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Simple question…
What base defense still works on Burrow?
Burrow has had bad games, great games. But in EVERY SINGLE GAME he’s learned. Burrows biggest pro coming out of college was his IQ. I think he’s shown that in his first 3 years. We’ve gone through stints where pressure bothered him. Where cover 2 bothered him. We’ve seen teams do well against Burrow but just selling out to guard deep.
At this point i think Burrow has mastered every mainstream bass defense he can possibly see. I am afraid to say this because there’s always SOMETHING that will fluster a guy but at this point, if something does fluster Burrow it won’t be a teams base D.
At this point my question is, is there still a base D that exists that should be the template to what you should play VS Burrow?
Imo you can’t play man damn near at all. You can’t play cover 2 because he now fully accepts that every play can’t be a TD and he’ll tear up your middle. You can’t play cover 3 because cover 3 is basically man down the field and all he has to do is see where the single high safety goes. You cant play cover 2 man because then we’ll destroy you with Boyd. You can’t run cover 4 as a base D because one it’s stupid and 2 with the emergence of our run game we would literally eat that coverage up.
The only way i feel there is a template to beat Burrow is if you have an elite pass rush. So my opinion is based off the assumption i have a pass rush. I say you stay in cover 2 as your base D and hope and pray you can tackle guys where they catch it and hope and pray the running game sucks that day. I racked my brain a long time and i just can’t think of a defense that still tricks Burrow. Now with my luck the Browns will create a brand new coverage just so i eat crow but hey it is what it is.
-Housh
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I'd be curious how Burrow would perform against an elite secondary. Not sure he's went up against that monster yet.
I remember Burrow struggling vs. the Broncos until Boyd broke through for that TD.
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Opposing team's only hope is to dare us to run and then hope they can slow or stop our running game.
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A blitz is how you get to Burrow. And when the line plays well, it's over.
The Bengals also have loaded skill players at receiver too.
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(12-05-2022, 02:15 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: A blitz is how you get to Burrow. And when the line plays well, it's over.
The Bengals also have loaded skill players at receiver too.
He's about the best QB against the league against the blitz.
“History teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure.”-Thurgood Marshall
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(12-05-2022, 02:21 PM)michaelsean Wrote: He's about the best QB against the league against the blitz.
He is but i just haven’t seen teams consistently rock him if they aren’t pressuring.
But on the flip side Iv seen bad teams win against him because they harassed him
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(12-05-2022, 02:04 PM)Housh Wrote: Simple question…
What base defense still works on Burrow?
Burrow has had bad games, great games. But in EVERY SINGLE GAME he’s learned. Burrows biggest pro coming out of college was his IQ. I think he’s shown that in his first 3 years. We’ve gone through stints where pressure bothered him. Where cover 2 bothered him. We’ve seen teams do well against Burrow but just selling out to guard deep.
At this point i think Burrow has mastered every mainstream bass defense he can possibly see. I am afraid to say this because there’s always SOMETHING that will fluster a guy but at this point, if something does fluster Burrow it won’t be a teams base D.
At this point my question is, is there still a base D that exists that should be the template to what you should play VS Burrow?
Imo you can’t play man damn near at all. You can’t play cover 2 because he now fully accepts that every play can’t be a TD and he’ll tear up your middle. You can’t play cover 3 because cover 3 is basically man down the field and all he has to do is see where the single high safety goes. You cant play cover 2 man because then we’ll destroy you with Boyd. You can’t run cover 4 as a base D because one it’s stupid and 2 with the emergence of our run game we would literally eat that coverage up.
The only way i feel there is a template to beat Burrow is if you have an elite pass rush. So my opinion is based off the assumption i have a pass rush. I say you stay in cover 2 as your base D and hope and pray you can tackle guys where they catch it and hope and pray the running game sucks that day. I racked my brain a long time and i just can’t think of a defense that still tricks Burrow. Now with my luck the Browns will create a brand new coverage just so i eat crow but hey it is what it is.
Simply put, I think only Mahomes and Allen have shown such greatness so early in their careers in a sustainable way. RGIII's game was not sustainable. You could argue about Lamar's. I put Rogers in a different category because he was able to sit and learn for three years before starting, but then he took off. Brady, despite all his rings, was more of a game manager at this point in his career. Manning and Elway didn't start this fast. It is amazing what these three have done.
