Another safety with a new contract

[CloeHokie]

(06-15-2022, 03:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is exactly how the franchise tag is supposed to work.  Keep the big star around for a year while you develop the guy you drafted to replace him.

Good teams lose good players.  They can't pay everyone.  We just aren't used to seeing much of that around here.

And this. Was about to say something similar

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-15-2022, 01:51 PM)pally Wrote: Steeler Minkah Fitzpatrick has agreed to a 4-year extension worth $73.6 million or $18.4 per year with $36 million due at signing.  We will have to see the actual breakdown for the real structure and yearly hit.  This makes Fitzpatrick the highest-paid safety in the league.

Fitzpatrick was the Dolphins' #1 pick  (11th)in 2018. Jessie Bates was a 2nd round pick (54th) of the Bengals in the same draft.  Usually,  you will see Fitzpatrick ranked higher than Bates. But, this is probably the best measure of what Bates is looking for salary-wise out of all the safety contracts we've seen recently. However, as we know, the hold-up with Bates seems to relate more to the guaranteed money and the upfront signing bonuses structure than the actual dollar amount  The Bengals are very reluctant to pay really large upfront signing bonuses even if the total payout of a contract might end up being similar or in some cases larger than the sum total of the player's requested contract  Players want guaranteed money.  Bates has an agent who is willing and able to play hardball.  So who wins...the rock or the hard place?  Only time will tell.

Well this put Bates out of the question with our QB and WR's coming up for monster deals in a couple years.

Thank God we drafted Daxton and Tycen to soften the blow. Wish Jessie Bates III the best once he leaves.

The question is if he will play on the Tag for us this season. This is still up in the air, we will see. 

If he won't look for some kind of move that hopefully benefits both him and the Bengals.

[Housh]

It’s really gonna suck when Burrow is shitting on their secondary the next 4 years

[*Synric*]

When Bates didn't sign his an extension in 2021 to spread out a large cap hit for safety we all knew that his days in Cincinnati were numbered.

[Housh]

No way i can condone paying ANY defensive player this on our team.

[Destro]

They have to pay someone that much to get embarrassed by the Bengals receivers twice a year.

[J24]

I don't necessarily see this as the end of the Bengals and Jessie Bates relationship.

1.) He is clearly loved by the team and coaching staff.

2.) While many see Hill as the New Bates I could see the Bengals seeing him as the new Hilton as well.

At the end of the day people are massively underrating what Bates brings to the table. The guy is the best post Safety in the NFL and he allows us to play 8 guys in the Box. It's going to be hard to fine a Safety with his range and Ball skills.

[Housh]

(06-15-2022, 08:55 PM)Housh Wrote: No way i can condone paying ANY defensive player this on our team.

Addition:


I’d pay Bates similar money but i wouldn’t give 4 years 36 million guaranteed and in negotiations i would use the 2021 regular season against him. I’d have to get 5 years out of you and if he gave us 5 years I’d guarantee 35 million of a 5 year 70 million deal.


If he wants more than 5 years 70 million i cannot do it.


He could also probably convince me to guaruntee up to about 50 million of it too if his agent had a mouthpiece.

[Housh]

Just heard Looked on Bengals say that with contract extensions like what Minkah just signed you generally add the last year of the old deal into the deal. So Minkahs 4 year 73.6 million dollar deal is would be like a 5 year 83 million dollar contract which averages to about 16.5 million per year. But just the 4 New Years he got average out to 18.25 million per year.

So it’s safe to say if we aren’t offering at least 18.50 or 19 a year Jesse isn’t listening to our offer. I believe Jesse is the best FS in the league and the market is now set. I would give him the contract personally. Burrow, Chase and Bates will be out big 3 for the next decade.


What i don’t want happening is the Browns or Ravens givin him that contract and now we have to face 2 all pro safeties 4 times a year

[Mgbrown66]

Bates or Higgins? Which one is more easily replaced?

Simple as that.

