Joe Burrow "There's nothing down the field if teams play us like they (Ravens) did"

[Essex Johnson]

(10-10-2022, 09:08 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Tyler Boyd was also going against the Raven's #3 CB that he been allowing opposing QB's a PERFECT QB RATING when targeting him up to last night.  Boyd was targeted 4 times.  

and as pointed out by announcers was missed at least 2 times in the seam, 1 for a likely TD.. im not going to argue the targets since Chase is the playmaker, we targeted him 1/3 of our passes with five misses and the 7 catches he did not make a big play on

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-10-2022, 09:13 AM)lone bengal Wrote: So frustrating acting like cover 2 is some elaborate scheme we can never figure out. Teams that don’t have Chase, Higgins , Boyd , Hurst , Burrow and Mixon score way more points then us consistently. Team should be scoring 30 points weekly , we scored 20,19, and 17 in all three loses.

At least the other 2 losses you can blame on a dominant pass rush. Last night Taylor and Callahan just got straight up out coached.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-10-2022, 09:13 AM)lone bengal Wrote: So frustrating acting like cover 2 is some elaborate scheme we can never figure out. Teams that don’t have Chase, Higgins , Boyd , Hurst , Burrow and Mixon score way more points then us consistently. Team should be scoring 30 points weekly , we scored 20,19, and 17 in all three loses.

Those teams have good schemes and coaches. Bad teams don't adjust the scheme to the opponent.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-10-2022, 09:15 AM)Garrus Wrote: We rarely see many short route concepts with this offense. Not many slants, smash routes, digs, or curls. No play action rollouts, little motion. It's late enough in the season that they should know how to beat cover 2. KC did it last year after a few weeks, they adjusted. Why can Zac Taylor not do the same?

Because Taylor and Callahan aren’t Reid and Bieniemy. I think that’s pretty clear.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-10-2022, 09:21 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: At least the other 2 losses you can blame on a dominant pass rush. Last night Taylor and Callahan just got straight up out coached.

Unfortunately, I think the best we can hope for is Callahan gone. They'd likely promote someone on offense to take over for him this year.

Honestly, whoever scripts the 1st quarter plays...is a major issue. I assume it's Callahan. I don't know though.

[*michaelsean*]

I'm sure there was a question before this statement like, "Why aren't you attempting the deep throws?"

[XenoMorph]

(10-10-2022, 07:56 AM)Trademark Wrote: Yeah I don't like the vibe either, seems like his swag is going away

Seems like they could call plays to take advantage of them playing that way.

[XenoMorph]

(10-10-2022, 09:24 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Unfortunately, I think the best we can hope for is Callahan gone. They'd likely promote someone on offense to take over for him this year.

Honestly, whoever scripts the 1st quarter plays...is a major issue. I assume it's Callahan. I don't know though.

that wont fix the main issue of Zac calling plays

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-10-2022, 09:21 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: At least the other 2 losses you can blame on a dominant pass rush. Last night Taylor and Callahan just got straight up out coached.

Yes and unfortunately that's not hard to do.

[Gdale_Bengal]

This is when a running game comes in handy.


They aren’t even willing to try to run on 1st and goal from the 2. This team is pathetic this year and it’s hard to watch.

[Nepa]

(10-10-2022, 09:16 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Joe has to thrive in the dink and dunk short passing game. Hopefully we don't continue to see batted down balls at the line of scrimmage like last night.

Batted down balls and a terrible interception just after the Ravens turned the ball over at the 40 on downs. 

[higgy100]

(10-10-2022, 08:05 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Joe Burrow is absolutely right.  There is nothing down the field.  Defensive coordinators have seen plenty of film on the 2021 Cincinnati Bengals and they have successfully countered the deep threat.  Play "two high safety" and the Bengals have no answer.  

With this said, it marks the first time Joe has implicitly called out the coaches.  Every other press conference from 2020 onward has featured classic Burrow-isms like, "I need to play better," but this is different.  Teams have made the Bengals one-dimensional on offense and if the run gets stuffed as well, the offense sputters along.    

But they had the recipe to win that game last night if ZT doesn't crap his pants on the 2 yard line. Threw some screens, had the running game going with good push by the OL mid/late game and threw underneath stuff to perfection. You're not always going to do what your game plan dictates.

