Is Jonah the long term option at LT?

[casear2727]

(01-17-2023, 03:12 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: I felt that grabbing his fifth year option was a mistake then and I haven't seen anything since to change my mind.

I had kind of hoped that he would have moved to Guard but he's not strong enough and I've already mentioned that he's never been in top shape as a Bengal. No shock to me that he's injury prone.

They had no choice. The draft is a crapshoot.  And Jonah is plenty strong enough to play guard and would most likely be a very good one.

There is no opportunity for him here to do that now and he never would want to voluntarily. 

[puddycat]

He is next year. He was our 3rd best OL after Karras and Cappa. We can't keep blowing up the offensive line every year and expect them to get better. Volson will improve next year, but how much? Collin's ACL tear was not a complete tear so as of now we could start the preseason with all 5 starters. And it's a bad draft for OL generally.

[Brownshoe]

Jonah would be fine at LT but his health issue is what stops him from being a long term option.

[leonardfan40]

I’ve been a fan of keeping him at a reasonable contract for a while. I’m now at the point where I hope they start looking for replacements. He’s injured too much to sink a large amount of cap space into. Sucks, but it is what it is. He has shown real promise at times but if your body won’t let you play there’s nothing anyone can do about it.

[Sled21]

I've always liked Jonah, but to my untrained eye he seems this year to just lack the strength to play the position. Now whether that's because he's hobbled or not is the debate in my mind.

[CJD]

(01-17-2023, 01:58 AM)bfine32 Wrote: He does give up a lot of sacks, but he doesn't commit penalties. The most penalties he's ever committed in a year is 4. 

If he committed 5 fewer sacks this year but committed 5 more holding calls would you rank him higher?

Hmm, that's a tough one. Sacks are a loss of down which is brutal. If you give up a sack on first down, you're now 2nd and ~15 to 18 (unless it's one of those "sacks" where really Burrow just gets tackled before he gets back to the line of scrimmage and it's only 2nd and 12), whereas with a hold you are 1st and 20. With our offense, I think having more downs is probably better than having fewer yards to get the first down, so I'd probably take the 5 additional holding calls.

But I'd much prefer just not having many of either

[TecmoBengals]

I voted "No" while framing "long term option" as is Jonah the LT that is going to block for Burrow most of Burrow's career? I think we'll see a Jonah replacement whether through free agency or the draft. This season proved fruitful with signing OL in free agency so perhaps they'll continue to invest in OL during the FA window.

[SunsetBengal]

I don't see Jonah Williams as the long term answer at LT. Thus far in his career he's been often injured, and certainly that hasn't helped his development or stabilization of the position. Aside from that he's been just adequate when healthy, and though he has courageously played through the pain of injuries, his play level drops off significantly when he does.

The team took up the 5th year option, fully guaranteed, so he is going to be here at least another season. I say that the Bengals would be wise to draft an OT with thoughts of having him develop for a year, or perhaps play RT next season and see where things play out with Williams.

[impactplaya]

Not not at all. The Bengals need to find a LT that doesn't need a baby sitter beside him when he has
To face TJ Watt , Myles Garrett and Jason Owah
6 times a year
Jonah may not be penalized a whole lot but he gives
Up too many sacks which all it takes is One to end JBs season or shorten his career.
Tired of seeing him getting backed up into JBs platform
And JB has to turn into Fran Tarkington
For whatever reason he decided to drop weight
And it's hurting his ability to stonewall and overpower
Pass rushers

[*Synric*]

(01-17-2023, 10:12 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I don't see Jonah Williams as the long term answer at LT.  Thus far in his career he's been often injured, and certainly that hasn't helped his development or stabilization of the position.  Aside from that he's been just adequate when healthy, and though he has courageously played through the pain of injuries, his play level drops off significantly when he does.

The team took up the 5th year option, fully guaranteed, so he is going to be here at least another season.  I say that the Bengals would be wise to draft an OT with thoughts of having him develop for a year, or perhaps play RT next season and see where things play out with Williams.

Like I said about Jonah pre-draft his ceiling at tackle is going to be average to slightly above average. In a couple years someone will sign him play him at Left Guard and he will have the best seasons of his career.

The future at offensive tackle is ugly for the Bengals La'el Collins who just signed a 3 year deal just did not look right. Something was off about him all season so I'm more worried about the right side than the left in 2023.

As for the draft I would like them to go the safe route when drafting a tackle this year. A guy like Jaelyn Duncan is intriguing with his size and athletisim but it just never came all they way together mentally for him reminds me of Jackson Carman. Anton Harrison has a ton of natural speed and athleticism but he has a thin high leg frame so there is a good change he will struggle with functional strength and anchor. Darnell Wright Tennesee is probably the safest choice very experienced at both tackle spots but is a right tackle. He doesnt have elite athletisim and doesnt fit an outside or wide zone team but a brick wall in pass pro and a people mover for a gap scheme he fits.

