Foster Moreau Visits

[casear2727]

(03-21-2023, 03:36 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: I am kind of worried our Offensive scheme might be deterring the TE's from signing here in Cincy. Hurst had a 8 yard per catch average last year because he was used as a checkdown tons 5-yard routes and sent 15 to 20 yards down the field very little. I know Hurst got paid after a year here but Foster's yard per catch was at 12 which is fairly high and if he drops to 8 yards per catch other teams could see that as production falling off. Zac talking to these TE and assuring them that they will get less checkdowns and more passes downfield could go a long way to getting one of these TE signed. 

Two TE's considered very much below average pocketed $46M in contract dollars after a season with Burrow.... very doubtful scheme is this issue. 

[casear2727]

(03-21-2023, 04:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: A second visit usually means the guy will sign. Hope to see Foster Moreau signed today. Good pass blocker and pass catcher.

Could get better at run blocking but hey he can work on that.

Has the 2nd visit been verified?

[Nepa]

(03-21-2023, 07:57 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Has the 2nd visit been verified?

That's my question. I haven't found anything online myself.

[Whacked]

I don’t know much about Foster.

Will someone please share a fair/objective comparative analysis between Hurst and him?

Thanks in advance.

[basballguy]

(03-21-2023, 08:15 PM)Whacked Wrote: I don’t know much about Foster.

Will someone please share a fair/objective comparative analysis between Hurst and him?

Thanks in advance.

Moreau and Hurst have caught the same amount of TDs from Burrow.  

[BengalsBong]

(03-21-2023, 07:55 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Two TE's considered very much below average pocketed $46M in contract dollars after a season with Burrow.... very doubtful scheme is this issue. 

Way too many checkdowns at 5 yards you got to chunk play them or you will never get the other team out of cover two. That is why we played against cover two all year last year the RB yards per carry and Joe Mxon 7.4 yards per catch and Hurst 8 yards per catch. All underneath stuff that Defensive coordinators will give us all year long.

[Au165]

(03-21-2023, 08:23 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: Way too many checkdowns at 5 yards you got to chunk play them or you will never get the other team out of cover two. That is why we played against cover two all year last year the RB yards per carry and Joe Mxon 7.4 yards per catch and Hurst 8 yards per catch. All underneath stuff that Defensive coordinators will give us all year long.

This is literally the exact opposite of how this works. People stay in cover two to keep you out of creating chunk plays, this is why teams went to it two years ago against the chiefs. You beat cover two by being patient and taking the underneath routes. Let me repeat that again, a team with the most dynamic TE and WR in the league were relegated to taking the underneath routes and checking to runs to get teams out of cover 2.

If they give it to you all day then you take it all day, that is how you beat cover 2. It works because teams get impatient and want the big play and that is what they are banking on. The best way to get a team out of it is to efficiently run on a lite box but we have not done that well. That said Burrow after the first game was one of the best QBs in the league against it so it’s all a moot point.

The TE is not the answer, but the real point here is there isn’t really a problem to be the answer for.

[Soonerpeace]

(03-21-2023, 08:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: This is literally the exact opposite of how this works. People stay in cover two to keep you out of creating chunk plays, this is why teams went to it two years ago against the chiefs. You beat cover two by being patient and taking the underneath routes. Let me repeat that again, a team with the most dynamic TE and WR in the league were relegated to taking the underneath routes and checking to runs to get teams out of cover 2.

If they give it to you all day then you take it all day, that is how you beat cover 2. It works because teams get impatient and want the big play and that is what they are banking on. The best way to get a team out of it is to efficiently run on a lite box but we have not done that well. That said Burrow after the first game was one of the best QBs in the league against it so it’s all a moot point.

The TE is not the answer, but the real point here is there isn’t really a problem to be the answer for.

Oh my thank you thank you thank you. So well said. We were running the ball better before the injuries. But it still needs a lot of work. Of course Mixon went off against Carolina. And I’d encourage anyone who has it recorded to go watch his performance. He had room to run.

So he took spinach for these games?

14-96 vs Clev
22-153 Carolina
14-78 Ravens

Mixon struggled the first 4 games. Coincidentally so did the line. I was at the Jets game when the 4th quarter drive with Perine was successful. The blocking was there. Mixon did better through the middle of the season. He also took spinach for the Bills game 20-105 LOL. It’s why they aren’t cutting him or shopping him. He’s not w/o his drawbacks but he can still carry the rock.

[BengalsBong]

(03-21-2023, 08:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: This is literally the exact opposite of how this works. People stay in cover two to keep you out of creating chunk plays, this is why teams went to it two years ago against the chiefs. You beat cover two by being patient and taking the underneath routes. Let me repeat that again, a team with the most dynamic TE and WR in the league were relegated to taking the underneath routes and checking to runs to get teams out of cover 2.

If they give it to you all day then you take it all day, that is how you beat cover 2. It works because teams get impatient and want the big play and that is what they are banking on. The best way to get a team out of it is to efficiently run on a lite box but we have not done that well. That said Burrow after the first game was one of the best QBs in the league against it so it’s all a moot point.

The TE is not the answer, but the real point here is there isn’t really a problem to be the answer for.

