For those believing the Bengals got "hosed"

[casear2727]

(01-06-2023, 12:29 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Easy. I put myself in the shoes of a Baltimore or Buffalo fan--or if that's too distasteful for you--put their situation on the Bengals, then i realize that any shafting is minimal, or not at all. 

Baltimore had no shot to win the division because they played and lost 1 more game. 
Buffalo was fortunate to have that game cancelled--in a very loose definition of "fortunate" involving only the play onfield--and, in the same number of games as the Bengals, have won one more game. 

We will never know if not playing that Buffalo game to its conclusion, was of more benefit to the bengals due to a loss of the actual game or even worse, a loss of a major player, i.e., Burrow. 

Anything in the world could have happened in that game. I choose not to simply ignore the bad things that could have happened and only point out the good things that could have happened.

As a Buffalo fan Im sure they would love this.  Never have to play the Bengals in Cincy. No one is giving any consideration to us possibly have winning that game.

[*bfine32*]

(01-06-2023, 02:06 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: My overall take on this is that the NFL has made it far more complicated than it needed to be. There were already rules in place to address this...which goes to Katie's point that there is no reason to make changes on the fly during the season. 

The rule that is in place is win percentage. Using that would have "benefitted" the Bengals and "hampered" the Bills. 

The NFL just tweaked them to "benefit" the Bills and "hamper" the Bengals. Katie should be pissed as should the players and fans. 

[Bengalholic]

(01-06-2023, 02:51 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The rule that is in place is win percentage. Using that would have "benefitted" the Bengals and "hampered" the Bills. 

The NFL just tweaked them to "benefit" the Bills and "hamper" the Bengals. Katie should be pissed as should the players and fans. 

Zac Taylor said he "doesn't want to hear about fair and equitable" when rules are being changed on the fly.

Was he surprised?

No.

"It's opportunities lost for us. We had control and now we don't. There are positives for a lot of teams and negatives for us."

— Charlie Goldsmith (@CharlieG__) January 6, 2023

[Big Boss]

Zaddy isn't having it.

[bengalfan47]

(01-06-2023, 12:48 AM)Von Cichlid Wrote: One more crappy thing is that there is a deadly Chargers team who no one is paying attention to right now.  They could really use that to their advantage.

I disagree. If you listen to any sports talk show they all are saying "No one wants to play this team..." " The Chargers are this year's Bengals" "Justin Herbert is not only the best young QB ever, his hair is super dreamy!! " blah blah blah.

Bring on the Chargers. 

[*pally*]

Just ordered my Bengals playoff shirt... so excited pic.twitter.com/jkKiRXXb8X

— Tyler Meinerding (@TylerMeinerding) January 6, 2023

[*ochocincos*]

(01-06-2023, 12:19 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: They did not. 

1. The Bengals win the AFCN, win or lose due to a better win % in less games. Baltimore has no say in that. The Bengals benefit from playing and losing one less game. 

2. Buffalo has won one more game than the Bengals, in the exact same number of games played. If's and but's do not count here. The Bengals were ahead but did not win that game. It didn't happen. The fact of the matter is, they could have just as easily lost the game. 

What are you saying if the Bengals were one game better in the same number of games and the Bills were leading in a game that was cancelled. Let me tell you--you're saying "tough cookies" because we have the better record in the same number of games played. 

3. A coin flip only comes into play if Baltimore wins this Sunday and the results of this weeks games cause the Bengals and Ravens to be matched up in the WC round. A coin flip is fair because the Bengals benefitted from potentially losing one more game vs Bills. 

To wrap it up....the Bengals were not screwed in any way shape or form and if you think they were, you're not being genuine or honest. 

Where I will (somewhat) disagree with your assessment is that about the ONLY benefit to being a division winner vs a wildcard is hosting playoff games(s).
Now, the Bengals might end up having that taken away, so what's the benefit of being the "division winner" now vs being a wildcard team?
On the flip side, the Bengals now have to pick later in the draft because the draft order goes by winning percentage.

Unfortunately, there's no perfect solution to this outcome.
At least one team is going to get a potential disadvantage.
Had everything been determined solely on winning percentage, the NFL just potentially prevented the Ravens from winning the division and forced to be a wildcard.
This coin flip was an attempt to appease the Ravens (to an extent) since we do not know what the outcome of the Bengals-Bills game would have been.