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(12-05-2022, 03:29 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Simply put, I think only Mahomes and Allen have shown such greatness so early in their careers in a sustainable way. RGIII's game was not sustainable. You could argue about Lamar's. I put Rogers in a different category because he was able to sit and learn for three years before starting, but then he took off. Brady, despite all his rings, was more of a game manager at this point in his career. Manning and Elway didn't start this fast. It is amazing what these three have done.
Allen took a few years.
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(12-05-2022, 02:06 PM)QueenCity Wrote: I'd be curious how Burrow would perform against an elite secondary. Not sure he's went up against that monster yet.
I remember Burrow struggling vs. the Broncos until Boyd broke through for that TD.
Which secondaries are considered elite rn? I'm sure if he has time and his weapons he could pick them apart. An elite pass rush, like Dallas is scarier I think.
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(12-05-2022, 03:56 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: Which secondaries are considered elite rn? I'm sure if he has time and his weapons he could pick them apart. An elite pass rush, like Dallas is scarier I think.
Hopefully Zac has learned how to beat a good pass rush with screens and running the ball. We'll see this next game with Cleveland coming to town. Of course our O-line has been great lately too, which helps.
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(12-05-2022, 03:56 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: Which secondaries are considered elite rn? I'm sure if he has time and his weapons he could pick them apart. An elite pass rush, like Dallas is scarier I think.
Yes every QB in the league will struggle if teams get home on a consistent basis with four.
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(12-05-2022, 02:14 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Opposing team's only hope is to dare us to run and then hope they can slow or stop our running game.
When the Bengals offense is playing well, it seems like it can't be stopped.
Early in the year when it wasn't...it seemed like it could do nothing right.
Quite the paradox.
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(12-05-2022, 03:29 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Simply put, I think only Mahomes and Allen have shown such greatness so early in their careers in a sustainable way. RGIII's game was not sustainable. You could argue about Lamar's. I put Rogers in a different category because he was able to sit and learn for three years before starting, but then he took off. Brady, despite all his rings, was more of a game manager at this point in his career. Manning and Elway didn't start this fast. It is amazing what these three have done.
Yes. Great post!
Most young QB's that have success are more game managers that don't mess up, but they're not making huge plays consistently either. Those 3 are guys that make plays.
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(12-05-2022, 04:07 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: When the Bengals offense is playing well, it seems like it can't be stopped.
Early in the year when it wasn't...it seemed like it could do nothing right.
Quite the paradox.
Early in the year, posters were pointing out (or asserting) that the Bengals couldn't figure out cover two. Now, I'm not sure what defense Burrow and the Bengals can't handle. If the OL and blocking backs can stop the great pass rushers (Myles Garrett, Micah Parsons, Aaron Donald, etc.) then the sky is the limit for this offense. We will get a test this coming Sunday in terms of stopping the pass rushers.
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(12-05-2022, 03:54 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Allen took a few years.
He was great in his third year. Not bad considering he came from Wyoming.
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(12-05-2022, 03:56 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: Which secondaries are considered elite rn? I'm sure if he has time and his weapons he could pick them apart. An elite pass rush, like Dallas is scarier I think.
I don't know that's why I'm asking. The Jets with Sauce is pretty good but I'm curious if there is a team out there with two shut down corners and a good safety.
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A monster three technique pass rusher would give fits. It was always Brady’s kryptonite.
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This team was built for the modern NFL. Elite secondaries are rare to non-existent. Shutdown corners are an endangered species. The new rules about PI won't let DBs get physical with receivers anymore.
An elite pass rush is the only effective way to stop an elite passer. Fortunately, Burrow also has elite pocket presence. He almost always seems to know when a rusher is close and when to bail out and run. The improvement of the interior line has made him less skittish and downright lethal.
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I also have to think that the emergence of a physical back like Perine only enhances the passing game. If the defense plays 2 deep safeties, Samaje eats. As long as the game plan maintains the threat of a run game, Burrow will be that much more effective.
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(12-05-2022, 09:32 PM)samhain Wrote: I also have to think that the emergence of a physical back like Perine only enhances the passing game. If the defense plays 2 deep safeties, Samaje eats. As long as the game plan maintains the threat of a run game, Burrow will be that much more effective.
That's the thing. If we have just a decent game running the ball this offense is almost impossible to stop.
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