Linderbaum and Zion are similarly elite/crazy value picks at 31. I have the CBs up there because of need, so maybe I should change it to:

1. Linderbaum
2. George Karlaftis
3. Zion Johnson
4. Kaiir Elam
5. Andrew Booth Jr.
6. Kenyon Green

CB isn't such a big need that we should choose them over an elite prospect like Linderbaum, Karlaftis or Johnson.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-19-2022, 12:56 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I think Linderbaum and Zion are similarly elite/crazy value picks at 31. I have the CBs up there because of need, so maybe I should change it to:

1. Linderbaum
2. George Karlaftis
3. Zion Johnson
4. Kaiir Elam
5. Andrew Booth Jr.
6. Kenyon Green

CB isn't such a big need that we should choose them over an elite prospect like Linderbaum, Karlaftis or Johnson.

That’s a good ranking.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-19-2022, 11:04 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Ironically, Ohio State may be trending that way with taking some credit for Burrow, but getting Haskins, Burrow, and Fields all first round picks and it sure looks like Stroud is trending that way.  Such a transformation from their past. 

I’d agree but Oklahoma has 4 Heisman QB’ and 1 runner-up this century. Two #1 picks and 3 starters right now. USC used to own the QBU status. But Iowa rules TE and OL

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(04-19-2022, 12:56 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I think Linderbaum and Zion are similarly elite/crazy value picks at 31. I have the CBs up there because of need, so maybe I should change it to:

1. Linderbaum
2. George Karlaftis
3. Zion Johnson
4. Kaiir Elam
5. Andrew Booth Jr.
6. Kenyon Green

CB isn't such a big need that we should choose them over an elite prospect like Linderbaum, Karlaftis or Johnson.

Won't get any argument from me on this now.  I could even be swayed to take Linderbaum over Karlaftis because there will be pass rushers that can contribute in each round but not starting caliber centers with the tape of Linderbaum.  

One question I keep asking myself is that if Linderbaum is there at 31, and the Bengals don't select him, could he fall to them in Rd 2?  The answer is highly unlikely.  Even though he is only a fit for about half the teams, scheme-wise, teams like the Ravens also need a center and would be all over him in Rd 2.  

Which takes me to ANOTHER place:  Cleveland picks right ahead of Baltimore at 44, and they may need a center as well...which takes me to Atlanta at #43.  They are looking to stockpile picks.  The Bengals have 8 picks and let's face it, a lot of them might not make the roster.  Offer Atlanta our 2nd round pick at #63 and....nope.  The point chart says they would need our 3rd and 4th pick and maybe something else to equal the disparity in values. 

I guess my dream scenario is becoming Karlaftis and Carman figures it out and becomes a solid LG.  A bit of a risk with Carman, but the Bengals had zero pass rush down the stretch in the big game.  They need rotational studs and a better pass rush to win it all this year.  I think that is actually priority one now that the offensive line has had so much help in the offseason.  

Last year the free agency focused on the defense and the draft focused largely on the offense.  I think the script will flip and I could see the Bengals having three straight defensive players in this draft like DE, CB, and DT.  WR depth is there for help later on as is some guard competition for Carman.  

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(04-19-2022, 08:42 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I’d agree but Oklahoma has 4 Heisman QB’ and 1 runner-up this century. Two #1 picks and 3 starters right now. USC used to own the QBU status. But Iowa rules TE and OL

This century, sure.  But Ohio State went from QB wasteland to three first round picks (if you include Burrow, which is somewhat fair) in three years and a sure-fire fourth one next year (or maybe it is the year after).  That is quite a change in just a five year window. 

Somewhere Craig Krynzel is saying "Hey!  What about me".  Love the guy for his guts and guile and he made a brief run at it in the NFL when I never thought he would.  

You are right about Iowa, though.  That is Ferentz, 100%.  I always thought Iowa could be the anti-spread team and play ball-control if they ever had a really good defense.  They could also take advantage of their blocking if they would have a crazy mobile QB.  

[Savagehenry54]

(04-18-2022, 03:00 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: It is true that OSU puts out so many other good players at other positions that OL is a bit overlooked.

I like their DL they produce much more than their OL though. The Bosas and Hubbard for example are studs.

They also put out a lot of good WR's and Secondary players.

Lecharles Bentley was another good center....hell osu centers alone made Billy price look the part, at least as a guard rt?  Nope.  We just had bad luck with that one.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-19-2022, 10:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Kind of an interesting observation:  It is like since their offense went off and is wide open, the quality of the linemen they have rolled out has seemingly deteriorated.  

I think it is because of the OL coach that was mentioned. He must not be as good as the guy before him by a long shot.

(04-20-2022, 10:47 AM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: Lecharles Bentley was another good center....hell osu centers alone made Billy price look the part, at least as a guard rt?  Nope.  We just had bad luck with that one.

Yes, there have been lots of good OL out of OSU. It is just a lot have busted where I didn't think they would including Price.

Could of been having Turner here after his rookie season, could of been injury, the short arms... 

I would say all these were factors in Price busting.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-20-2022, 07:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: This century, sure.  But Ohio State went from QB wasteland to three first round picks (if you include Burrow, which is somewhat fair) in three years and a sure-fire fourth one next year (or maybe it is the year after).  That is quite a change in just a five year window. 

Somewhere Craig Krynzel is saying "Hey!  What about me".  Love the guy for his guts and guile and he made a brief run at it in the NFL when I never thought he would.  

You are right about Iowa, though.  That is Ferentz, 100%.  I always thought Iowa could be the anti-spread team and play ball-control if they ever had a really good defense.  They could also take advantage of their blocking if they would have a crazy mobile QB.  

Oh for sure Ohio State as of late gaining reputation.

[*bfine32*]

(04-19-2022, 08:42 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I’d agree but Oklahoma has 4 Heisman QB’ and 1 runner-up this century. Two #1 picks and 3 starters right now. USC used to own the QBU status. But Iowa rules TE and OL

Notre Dame might disagree. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-21-2022, 12:36 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Notre Dame might disagree. 

Yeah, Notre Dame might the only school I’d give the edge to. They have quantity, and several high end guys (Nelson, Zach Martin, etc).