PFF Simulation - No OT in the 1st

[OSUfan]

Let me start by saying I don't believe this will happen but I would like to see this mentality from the franchise. I believe that they have achieved the point of retaining a very strong core and that being more aggressive in using draft capital to continue to build the future core would serve them well. While I have been an advocate of a first round OT there is also the reality that the Bengals do seem committed at this point to Jonah Williams and La'el Collins and here is to hoping that health will raise their level of play from last season.

FA Re-signings:

1) Vonn Bell
2) Hayden Hurst
3) Germaine Pratt
4) Mitchell Wilcox
5) Tre Flowers
6) Trent Taylor
7) Max Sharping

Pre-Season Extensions:

1) Joe Burrow
2) Tee Higgins

Onto the draft -

RD. 1 - 28th Overall

The way the draft fell I was relatively confident that I could draft a target player while acquiring another high round draft selection. There were several offers on the table and I decided that a trade with Houston offered the team the best value. Houston used the 28th selection to draft T. Stevenson CB Miami. Then Bengals received the 33rd and 73rd overall selections.

Rd. 2 - 33rd Overall



Deonte Banks - CB - Maryland - 6'2" 205

Quote:“He’s one of my favorite cornerbacks I’ve studied. He’s going to be a really good pro.”

This was a quote from an area NFL scout. Banks has elite size and length for the position and is experienced in both man and zone coverage and has shown to excel in either. Has outstanding feet and hips and transitions from the backpedal seamlessly. This is not to say there are not aspects of the game he does not need to work on but he shows the attributes to be a high level NFL corner with a very high ceiling. I will be shocked if he is here for the Bengals but if he is then it is a steal.

Rd. 2 - 60th Overall

Again, the Bengals were in a position to have many trade options on the table as well as to be sitting in a position to draft targeted players that fit needs while acquiring selections that could help to add future core players high in the draft.  I opted to trade with KC giving them the 60th overall selection in return for the 63rd overall selection as well as receiving the 123rd overall in the 4th.

RD. 2 - 63rd Overall



Matthew Bergeron - OT - Syracuse - 6'5" 323

I had not been too high on Bergeron until I really started watching film on him and started to really dissect the tape. In the majority of bad snaps you see from Bergeron comes down to hand placement. Bergeron is a brutally strong tackle and when he gets his hands inside and latches onto the defender then he is in complete control of them and will move them wherever he wishes. He is a bulldozer in the run game and really moves well getting to the second level and picking up blocks. Hand placement is a coachable issue and I believe this is something Pollack can fix. Bergeron has been compared to Bitonio and could be an asset inside as well with his brute strength. I feel he a OT first but as well could have a high ceiling inside as well depending on the need of the team.

RD. 3 - 73rd Overall



Sydney Brown - S - Illinois - 6'0" 200

I do not see Brown being here as I feel he could be the best overall safety in this draft but has not had the hype of some others. If he is here then it is a no brainer selection. Adding Brown gives the Bengals the best young safety room in the NFL with Hill, Brown, and Andersen. Brown is strong in all facets of the game but his best attributes are football IQ and ball skills. Brown brings versatility and is not tied to a single scheme or position. He can play the outfield or support the run and is not a liability in man coverage. I really like this selection.

RD. 3 - 92nd Overall Selection



Tre'Vius Hodges-Tomlinson - CB - TCU - 5'9" 177

The size of Tomlinson I believe has to do with his stock falling a bit lately but this works out very well for the Bengals who have the chance to add a playmaker in the defensive backfield. Tomlinson was the winner of the Thorpe Award despite his stature. The coverage skills of Tomlinson are elite and he is the ultimate competitor and is an extremely physical defender given his size. He will push for time immediately and lockdown slot corner could be his future so why not learn from the best in the business...Mike Hilton.

Rd. 4 - 123rd Overall



Israel Abanikanda - RB - Pitt - 6'0" 215

The best RB in the draft that you have never heard of. If you don't like this kid it is because you have not watched film on him. He has all the makings of a future back in the NFL and he will not turn 21 until October of this year. Has the power to break tackles, shows good vision, and will flat run away from defenders in the open field. Keeps legs moving in traffic and does a good job of setting up and following blocks. I would not be shocked to eventually see this kid be the best back to come out of this draft class.

Watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2Yu_-67Z2I

RD. 4 - 131st Overall



Cam Jones - LB - Indiana - 6'3" 225

Jones brings high football IQ and leadership to the field and was a three time captain at IU. Jones is a former DB so he has understanding of coverage and brings an ideal frame to play LB at the NFL level. His game has improved every season but '22 was his true coming out party but it was unfortunately cut short with a foot injury. He is a strong tackler and brings real physicality in the box. Will be a great young addition to the LB room and will have two great backers to learn from in Wilson and Pratt.

Rd. 5 - 165th Overall



Durell Nchami - Edge - Maryland - 6'4" 255

Durell has struggled with injuries in his career at Maryland which is why he falls in this draft. When healthy he is a difference maker on the edge for a defense and the Michigan games is a good example. Michigan had their majority of offensive success on the downs that Durell was not on the field. Durell can put his hand on the ground or rush from the up position as well as is not a liability dropping in coverage. If he can stay healthy he is a game changer for a defense and will be in a great room with Hendrickson, Hubbard, and Ossai.

RD. 6 - 206th Overall



Jake Bobo - WR - UCLA - 6'5" 215

Bobo brings outstanding size and length to the position. Started his career at Duke before transferring to UCLA and coaching staffs point to his football IQ as a reason for his success. He has displayed great hands and body control and high points the ball in contested situations. While he is not a burner he is not slow either but is a strider. Watching film on him reminds me of Auden Tate with a bit more long speed. Will be a real threat in the red zone.

Rd. 7 - 248th Overall



Hunter Luepke - FB/RB - N. Dakota St. - 6'1" 236

Hunter will fill the void left by Perine in joining his former teammate Cordell Volson. Luepke was a Swiss Army knife for ND and does a bit of everything. He can lead block, pick up the blitz, catch out of the backfield, and run the ball. Again, a player with a high football IQ that should be a real asset in the RB room. I could see him playing a TE/H-back role in an emergency with his skillset.

53 man roster to follow:

[WVUHomer]

(02-25-2023, 06:56 PM)OSUfan Wrote: Let me start by saying I don't believe this will happen but I would like to see this mentality from the franchise. I believe that they have achieved the point of retaining a very strong core and that being more aggressive in using draft capital to continue to build the future core would serve them well. While I have been an advocate of a first round OT there is also the reality that the Bengals do seem committed at this point to Jonah Williams and La'el Collins and here is to hoping that health will raise their level of play from last season.

FA Re-signings:

1) Vonn Bell
2) Hayden Hurst
3) Germaine Pratt
4) Mitchell Wilcox
5) Tre Flowers
6) Trent Taylor
7) Max Sharping

Pre-Season Extensions:

1) Joe Burrow
2) Tee Higgins

Onto the draft -

RD. 1 - 28th Overall

The way the draft fell I was relatively confident that I could draft a target player while acquiring another high round draft selection. There were several offers on the table and I decided that a trade with Houston offered the team the best value. Houston used the 28th selection to draft T. Stevenson CB Miami. Then Bengals received the 33rd and 73rd overall selections.

Rd. 2 - 33rd Overall



Deonte Banks - CB - Maryland - 6'2" 205

This was a quote from an area NFL scout. Banks has elite size and length for the position and is experienced in both man and zone coverage and has shown to excel in either. Has outstanding feet and hips and transitions from the backpedal seamlessly. This is not to say there are not aspects of the game he does not need to work on but he shows the attributes to be a high level NFL corner with a very high ceiling. I will be shocked if he is here for the Bengals but if he is then it is a steal.

Rd. 2 - 60th Overall

Again, the Bengals were in a position to have many trade options on the table as well as to be sitting in a position to draft targeted players that fit needs while acquiring selections that could help to add future core players high in the draft.  I opted to trade with KC giving them the 60th overall selection in return for the 63rd overall selection as well as receiving the 123rd overall in the 4th.