[*bfine32*]

(06-16-2022, 05:00 PM)Mgbrown66 Wrote: Bates or Higgins?  Which one is more easily replaced?

Simple as that.

I see it more as a Bates or Bell. If we sign bates to a big deal you can kiss Bell goodbye next year. 

Do we want a starting Safety tandem of Bates and Dax next year> Which one plays the box? 

[GodFather]

If we lose Bates after this year, will we regret it the way the Bengals let Whit go?

[fredtoast]

(06-16-2022, 05:15 PM)GodFather Wrote: If we lose Bates after this year, will we regret it the way the Bengals let Whit go?

We can't pay everyone.

I don't want to lose anyone, but that is not the reality of the situation.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-16-2022, 05:05 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I see it more as a Bates or Bell. If we sign bates to a big deal you can kiss Bell goodbye next year. 

Do we want a starting Safety tandem of Bates and Dax next year> Which one plays the box? 

In that situation Dax would definitely play the box as he is a much better tackler. The thing is Dax has range too and Von will
be much cheaper to extend. The Daxton Hill pick is so good in so many ways cause he is so versatile. I know he hasn't done it
in the NFL yet but I truly believe he will be just as good as Bates in a lot of ways and much better in his tackling.

(06-16-2022, 05:15 PM)GodFather Wrote: If we lose Bates after this year, will we regret it the way the Bengals let Whit go?

Completely different scenarios GF. Old elite LT past his prime vs somewhat inconsistent FS in his prime that will cost tons...

I think we have Bates replacement here too in Dax Hill, we didn't have anything close when Whit left.

[GodFather]

(06-16-2022, 05:52 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think we have Bates replacement here too in Dax Hill, we didn't have anything close when Whit left.


How do you know Dax hasn't even played a  snap? You jump the gun buddy, remember how bullish you were last year on how great Jackson Carman would be? 

Bates is one of the top players in his position. Big shoes for Dax to fill if it comes down to that.

[*rfaulk34*]

(06-15-2022, 02:30 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Or maybe PFF is just complete bullshit at times.

Remember that they claimed 2018 Andy Dalton was better than 2015 Andy Dalton.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

To GodFather...

I would say Bates is a top 10 Safety, yeah, those are big shoes. But I wanted Bates before we drafted him and he has still 
been pretty inconsistent in his play especially tackling which has always been his weakness. I have much higher hopes for 
Dax Hill who is already a fantastic tackler and is much more polished as a player going into the NFL.

[J24]

(06-16-2022, 05:05 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I see it more as a Bates or Bell. If we sign bates to a big deal you can kiss Bell goodbye next year. 

Do we want a starting Safety tandem of Bates and Dax next year> Which one plays the box? 

 Tycen Anderson while Dax plays the star/Nickel position!

[XenoMorph]

(06-15-2022, 01:51 PM)pally Wrote: Steeler Minkah Fitzpatrick has agreed to a 4-year extension worth $73.6 million or $18.4 per year with $36 million due at signing.  We will have to see the actual breakdown for the real structure and yearly hit.  This makes Fitzpatrick the highest-paid safety in the league.

Fitzpatrick was the Dolphins' #1 pick  (11th)in 2018. Jessie Bates was a 2nd round pick (54th) of the Bengals in the same draft.  Usually,  you will see Fitzpatrick ranked higher than Bates. But, this is probably the best measure of what Bates is looking for salary-wise out of all the safety contracts we've seen recently. However, as we know, the hold-up with Bates seems to relate more to the guaranteed money and the upfront signing bonuses structure than the actual dollar amount  The Bengals are very reluctant to pay really large upfront signing bonuses even if the total payout of a contract might end up being similar or in some cases larger than the sum total of the player's requested contract  Players want guaranteed money.  Bates has an agent who is willing and able to play hardball.  So who wins...the rock or the hard place?  Only time will tell.

if thats the deal Bates wants pass

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-17-2022, 12:56 AM)J24 Wrote:  Tycen Anderson while Dax plays the star/Nickel position!

This could work great too.