[tms]

(01-17-2023, 10:33 AM)impactplaya Wrote: Not not at all. The Bengals need to find a LT that doesn't need a baby sitter beside him when he has
To face TJ Watt , Myles Garrett and Jason Owah

Just casually sneaking Oweh in there. Very nice lol

[Whatever]

(01-17-2023, 10:36 AM)Synric Wrote: Like I said about Jonah pre-draft his ceiling at tackle is going to be average to slightly above average. In a couple years someone will sign him play him at Left Guard and he will have the best seasons of his career.

The future at offensive tackle is ugly for the Bengals La'el Collins who just signed a 3 year deal just did not look right. Something was off about him all season so I'm more worried about the right side than the left in 2023.

As for the draft I would like them to go the safe route when drafting a tackle this year. A guy like Jaelyn Duncan is intriguing with his size and athletisim but it just never came all they way together mentally for him reminds me of Jackson Carman. Anton Harrison has a ton of natural speed and athleticism but he has a thin high leg frame so there is a good change he will struggle with functional strength and anchor. Darnell Wright Tennesee is probably the safest choice very experienced at both tackle spots but is a right tackle. He doesnt have elite athletisim and doesnt fit an outside or wide zone team but a brick wall in pass pro and a people mover for a gap scheme he fits.

It would be very difficult to squeeze an OT into the draft this year.  

At TE, Hurst and Sample are UFA's, with Wilcox a RFA.

At WR, Taylor and Irwin are UFA's with Tee and Boyd entering contract years.

At LB, Pratt is a UFA with Wilson, ADG, and Bailey entering contract years.  

Not to mention you have to start looking for an opportunity to replace Mixon and dump his contract before he hits the wall.

[Essex Johnson]

Unsure..Well it depends on next year.. his health has been a concern but what tackles do not get hurt, also the idea that we will have all Elite lineman is not realistic.. I would say you draft a tackle high in draft this year, see how he progresses next year plus does Williams stay healthy and perform well enough, then make a decision on a 2nd contract.

[*Synric*]

(01-17-2023, 11:50 AM)Whatever Wrote: It would be very difficult to squeeze an OT into the draft this year.  

At TE, Hurst and Sample are UFA's, with Wilcox a RFA.

At WR, Taylor and Irwin are UFA's with Tee and Boyd entering contract years.

At LB, Pratt is a UFA with Wilson, ADG, and Bailey entering contract years.  

Not to mention you have to start looking for an opportunity to replace Mixon and dump his contract before he hits the wall.

Yea the next few years are going to be big for the front office because they are going into a gamble of which of their core players come and go and who they can bring in the replace that core.


As to the Draft I'm all about drafting good players. Team's positional needs are only one factor of that equation.

[WeezyBengal]

This doesnt need to be talked about until mid/after next year, because he's going to be the LG on opening day whether we like it or not.

He still has another year to prove it. He's still young and has shown flashes of being dominant. The inconsistency is what kills me.

Regardless, I think they need to draft a tackle HIGH in the draft this year whether Jonah and LC are back or not. I can't see LC living out his contract here - it's structured in a way that makes him pretty easy to cut.

[higgy100]

(01-17-2023, 01:58 AM)bfine32 Wrote: He does give up a lot of sacks, but he doesn't commit penalties. The most penalties he's ever committed in a year is 4. 

If he committed 5 fewer sacks this year but committed 5 more holding calls would you rank him higher?

Would rather him get more penalties than sacks as that way his QB doesn't get killed.

[*bfine32*]

(01-17-2023, 01:10 PM)higgy100 Wrote: Would rather him get more penalties than sacks as that way his QB doesn't get killed.

That's fair, but you must understand, we have a QB who is on record stating "All sacks are not bad".

I feel if I were to ask Burrow the exact same question he'd say "Don't hold, give me a chance to make a play".

WTS, I'll concede "Borderline elite" may have been a bit of hyperbole. He's shown he can be "borderline very good".

The injuries are a valid concern, but lots of LTs get banged up. 

As far as long-term I feel it comes down to 2 things:

Price
What Burrow wants  

[Speedy Thomas]

(01-17-2023, 02:10 AM)Frank Booth Wrote: Jonah Williams. The Andy Dalton of left tackles.

I’d be fine with keeping him if he wants a middle of the road contract. He’s certainly not bad overall. He’s good, but has some issues with strength and arm length

I don't always appreciate your sarcasm but that's pretty good.

Adequate left tackles don't exactly grow on trees.  Jonah generally has been adequate.

As BF stated, price and what Joe wants will be considerations.  To those I will add the opinion of the medical staff.  Two knee dislocations in 4 years are troubling, to say the least.  If Jonah's knees are going to be a continuing issue I would rather move on.  I guess I'm unsure, leaning toward "no."

[*psychdoctor*]

Hell no.

[Frank Booth]

(01-17-2023, 02:35 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Hell no.

you're overly harsh. You reference sacks, but Jonah was still rated towards the top half of starting LT's in the league last season

couple injuries derailing his play this year, yea, it's a down year

but he's an average starting LT for the most part. Calling him one of the worst is way too big of an overreaction