RD. 2 - 63rd Overall



Matthew Bergeron - OT - Syracuse - 6'5" 323

I had not been too high on Bergeron until I really started watching film on him and started to really dissect the tape. In the majority of bad snaps you see from Bergeron comes down to hand placement. Bergeron is a brutally strong tackle and when he gets his hands inside and latches onto the defender then he is in complete control of them and will move them wherever he wishes. He is a bulldozer in the run game and really moves well getting to the second level and picking up blocks. Hand placement is a coachable issue and I believe this is something Pollack can fix. Bergeron has been compared to Bitonio and could be an asset inside as well with his brute strength. I feel he a OT first but as well could have a high ceiling inside as well depending on the need of the team.

RD. 3 - 73rd Overall



Sydney Brown - S - Illinois - 6'0" 200

I do not see Brown being here as I feel he could be the best overall safety in this draft but has not had the hype of some others. If he is here then it is a no brainer selection. Adding Brown gives the Bengals the best young safety room in the NFL with Hill, Brown, and Andersen. Brown is strong in all facets of the game but his best attributes are football IQ and ball skills. Brown brings versatility and is not tied to a single scheme or position. He can play the outfield or support the run and is not a liability in man coverage. I really like this selection.

RD. 3 - 92nd Overall Selection



Tre'Vius Hodges-Tomlinson - CB - TCU - 5'9" 177

The size of Tomlinson I believe has to do with his stock falling a bit lately but this works out very well for the Bengals who have the chance to add a playmaker in the defensive backfield. Tomlinson was the winner of the Thorpe Award despite his stature. The coverage skills of Tomlinson are elite and he is the ultimate competitor and is an extremely physical defender given his size. He will push for time immediately and lockdown slot corner could be his future so why not learn from the best in the business...Mike Hilton.

Rd. 4 - 123rd Overall



Israel Abanikanda - RB - Pitt - 6'0" 215

The best RB in the draft that you have never heard of. If you don't like this kid it is because you have not watched film on him. He has all the makings of a future back in the NFL and he will not turn 21 until October of this year. Has the power to break tackles, shows good vision, and will flat run away from defenders in the open field. Keeps legs moving in traffic and does a good job of setting up and following blocks. I would not be shocked to eventually see this kid be the best back to come out of this draft class.

Watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2Yu_-67Z2I

RD. 4 - 131st Overall



Cam Jones - LB - Indiana - 6'3" 225

Jones brings high football IQ and leadership to the field and was a three time captain at IU. Jones is a former DB so he has understanding of coverage and brings an ideal frame to play LB at the NFL level. His game has improved every season but '22 was his true coming out party but it was unfortunately cut short with a foot injury. He is a strong tackler and brings real physicality in the box. Will be a great young addition to the LB room and will have two great backers to learn from in Wilson and Pratt.

Rd. 5 - 165th Overall



Durell Nchami - Edge - Maryland - 6'4" 255

Durell has struggled with injuries in his career at Maryland which is he falls in this draft. When healthy he is a difference maker on the edge for a defense and the Michigan games is a good example. Michigan had their majority of offensive success on the downs that Durell was not on the field. Durell can put his hand on the ground or rush from the up position as well as is not a liability dropping in coverage. If he can stay healthy he is a game changer for a defense and will be in a great room with Hendrickson, Hubbard, and Ossai.

RD. 6 - 206th Overall



Jake Bobo - WR - UCLA - 6'5" 215

Bobo brings outstanding size and length to the position. Started his career at Duke before transferring to UCLA and coaching staffs point to his football IQ as a reason for his success. He has displayed great hands and body control and high points the ball in contested situations. While he is not a burner he is not slow either but is a strider. Watching film on him reminds me of Auden Tate with a bit more long speed. Will be a real threat in the red zone.

Rd. 7 - 248th Overall



Hunter Luepke - FB/RB - N. Dakota St. - 6'1" 236

Hunter will fill the void left by Perine in joining his former teammate Cordell Volson. Luepke was a Swiss Army knife for ND and does a bit of everything. He can lead block, pick up the blitz, catch out of the backfield, and run the ball. Again, a player with a high football IQ that should be a real asset in the RB room. I could see him playing a TE/H-back role in an emergency with his skillset.

53 man roster to follow:

Really like this draft. The only thing that doesn't make this perfect is the lack of TE. I know you pointed out Hunter and Hurst but that position would really be lacking. Instead of THT, I would take a some TE prospect but I understand getting a Hilton understudy.

