Murphy

[KillerGoose]

(08-27-2023, 10:34 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: He seemed like a bit of a reach too. Way too early to know how he'll be though.

I think he was great value there, but that value really only matters on draft day. Afterwards, it all depends on how you pan out. Here is the 2023 consensus big board. Murphy was the consensus #17 prospect, so getting him late first was great. 

[WeezyBengal]

The next 3 years of this dude are going to be miserable if he doesn't break out. Half the fans clamoring that he's awesome, half of them clamoring that he stinks and is a bust. Carman 2.0.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(08-28-2023, 10:15 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: I think he was great value there, but that value really only matters on draft day. Afterwards, it all depends on how you pan out. Here is the 2023 consensus big board. Murphy was the consensus #17 prospect, so getting him late first was great. 

You can have high expectations for top 10 picks but pretty much after that, it's guys that have potential but haven't put it together yet, sometimes you get lucky and they flash and others just need some time. 

I hope we don't pick again in the top 10, stick to picking 30+ from here on for a few years and this is the type we will end up getting alot of.

[WeezyBengal]

(08-28-2023, 10:15 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: I think he was great value there, but that value really only matters on draft day. Afterwards, it all depends on how you pan out. Here is the 2023 consensus big board. Murphy was the consensus #17 prospect, so getting him late first was great. 

If he was the #17 prospect, it kind of makes you wonder why so many other teams passed on him. 

[Mike M (the other one)]

(08-28-2023, 10:22 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: If he was the #17 prospect, it kind of makes you wonder why so many other teams passed on him. 

Need.
Several WR, 1 TE, OL, CB went before him.

[KillerGoose]

(08-28-2023, 10:22 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: If he was the #17 prospect, it kind of makes you wonder why so many other teams passed on him. 

It could also be a disconnect from draft pundits and NFL teams. He could have been a #17 guy for draft pundits but maybe as a consensus for NFL teams he was lower down the list. Also could be need, or some combination of the two. 

[KillerGoose]

(08-28-2023, 10:21 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: You can have high expectations for top 10 picks but pretty much after that, it's guys that have potential but haven't put it together yet, sometimes you get lucky and they flash and others just need some time. 

I hope we don't pick again in the top 10, stick to picking 30+ from here on for a few years and this is the type we will end up getting alot of.

I agree. I am not worried about him right now. If we get to mid-year next year and he is still struggling for playing time and being ineffective, I am going to be looking at the pitchfork in the corner. 

[Mike M (the other one)]

(08-28-2023, 10:28 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: It could also be a disconnect from draft pundits and NFL teams. He could have been a #17 guy for draft pundits but maybe as a consensus for NFL teams he was lower down the list. Also could be need, or some combination of the two. 

That too, but it certainly didn't help him that there was a run on Wr's then CB's before our pick came up. I was hoping for a CB but the ones i wanted were gone other than Turner that i felt we could get in the 2nd.

[Garrus]

Should probably wait at least a few years to start calling him a bust. Let the dude learn and grow a bit first.

[*bfine32*]

Well, it appears Myles Murphy loves him some Myles Murphy:

Quote:I know everyone knows I know I got all the tools to be a great pass rusher it's just a matter of honing everything and putting everything together and it's going to click, and it's going to show up very, very soon."

https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/allbengals-insiders-plus/myles-murphy-dives-into-biggest-lesson-from-debut-preseason-matter-of-honing-everything

But he's right. All the physical tools are there, he just needs Trey Hendrickson's mentality to rub off on him and he can be great.

[Luvnit2]

(08-28-2023, 10:22 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: If he was the #17 prospect, it kind of makes you wonder why so many other teams passed on him. 

Could be team needs, could be all teams missed like what happened with Tom Brady. I think we may have a gem with our 6th round pick, lots of teams passed on him.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

Personally, I’m waiting until halftime of Week 1 before I declare him a bust or not.

[Luvnit2]

(08-28-2023, 01:16 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Personally, I’m waiting until halftime of Week 1 before I declare him a bust or not.

Yes, all rookies drafted in late 1st round round should be superstars by game 1 or bust. I am sure all of the fans in this forum were the best at their job witshin a couple of months on the job. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(08-28-2023, 12:19 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Huh? Every draft publication I saw had Murphy late 1st round...
Not sure why everyone is freaking out about Murphy's preseason, he's young and learning the ropes from one of the best. He was going to be part of a rotation.
Relax, he will be ready when it's his turn.

I never expected Murphy to fall all the way to 28, hence why I never mentioned him prior to us drafting him.

To say he was a reach is a new one I had never heard. I heard getting MM at 28 was a steal prior to him just not standing out in PS.

I think you are correct Wedge. He will be ready when we need him to be.

(08-28-2023, 10:11 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Not only technique. but adjusting to the whole NFL period. The speed, the freedom and the need for self discipline, etc. It takes some players a year or so around veterans to get it.