[*PhilHos*]

(01-06-2023, 03:27 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Where I will (somewhat) disagree with your assessment is that about the ONLY benefit to being a division winner vs a wildcard is hosting playoff games(s).
Now, the Bengals might end up having that taken away, so what's the benefit of being the "division winner" now vs being a wildcard team?
On the flip side, the Bengals now have to pick later in the draft because the draft order goes by winning percentage.

Unfortunately, there's no perfect solution to this outcome.
At least one team is going to get a potential disadvantage.
Had everything been determined solely on winning percentage, the NFL just potentially prevented the Ravens from winning the division and forced to be a wildcard.
This coin flip was an attempt to appease the Ravens (to an extent) since we do not know what the outcome of the Bengals-Bills game would have been.

Yep appease the Ravens, appease the Bills, but F@#$! the Bengals. :angry:

[Essex Johnson]

(01-06-2023, 02:51 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The rule that is in place is win percentage. Using that would have "benefitted" the Bengals and "hampered" the Bills. 

The NFL just tweaked them to "benefit" the Bills and "hamper" the Bengals. Katie should be pissed as should the players and fans. 

Im missing something, win percentage how does that benefit Bengals and hamper Bills, am i not correct if KC wins, the Bills can not get 1 seed  because of win percentage. what am I missing? if we tie with record with Bills, i don;t think the Bills become 2nd seed because of win percentage, again what am i missing ? If you are talking neutral site.. maybe i see some of your point but still can hamper the Bills also

[*ochocincos*]

(01-06-2023, 03:33 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Yep appease the Ravens, appease the Bills, but F@#$! the Bengals. :angry:

It doesn't totally **** the Bengals though, just kind of.

They could have forced both the Bengals and Bills to have a loss or the Bengals would have ended up losing to the Bills if they had played, and then if the Ravens beat the Bengals this week, they'd have landed in the wildcard with 0 chance of getting a home playoff game.

This would essentially still give the Bengals a chance to host a playoff game even if they lost to the Ravens because we don't know what the outcome of the Bills game was and they didn't force a loss for not playing.

What outcome would have been completely fair to every team?
Forcing both the Bengals and Bills to take a tie isn't fair to the Ravens.
Forcing both the Bengals and Bills to take a loss wouldn't be fair to either the Bengals nor Bills.
Some have argued that moving the playoffs back another week such that Bengals-Bills could be played next week would be unfair because it would give all the other playoff teams an extra week of playoff prep.

[Bengalholic]

(01-06-2023, 03:27 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Where I will (somewhat) disagree with your assessment is that about the ONLY benefit to being a division winner vs a wildcard is hosting playoff games(s).
Now, the Bengals might end up having that taken away, so what's the benefit of being the "division winner" now vs being a wildcard team?
On the flip side, the Bengals now have to pick later in the draft because the draft order goes by winning percentage.

Unfortunately, there's no perfect solution to this outcome.
At least one team is going to get a potential disadvantage.
Had everything been determined solely on winning percentage, the NFL just potentially prevented the Ravens from winning the division and forced to be a wildcard.
This coin flip was an attempt to appease the Ravens (to an extent) since we do not know what the outcome of the Bengals-Bills game would have been.

But there was already a pretty easy solution...just follow the rules already established to deal with this circumstance.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-06-2023, 03:42 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: But there was already a pretty easy solution...just follow the rules already established to deal with this circumstance.

You mean win percentage?

I get that's been the rule, but it would still have upset the Ravens.

When I said "no perfect solution," I meant nothing that would appease every team.

[*jason*]

(01-06-2023, 12:44 AM)BengalFanInNJ Wrote: Just playing devil's advocate here:

We should have beaten the Steelers and Browns earlier this year. Had we done so, this game would have been a non-factor. The

As for losing the chance at resting the starters, well, they did get a rest. They didn't play a full game on Monday. Nobody got hurt. Now they are ready to go against Baltimore if they choose that route.

I agree with your first point...

The players did NOT get a chance to rest last week. They practiced, had meetings, game planned, showed up to the game, and witnessed a guy die on the field.

[Bengalholic]

(01-06-2023, 03:43 PM)ochocincos Wrote: You mean win percentage?

I get that's been the rule, but it would still have upset the Ravens.

When I said "no perfect solution," I meant nothing that would appease every team.

I agree there's no way to make everyone happy...which is why I think they should have just went with the previously established rule that was already agreed upon and on the books...instead of re-inventing the wheel on the fly in mid-drive.