[OSUfan]

(02-25-2023, 08:43 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: Really like this draft. The only thing that doesn't make this perfect is the lack of TE. I know you pointed out Hunter and Hurst but that position would really be lacking. Instead of THT, I would take a some TE prospect but I understand getting a Hilton understudy.

I wanted a TE as well but I wanted Durham but he wasn't available...   but seriously I intended on taking a TE but I never felt that what I had available was a better value than what was available at other positions. I was looking at Tyler Kraft in the range of Tomlinson but he went off the board right before I got to draft. At that point Tomlinson was seriously difficult to pass on.

If Hurst is brought back on a multi-year deal then I believe the Bengals are sitting in pretty good shape. Hurst is only 29 and he has been relatively lightly used while in the NFL. I feel like there is a good bit of tread left on the tires with him. There is also the fact that he fits this offense to a T and has a great rapport with Burrow and the staff. I also think Wilcox has made some important plays when he has been targeted and Asaisi is a really strong blocker.

I do feel that a player like Luepke could take some heat off the TE position if they were to use him in an H-back role like Minnesota and Green Bay used to do. I think this kid could be a very versatile weapon that would compliment the weapons we already have. You are talking about a FB that had over 800 yards from scrimmage.

[Whatever]

Good mock, overall. I like both Banks and Hodges-Tomlinson as CB's and I dig Abanikanda as a Day 3 RB prospect.

[OSUfan]

53 Man Roster:

Quarterback

Joe Burrow, Jake Browning

Running Back

Joe Mixon, Chris Evans, Israel Abanikanda, Hunter Luepke

Wide Receiver

Jamar Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd, Stanley Morgan, Trent Taylor, Jake Bobo (if they went light in another position then Trenton Irwin as well)

Tight End

Hayden Hurst, Mitchell Wilcox, Devin Asaisi

Tackle

Jonah Williams, La'el Collins, Matthew Bergeron, Jackson Carman, D'ante Smith

Guard

Cordell Volson, Alex Cappa, Max Sharping

Center

Ted Karra, Trey Hill

Defensive End

Trey Hendrickson, Sam Hubbard, Joseph Ossai, Durell Nchami, Jeff Gunter

Defensive Tackle

DJ Reader, BJ Hill, Zach Carter, Josh Tupuo, Cam Sample

Linebacker

Logan Wilson, Germaine Pratt, Akeem Davis-Gaither, Cam Jones, Joe Bachie

Cornerback

Chido Awuzie, Cam Taylor-Britt, Deonte Banks, Mike Hilton, Tre'Vius Hodges-Tomlinson, Tre Flowers

Safety

Vonn Bell, Dax Hill, Tycen Andersen, Sydney Brown

Specialists

Dru Chrisman, Evan McPherson, Cal Adomitis


On paper that looks like a mighty formidable roster to me.

[NUGDUKWE]

I hope we bring in an outside FA OL if we don't want to be locked into taking a OL with our 1st pick. Not only have we been much better finding talent not on the oline in later rds. But Collins is not gonna be ready for the beginning of the season and who knows if/when he will be ready next season. Also he was our worst pass protector last season when he was healthy so he just shouldn't be counted on at all. The Oline has essentially ended our last 2 seasons so I can't see putting more focus on the secondary than the protection. I would like the freedom especially in the 1st to take BPA but we have to be active in free agency which I'm not sure we're going to be this year.

[OSUfan]

(02-26-2023, 11:05 AM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I hope we bring in an outside FA OL if we don't want to be locked into taking a OL with our 1st pick. Not only have we been much better finding talent not on the oline in later rds. But Collins is not gonna be ready for the beginning of the season and who knows if/when he will be ready next season. Also he was our worst pass protector last season when he was healthy so he just shouldn't be counted on at all. The Oline has essentially ended our last 2 seasons so I can't see putting more focus on the secondary than the protection. I would like the freedom especially in the 1st to take BPA but we have to be active in free agency which I'm not sure we're going to be this year.

FA OT or not I do not believe they are locked into OL with the first pick. Like it or not they seem pretty committed to Williams and Collins. IF Collins is not ready to begin the season then I would have to think that the Bengals will be taking a hard look at both Carman and Adeniji to take the RT position. I personally feel that if Carman was comfortable playing the right side that he could be a franchise RT.