You win the AFC north by being physical and they had momentum and physicality working for them and ZT got fancy. Irony in all of this is that when the run game is worthless he'll keep feeding the ball to Mixon inside the 10 but when it's working as it did from late 2nd quarter on he gets fancy. I'm running the ball 3x in that series.

[WeezyBengal]

The problem with this quote isn't what Joe said...because he's right. Cover 2 takes away the deep threat. That's just a fact.

The problem is that teams have been playing this all year against us and we are still befuddled by it and can't move the ball down field any other way. We can't run, we can't throw over the middle, sceheme guys open other ways, use misdirection, etc.

That is concerning as hell.

[Essex Johnson]

(10-10-2022, 09:55 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: The problem with this quote isn't what Joe said...because he's right. Cover 2 takes away the deep threat. That's just a fact.

The problem is that teams have been playing this all year against us and we are still befuddled by it and can't move the ball down field any other way. We can't run, we can't throw over the middle, sceheme guys open other ways, use misdirection, etc.

That is concerning as hell.

I agree but the hard part to blame, the idea that is just play calling is just wrong, the idea it is just players fault is also wrong but there are 2 coaches and 4 players that much figure this out starting with Taylor and Burrow followed by Callahan, Chase and Mixon.  If this group of five don;t step up, we will continue to struggle, because short passing is not normally impacted as much by a so so Oline, and Mixon needs to run like last nite on a consistent basis to help with that passing game. 

[WeezyBengal]

(10-10-2022, 10:01 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: I agree but the hard part to blame, the idea that is just play calling is just wrong, the idea it is just players fault is also wrong but there are 2 coaches and 4 players that much figure this out starting with Taylor and Burrow followed by Callahan, Chase and Mixon.  If this group of five don;t step up, we will continue to struggle, because short passing is not normally impacted as much by a so so Oline, and Mixon needs to run like last nite on a consistent basis to help with that passing game. 

I'd like to watch some tape on the game and see if guys were open in the middle of the field last night or open at all. Its impossible to tell on TV because of the zoomed in angle. 

ZT has been atrocious this year, but Burrow has looked different as well. He isn't pushing the ball down field and has played very conservative. 

[Essex Johnson]

(10-10-2022, 10:03 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I'd like to watch some tape on the game and see if guys were open in the middle of the field last night or open at all. Its impossible to tell on TV because of the zoomed in angle. 

ZT has been atrocious this year, but Burrow has looked different as well. He isn't pushing the ball down field and has played very conservative. 

im just repeating what announcers said but i do remember a play where Boyd is in the background wide open.  As I stated i don;t blame ZT totally or put the majority of the offense issues on Burrow but both of these guys are key to move the bar, if that means ZT gives up total play calling though i believe it is a group effort in many calls or if it means Burrow adjust his game as teams have adjusted to him than do it. 

Maybe we gave ZT too much credit last year with our success and maybe Burrow is more limited as a QB when defenses are adjusting than anyone thought.. either way we need something to happen with Taylor and Burrow and i throw Chase in there also as keys to adjust to be successful

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-10-2022, 10:19 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: im just repeating what announcers said but i do remember a play where Boyd is in the background wide open.  As I stated i don;t blame ZT totally or put the majority of the offense issues on Burrow but both of these guys are key to move the bar, if that means ZT gives up total play calling though i believe it is a group effort in many calls or if it means Burrow adjust his game as teams have adjusted to him than do it. 

Maybe we gave ZT too much credit last year with our success and maybe Burrow is more limited as a QB than we thought.. either way we need something to happen to our top HC and top QB and i throw Chase in there also as keys to adjust to be successful

We don’t have a “top HC”

[samhain]

I don't get any of what's happening with this team right now.

When Burrow came out of LSU, He wasn't a big arm quarterback prototype that lived and died by the long ball. He was a hyper-accurate passer that fit throws into tight windows and also happened to have a good enough deep ball to be an elite player. Hell, his ability to throw deep was questioned pretty intensely leading up to the draft. His ability to excel in the intermediate passing game was one of the most enticing things about him as a prospect.