Let me repeat this again for the people hard of hearing in the back. You attack cover two with TE, RB and Slot WR. The cover two is designed to double team your outside WR's. Tyler Boyd was averaging 15 yards per catch at the start of the season the highest he ever had. You can get chunk plays by sending your outside WR deep drawing coverage downfield and attacking underneath but still 15 yards downfield which is a chunk play. Your Slot TE and RB can all get 10-to-20-yard chunk plays while attacking cover two. You seem to be under the impression chunk plays are 40 yards downfield which is untrue. We was using our RB and TE mostly as 5-yard checkdowns and not pushing the ball downfield against cover two. We also threw a ton of behind the line of scrimmage throws and screens which got blew up 80% of the time and put us in 2nd and 12 or 3rd and 10. Bad scheme attacking too short and making us have 10, 12, 15 play drives. Joe Burrow is one of the most accurate QB in the NFL and you want him to throw checkdowns all year negating his strength. 20 yard throws are perfect for Joe to tear up cover two the intermediate routes playing to his strengths and attacking {again for those in the cheap seats} with TE, RB and the slot WR getting 15-to-20-yard chunk plays.

You would like to get the other team out of cover two so we can go downfield to Chase and Higgins more right? Since we plan on paying these guys a ton of cash well get chunk plays underneath to do it.

[casear2727]

(03-21-2023, 09:18 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: Let me repeat this again for the people hard of hearing in the back. You attack cover two with TE, RB and Slot WR. The cover two is designed to double team your outside WR's.

This is absolutely incorrect.  The Cover 2 is NOT designed for double teams.  The majority of Cover 2 defenses ran in the NFL incorporate a 5 under zone concept.  Double teams are absolutely doable but not necessarily the reason for the Cover 2.  This is a very silly and inaccurate comment. 

[BengalsBong]

(03-21-2023, 09:26 PM)casear2727 Wrote: This is absolutely incorrect.  The Cover 2 is NOT designed for double teams.  The majority of Cover 2 defenses ran in the NFL incorporate a 5 under zone concept.  Double teams are absolutely doable but not necessarily the reason for the Cover 2.  This is a very silly and inaccurate comment. 

They are designed to take away your deep threats which in our case in Chase and Higgins. Cover two takes 4 defenders both safeties and corners which is basically a double team.

[Soonerpeace]

(03-21-2023, 09:26 PM)casear2727 Wrote: This is absolutely incorrect.  The Cover 2 is NOT designed for double teams.  The majority of Cover 2 defenses ran in the NFL incorporate a 5 under zone concept.  Double teams are absolutely doable but not necessarily the reason for the Cover 2.  This is a very silly and inaccurate comment. 

What he’s not getting is that it’s a deep cover 2. It’s also drop 8. So his 10/15 yard chunk plays aren’t there either. You have to be able to run the ball on a deep cover 2.

[Soonerpeace]

(03-21-2023, 07:48 PM)casear2727 Wrote: We only have 2 boundary CBs and one of them is coming off an ACL on the last year of his contract. Chido may be more questionable than Bates going into his last season... I can definitely see them picking one.  I wouldn't be thrilled, but assuming who is on the board I would reserve judgement. 

In round 1? With Awouzie, CTB, and Apple?

[samhain]

(03-21-2023, 09:50 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: In round 1? With Awouzie, CTB, and Apple?

Apple is not on the team.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-21-2023, 08:15 PM)Whacked Wrote: I don’t know much about Foster.

Will someone please share a fair/objective comparative analysis between Hurst and him?

Thanks in advance.

Moreau catches balls deeper than Hurst. Not bashing Hurst, but he didn't stretch the field. He was a catch it short and play with effort guy.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-21-2023, 08:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: This is literally the exact opposite of how this works. People stay in cover two to keep you out of creating chunk plays, this is why teams went to it two years ago against the chiefs. You beat cover two by being patient and taking the underneath routes. Let me repeat that again, a team with the most dynamic TE and WR in the league were relegated to taking the underneath routes and checking to runs to get teams out of cover 2.

If they give it to you all day then you take it all day, that is how you beat cover 2. It works because teams get impatient and want the big play and that is what they are banking on. The best way to get a team out of it is to efficiently run on a lite box but we have not done that well. That said Burrow after the first game was one of the best QBs in the league against it so it’s all a moot point.

The TE is not the answer, but the real point here is there isn’t really a problem to be the answer for.

Yes. It's when you force it and make mistakes that you lose.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-21-2023, 09:50 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: In round 1? With Awouzie, CTB, and Apple?

Isn't Chido a free agent too. In mocks, I have this freak cb from Maryland keep falling to me.

[Mgbrown66]

No, chido is not FA. But who knows if he will be ready game 1 after injury.

[Bronxbengal]

(03-21-2023, 09:18 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: Let me repeat this again for the people hard of hearing in the back. You attack cover two with TE, RB and Slot WR. The cover two is designed to double team your outside WR's. Tyler Boyd was averaging 15 yards per catch at the start of the season the highest he ever had. You can get chunk plays by sending your outside WR deep drawing coverage downfield and attacking underneath but still 15 yards downfield which is a chunk play. Your Slot TE and RB can all get 10-to-20-yard chunk plays while attacking cover two. You seem to be under the impression chunk plays are 40 yards downfield which is untrue. We was using our RB and TE mostly as 5-yard checkdowns and not pushing the ball downfield against cover two. We also threw a ton of behind the line of scrimmage throws and screens which got blew up 80% of the time and put us in 2nd and 12 or 3rd and 10. Bad scheme attacking too short and making us have 10, 12, 15 play drives. Joe Burrow is one of the most accurate QB in the NFL and you want him to throw checkdowns all year negating his strength. 20 yard throws are perfect for Joe to tear up cover two the intermediate routes playing to his strengths and attacking {again for those in the cheap seats} with TE, RB and the slot WR getting 15-to-20-yard chunk plays.

You would like to get the other team out of cover two so we can go downfield to Chase and Higgins more right? Since we plan on paying these guys a ton of cash well get chunk plays underneath to do it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Soonerpeace]

(03-21-2023, 09:55 PM)samhain Wrote: Apple is not on the team.

I think he’s back. Probably needs to be careful and not play hardball.