For that matter with the way Carman looked at LT in the playoffs maybe they look at making him the LT and moving Jonah to RT.

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-26-2023, 01:12 PM)OSUfan Wrote: FA OT or not I do not believe they are locked into OL with the first pick. Like it or not they seem pretty committed to Williams and Collins. IF Collins is not ready to begin the season then I would have to think that the Bengals will be taking a hard look at both Carman and Adeniji to take the RT position. I personally feel that if Carman was comfortable playing the right side that he could be a franchise RT.

For that matter with the way Carman looked at LT in the playoffs maybe they look at making him the LT and moving Jonah to RT.

Well I hope your wrong. I have a feeling Collins is done and even if he's not this is his only year left on the deal. Jonah moving to the right side or Carman would be a question mark. So this year taught us we need depth on top of needing people going forward. We just haven't had luck drafting lineman recently. So I would prefer picking up OL in free agency as we can go off actual production. But if we don't than I think we need to draft a guy early. The defense is most likely gonna take a hit and get worse this year even if marginally. So the offense needs to be better. The only way to do that is by protecting #9 in my opinion. 

I would prefer to draft BPA. But I just don't think that's where we've found ourselves. Free agency will clear some of this up in my opinion.

[OSUfan]

(02-26-2023, 02:04 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Well I hope your wrong. I have a feeling Collins is done and even if he's not this is his only year left on the deal. Jonah moving to the right side or Carman would be a question mark. So this year taught us we need depth on top of needing people going forward. We just haven't had luck drafting lineman recently. So I would prefer picking up OL in free agency as we can go off actual production. But if we don't than I think we need to draft a guy early. The defense is most likely gonna take a hit and get worse this year even if marginally. So the offense needs to be better. The only way to do that is by protecting #9 in my opinion. 

I would prefer to draft BPA. But I just don't think that's where we've found ourselves. Free agency will clear some of this up in my opinion.

Why is the defense going to take a hit?

[pulses]

(02-25-2023, 09:41 PM)OSUfan Wrote: 53 Man Roster:

Quarterback

Joe Burrow, Jake Browning

Running Back

Joe Mixon, Chris Evans, Israel Abanikanda, Hunter Luepke

Wide Receiver

Jamar Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd, Stanley Morgan, Trent Taylor, Jake Bobo (if they went light in another position then Trenton Irwin as well)

Tight End

Hayden Hurst, Mitchell Wilcox, Devin Asaisi

Tackle

Jonah Williams, La'el Collins, Matthew Bergeron, Jackson Carman, D'ante Smith

Guard

Cordell Volson, Alex Cappa, Max Sharping

Center

Ted Karra, Trey Hill

Defensive End

Trey Hendrickson, Sam Hubbard, Joseph Ossai, Durell Nchami, Jeff Gunter

Defensive Tackle

DJ Reader, BJ Hill, Zach Carter, Josh Tupuo, Cam Sample

Linebacker

Logan Wilson, Germaine Pratt, Akeem Davis-Gaither, Cam Jones, Joe Bachie

Cornerback

Chido Awuzie, Cam Taylor-Britt, Deonte Banks, Mike Hilton, Tre'Vius Hodges-Tomlinson, Tre Flowers

Safety

Vonn Bell, Dax Hill, Tycen Andersen, Sydney Brown

Specialists

Dru Chrisman, Evan McPherson, Cal Adomitis


On paper that looks like a mighty formidable roster to me.

 Don't sleep on Lassiter I think he has a real chance to be the next slot guy when boyd is gone (sad but true).

[*ochocincos*]

(02-26-2023, 01:12 PM)OSUfan Wrote: FA OT or not I do not believe they are locked into OL with the first pick. Like it or not they seem pretty committed to Williams and Collins. IF Collins is not ready to begin the season then I would have to think that the Bengals will be taking a hard look at both Carman and Adeniji to take the RT position. I personally feel that if Carman was comfortable playing the right side that he could be a franchise RT.

For that matter with the way Carman looked at LT in the playoffs maybe they look at making him the LT and moving Jonah to RT.

I know you aren't necessarily advocating for Adeniji to stay and probably just mentioned him because he's technically still on the roster, but I really hope he is not on the roster come the start of the season.
The dude has been in the league now and has allowed a ridiculous number of sacks over his 3-year career.