Most players it takes a year or two to adapt to the NFL. 

It is actually extremely rare for a rookie to come in and dominate like say Micah Parsons. Actually he might be the only Defender
to come in as a rookie and look like a legend. It takes time for everyone else and it is no surprise MM is not a dominant pass rusher
early, that wasn't expected by anyone when talking about him. He could grow into a dominant player though with his great upside.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(08-28-2023, 11:21 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Well, it appears  Myles Murphy loves him some Myles Murphy:
https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/allbengals-insiders-plus/myles-murphy-dives-into-biggest-lesson-from-debut-preseason-matter-of-honing-everything

But he's right. All the physical tools are there, he just needs Trey Hendrickson's mentality to rub off on him and he can be great.

Love his confidence. That is a start.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(08-28-2023, 01:32 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Love his confidence. That is a start.

Whether you you believe you can or you can’t, you’re right.

[*ochocincos*]

(08-28-2023, 10:20 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: The next 3 years of this dude are going to be miserable if he doesn't break out. Half the fans clamoring that he's awesome, half of them clamoring that he stinks and is a bust. Carman 2.0.

A good question worth asking - what's considered "breaking out" for a late-1st round pass rusher?

Is something like what Sam Hubbard or Carlos Dunlap have put up (6-8 sacks a year) considered ok?

[Garrus]

(08-28-2023, 03:40 PM)ochocincos Wrote: A good question worth asking - what's considered "breaking out" for a late-1st round pass rusher?

Is something like what Sam Hubbard or Carlos Dunlap have put up (6-8 sacks a year) considered ok?

I would be happy if he produced that much a year, would be very consistent. Would make him one of the better pass rushers in the NFL

[Housh]

Not surprised casual fans don’t care about run support from a 1st round DE but seeing all this disappointment in him in this thread is just wrong imo.



Dude made 3 run stops i think against Atlanta and ppl
Are saying he was invisible.

Yeah he didn’t have a splash play but the one play I’d show anyone would be the option play where he came from across the formation to tackle a guy.
It was a 4-5yard gain but it was still a great play because a DE who was less athletic wouldn’t have caught up to the back to even make the tackle so i personally count that as a solid play. Dude seemed very good with instincts in guarding the run.


Issue with Murphy not having pass rush highlights is when you take a DE in the 1st round you are expecting him to be a pass rusher first and run defender second.


Even if you told me Day 1 Murphy would be Sam Hubbard by year 3, I’d still say that’s poor value in round 1. We definitely reached for this kid and no amount of Bengal coach deflecting will make me believe otherwise. Do i think he makes it to our pick in the second round? No. But 1st round was a bit high for him imo.


But the ppl that actually scout as their job said he was a mid-first round talent so I’ll trust Zac ok this one.

[Housh]

(08-28-2023, 04:26 PM)Housh Wrote: Not surprised casual fans don’t care about run support from a 1st round DE but seeing all this disappointment in him in this thread is just wrong imo.



Dude made 3 run stops i think against Atlanta and ppl
Are saying he was invisible.

Yeah he didn’t have a splash play but the one play I’d show anyone would be the option play where he came from across the formation to tackle a guy.
It was a 4-5yard gain but it was still a great play because a DE who was less athletic wouldn’t have caught up to the back to even make the tackle so i personally count that as a solid play. Dude seemed very good with instincts in guarding the run.


Issue with Murphy not having pass rush highlights is when you take a DE in the 1st round you are expecting him to be a pass rusher first and run defender second.


Even if you told me Day 1 Murphy would be Sam Hubbard by year 3, I’d still say that’s poor value in round 1. We definitely reached for this kid and no amount of Bengal coach deflecting will make me believe otherwise. Do i think he makes it to our pick in the second round? No. But 1st round was a bit high for him imo.


But the ppl that actually scout as their job said he was a mid-first round talent so I’ll trust Zac ok this one.

Just for reference. Hubbard played 77% of the snaps on D last year. Cam Sample played 40% of the snaps.

So Sam and Cam really held down that end position opposite Trey. Ossai to my knowledge mainly spelled Trey but was lined up outside instead of Hubbard a lot. The DT minutes are likely already set too. Reader and BJ getting the majority of snaps with Josh Tuopu and Jay Tufele spelling them.


So Murphy’s first real shot at consistent minutes was coming out in camp and busting Sample or Tufele/Tuopu’s asses and taking their minutes. He has not done that.

So i don’t really see any snaps for him consistently unless Ossai is hurt. So if Ossai isn’t ready for Cleveland, Murphy may get a game where he’s the backup pass rusher for Trey and the relief for Hubbard if we decide to slide Sample in the Ossai role.


He may be in a situation where that Cleveland game could get him minutes or could basically shelf him at the bottom of the depth chart.





Having a guaranteed spot in the NFL is so hard. It’s made to look easy by us and the media but just imagine. A guy of Murphys physical talent, may not even play alot because we have so much depth