I think Zac and Katie were exactly right on their takes, and I think the NFL took a step that was completely unnecessary. 

[*jason*]

(01-06-2023, 09:50 AM)pally Wrote: 1: Bengals will be the only division winner in the NFL without a guaranteed home game
2: a #3 seeded Bengals puts us in Buffalo for the 2nd round despite the direct seeding impact of the canceled game...why isn't this game decided on a coin toss or placed on a neutral field. No team will ever do the right thing ever again. They could have forced a Bills forfeit and didn't
3: Bengals receive the 2023 1st place schedule despite not being guaranteed any of the benefits. If Baltimore wins a coin toss then they should get the 1st place schedule that goes along with it.
4: The Brown family and Cincinnati community miss out on the MILLIONS of dollars of economic impact playoff games have. This is compounded by losing revenue from Monday's canceled game

Sound like a hosing, and Katie agrees.

[Frank Booth]

if the bengals have to accept not being able to grab the 1 seed, and having to play at buf or kc in the divisional round, then Baltimore should accept not having a potential home playoff game.

that one literally made no sense

[*rfaulk34*]

(01-06-2023, 02:12 PM)casear2727 Wrote: As a Buffalo fan Im sure they would love this.  Never have to play the Bengals in Cincy.  No one is giving any consideration to us possibly have winning that game.

The right thing to do is for McDermott to rest his starters. That does 2 things. Allows his starters to rest mentally and physically and give the Bengals a more legitimate shot at @ #2, since the previous game was cancelled. They could still win the game.

What do you think the chances of that are?

If i was a betting man, i'd say 0%.

Goes back to my #2 rule. No good deed goes unpunished. I'm thrilled like the next guy that Damar is well and will hopefully be able to resume his career, but the Bengals were not able to have a chance to clinch #2, due to deferring to the Bills and not pushing to have the game replayed. 

[Essex Johnson]

(01-06-2023, 03:42 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: But there was already a pretty easy solution...just follow the rules already established to deal with this circumstance.

The rules gave the Commission and those within his office the ability to do what they did.. and the owners voted to approve his recommendations... not saying I agree with it but this was unprecedented somewhat, during the pandemic decisions were made that were fluid also

[Nepa]

(01-06-2023, 03:43 PM)ochocincos Wrote: You mean win percentage?

I get that's been the rule, but it would still have upset the Ravens.

When I said "no perfect solution," I meant nothing that would appease every team.

Sure, the Ravens would have been upset if they went 11-6 and the Bengals went 11-5 and the Ravens didn't get a chance to get a home game against the Bengals in the playoffs.

The Chiefs fans would have been upset if they had to go to a neutral site, or flip a coin, if they ended up 13-4 and in 2nd place and the Bengals 12-4 and in 3rd place. 

See the common denominator? To totally different rules for similar situations (1/2 game difference, 16 games versus 17 games) and in each case to the detriment of the Bengals. So, they decided to appease the Chiefs and  the Ravens and shaft the Bengals by making different rules for the same situations involving the Bengals.

[fisherscatfan]

(01-06-2023, 12:19 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: They did not. 

1. The Bengals win the AFCN, win or lose due to a better win % in less games. Baltimore has no say in that. The Bengals benefit from playing and losing one less game. 

2. Buffalo has won one more game than the Bengals, in the exact same number of games played. If's and but's do not count here. The Bengals were ahead but did not win that game. It didn't happen. The fact of the matter is, they could have just as easily lost the game. 

What are you saying if the Bengals were one game better in the same number of games and the Bills were leading in a game that was cancelled. Let me tell you--you're saying "tough cookies" because we have the better record in the same number of games played. 

3. A coin flip only comes into play if Baltimore wins this Sunday and the results of this weeks games cause the Bengals and Ravens to be matched up in the WC round. A coin flip is fair because the Bengals benefitted from potentially losing one more game vs Bills. 

To wrap it up....the Bengals were not screwed in any way shape or form and if you think they were, you're not being genuine or honest. 

Well explain why there are rules in place that 100% are on point and very specifically address the situation regarding cancelled games, how to determine playoff seeds when there are differences in games played and how home teams are determined.

Just to say screw the policy, when the Bengals were likely aware of the rules when they agreed to not have Buffalo play the game, for no other reason is bullshit. If they were going to deal with the inequalities of Buff/KC and Cin regarding home field (which still violates policy) there was absolutely zero reason for the coin toss scenario.