2020: 150 pass block snaps - 4 sacks, 12 total pressures
2021: 501 pass block snaps - 9 sacks, 37 total pressures
2022: 259 pass block snaps - 4 sacks, 23 total pressures
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Total PB snaps = 910
Total sacks  = 17
Total pressures = 72

That's entirely too much pressure allowed in that number of snaps.


The dude is 25 years old and has been in the league 3 full years now.
The likelihood of a big jump in ability is miniscule at this point.
He likely is who he is at this point and should not be on the team.

[OSUfan]

(02-28-2023, 03:17 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I know you aren't necessarily advocating for Adeniji to stay and probably just mentioned him because he's technically still on the roster, but I really hope he is not on the roster come the start of the season.
The dude has been in the league now and has allowed a ridiculous number of sacks over his 3-year career.

2020: 150 pass block snaps - 4 sacks, 12 total pressures
2021: 501 pass block snaps - 9 sacks, 37 total pressures
2022: 259 pass block snaps - 4 sacks, 23 total pressures
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Total PB snaps = 910
Total sacks  = 17
Total pressures = 72

That's entirely too much pressure allowed in that number of snaps.


The dude is 25 years old and has been in the league 3 full years now.
The likelihood of a big jump in ability is miniscule at this point.
He likely is who he is at this point and should not be on the team.

Not advocating at all but with these breakdowns I would like to see the difference in playing OG vs OT. The eyes test says that he played far better at OT than he did inside but I could be wrong. I feel the same with Carman and being moved inside. I believe there are those that feel that because you can play OT that the move inside should be seamless when in fact they are two very different animals that require completely different skill sets.

[*ochocincos*]

(02-28-2023, 05:56 PM)OSUfan Wrote: Not advocating at all but with these breakdowns I would like to see the difference in playing OG vs OT. The eyes test says that he played far better at OT than he did inside but I could be wrong. I feel the same with Carman and being moved inside. I believe there are those that feel that because you can play OT that the move inside should be seamless when in fact they are two very different animals that require completely different skill sets.

Here are his breakdowns by season:
2020: All outside
2021: All inside
2022: All outside

OT - 409 pass block snaps, allowing 8 sacks, 35 pressures
OG - 501 pass block snaps, allowing 9 sacks, 37 total pressures

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-27-2023, 08:05 PM)OSUfan Wrote: Why is the defense going to take a hit?

Losing Bates alone is gonna hurt the secondary. I just don't think they're is any way around that. Then if we also lose Pratt I think that will also hurt and who knows about Bell I think we assume he'll be back but who knows.

[OSUfan]

(02-28-2023, 06:12 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Here are his breakdowns by season:
2020: All outside
2021: All inside
2022: All outside

OT - 409 pass block snaps, allowing 8 sacks, 35 pressures
OG - 501 pass block snaps, allowing 9 sacks, 37 total pressures

Ouch....still not very good at all!

[OSUfan]

(02-28-2023, 07:53 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Losing Bates alone is gonna hurt the secondary. I just don't think they're is any way around that. Then if we also lose Pratt I think that will also hurt and who knows about Bell I think we assume he'll be back but who knows.

I honestly believe Bell and Pratt will be back to play for Lou. If he had left I may have questioned it. I think the defense will be just fine with Dax taking over for Bates. When Bates was sitting out Hill looked outstanding for a rookie when he was able to concentrate on playing just safety. I believe that Dax comes as advertised and will be as good if not better than Bates.

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-28-2023, 08:08 PM)OSUfan Wrote: I honestly believe Bell and Pratt will be back to play for Lou. If he had left I may have questioned it. I think the defense will be just fine with Dax taking over for Bates. When Bates was sitting out Hill looked outstanding for a rookie when he was able to concentrate on playing just safety. I believe that Dax comes as advertised and will be as good if not better than Bates.

All that can work out and we can be better. But for me it's too many questions and I have to assume we will be worse on defense even if marginally. I'm hopeful for Dax. But I'd feel a lot better if he played more safety in college. I just think Bates did more than a lot of us realize to help the defense. I don't think Dax can equal that at least in his first year of starting.