You can't really say he's prone to locking onto a single target, either, because he's always had an embarrassment of weapons and he'd been good at feeding them all. Chase, Jefferson, Marshall, Edwards-Elaire, Moss. None of them complained about targets or touches because they were all utilized when appropriate. The weaponry here is about as close as a qb will come to that in the NFL.

Practically all of the greats has great primary targets, but the true elite ones still had guys underneath that they fed the ball when downfield options were covered up. Brady would kill defenses with Welker and Edelman when you took away Moss or Gronk. Manning did the same with Clark and later Welker. Those offenses dared defenses to key in on wrs downfield, The would kill teams dinking and dunking all day if they had to.

We have the personnel for this. It's a broken record. Tyler Boyd is as good as any of the guys I mentioned. Instead of stubbornly forcing the ball to Ja'marr all game, they need to wear out Boyd until some has to adjust to stop him. Same with Hurst. They need to make defenses adjust if they want the deep ball to return.

Burrow bears some responsibility, but at the end of the day, a full season of mismanagement of this offensive talent should be fireable. No way it should take this long to adjust to a standard NFL defense like the Tampa 2.

[Essex Johnson]

(10-10-2022, 11:00 AM)samhain Wrote: I don't get any of what's happening with this team right now.  

When Burrow came out of LSU, He wasn't a big arm quarterback prototype that lived and died by the long ball.  He was a hyper-accurate passer that fit throws into tight windows and also happened to have a good enough deep ball to be an elite player.  Hell, his ability to throw deep was questioned pretty intensely leading up to the draft.  His ability to excel in the intermediate passing game was one of the most enticing things about him as a prospect.  

You can't really say he's prone to locking onto a single target, either, because he's always had an embarrassment of weapons and he'd been good at feeding them all.  Chase, Jefferson, Marshall, Edwards-Elaire, Moss.  None of them complained about targets or touches because they were all utilized when appropriate.  The weaponry here is about as close as a qb will come to that in the NFL.

Practically all of the greats has great primary targets, but the true elite ones still had guys underneath that they fed the ball when downfield options were covered up.  Brady would kill defenses with Welker and Edelman when you took away Moss or Gronk.  Manning did the same with Clark and later Welker.  Those offenses dared defenses to key in on wrs downfield,  The would kill teams dinking and dunking all day if they had to.  

We have the personnel for this.  It's a broken record.  Tyler Boyd is as good as any of the guys I mentioned.  Instead of stubbornly forcing the ball to Ja'marr all game, they need to wear out Boyd until some has to adjust to stop him.  Same with Hurst.  They need to make defenses adjust if they want the deep ball to return.

Burrow bears some responsibility, but at the end of the day, a full season of mismanagement of this offensive talent should be fireable.  No way it should take this long to adjust to a standard NFL defense like the Tampa 2.

Well that senior year, LSU rolled they had so much talent at college level look at the players that are in the NFL and defenses were over matched etc. .the NFL is different, the window of ability is less and coaches game plan much better ie Bengals and Lamar.  As pointed out in another post, Burrow past 9 games has had no wow game of big offense.. he has two games of 300 yards and 3 tds passing in those 9.  Pretty much every play Burrow touches the ball so accountability has to rest with him also with the coaches especially Taylor

I am a Packer fan and trust me ive seen Rodgers do more with less with players and management decisions, and look back at Luck, Colts did not do a good job in management with him either but he was able to take over a bad team and overcome to have a winning record and 4 playoff appearances. 

I don;t think these are separate issue, management and our top players on offense are both responsible for our start.  

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-10-2022, 11:20 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Well that senior year, LSU rolled they had so much talent at college level look at the players that are in the NFL and defenses were over matched etc. .the NFL is different, the window of ability is less and coaches game plan much better ie Bengals and Lamar.  As pointed out in another post, Burrow past 9 games has had no wow game of big offense.. he has two games of 300 yards and 3 tds passing in those 9.  Pretty much every play Burrow touches the ball so accountability has to rest with him also with the coaches especially Taylor

I am a Packer fan and trust me ive seen Rodgers do more with less with players and management decisions, and look back at Luck, Colts did not do a good job in management with him either but he was able to take over a bad team and overcome to have a winning record and 4 playoff appearances. 

I don;t think these are separate issue, management and our top players on offense are both responsible for our start.  

This explains a lot.