Why Are The Bengals So Reluctant To Replace Coaches?

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 02:44 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Well you are woefully ill informed. Zac and Duke equally involved in the draft.

That's pure BS because Tobin is involved with scouting for the draft right now while Taylor is busy coaching the team.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 03:17 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: He has a say, but he's not in charge of it. If Tobin and Katie feel strongly about that player and other people in their scouting department disagrees with Taylor then I would bet they would still draft him. Just like we all knew Marvin didn't want John Ross. Well, it didn't work out but we can see that they do go over the coach.

You said it was all Duke and now with everybody telling you you are wrong you are back pedaling. Duke & Zac get along great and you tried to imply Zac has little involvement in the roster and that’s bogus crap. He’s had the most to do with it.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 02:52 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Amazing how success works better with a good QB. Belichick under .500 w/o Brady. Saban a failure at the Dolphins w/o a QB. Payton w/o Brees. Jimmy Johnson before Troy Aikman was horrible. Got the #1 pick … sound familiar? Good grief I can go on and on. Such a tired take.

How was the culture under Belichick, Saban, Payton, and Johnson without an elite QB? Pretty much the same as under Zac Taylor with Andy Dalton.  Zac Taylor had less success with Andy Dalton than Marvin Lewis despite more support from the front office than Lewis ever enjoyed.

[casear2727]

(10-03-2023, 03:17 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: He has a say, but he's not in charge of it. If Tobin and Katie feel strongly about that player and other people in their scouting department disagrees with Taylor then I would bet they would still draft him. Just like we all knew Marvin didn't want John Ross. Well, it didn't work out but we can see that they do go over the coach.

I believe Katie's only involvement regarding a drafted player would be in the case of red flags.  Zac and Lou have earned enough credibility to say no to a potential draft pick without a doubt.

Even though Duke and his staff do 75% of the heavy pulling of the process.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 03:47 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: You said it was all Duke and now with everybody telling you you are wrong you are back pedaling.

Everybody?  Dafuq?

Quote:Duke & Zac get along great and you tried to imply Zac has little involvement in the roster and that’s bogus crap.

No, he didn't. Stop making BS up to defend your boy from Oklahoma.

Quote:He's had the most to do with it.

BS.

Taylor isn't responsible for re-signing players.  You have even admitted so.

Taylor isn't responsible for ownership spending more money on the scouting department.

Taylor isn't responsible for ownership spending more money on free agents.  Taylor isn't responsible for scouting free agents.

Taylor isn't responsible for ownership being more active in trades.

Taylor is involved, but he isn't the one responsible for allowing Taylor, Tobin, the scouts, and the coaches to do their jobs. And if you had been here longer than 2 minutes you would understand the change in leadership at the very top of the organization has the most to do with it.  

It's like the story about the chicken, the pig and breakfast.  The chicken is involved, but the pig is committed.

[Brownshoe]

(10-03-2023, 03:47 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: You said it was all Duke and now with everybody telling you you are wrong you are back pedaling. Duke & Zac get along great and you tried to imply Zac has little involvement in the roster and that’s bogus crap. He’s had the most to do with it.

I'm not back pedaling at all. I'm saying Duke is in charge of that stuff. Zac has a say, but it's mostly Tobin and his staff. It's been shown that he's ignored previous coaching at the very least.

(10-03-2023, 04:09 PM)casear2727 Wrote: I believe Katie's only involvement regarding a drafted player would be in the case of red flags.  Zac and Lou have earned enough credibility to say no to a potential draft pick without a doubt.

Even though Duke and his staff do 75% of the heavy pulling of the process.

Katie has a lot of involvement in the FA process. Same with Duke. She's basically the one who is in control of how much we're willing to spend on players. Sooner was acting like the only reason we have this roster is because of Zac. I was just pointing out Tobin is in charge of the draft and it's outcome is mostly because of him. FA is a combination of Tobin and Katie (for cap space, and probably somewhat the player). Obviously Zac has a say in both, but they can override them.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 03:34 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: That's pure BS because Tobin is involved with scouting for the draft right now while Taylor is busy coaching the team.

I’m talking about draft day. Like Ceaser said. And I’ll add The position coaches are sent video of who the scouting department likes. They too are involved.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 04:24 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: I'm not back pedaling at all. I'm saying Duke is in charge of that stuff. Zac has a say, but it's mostly Tobin and his staff. It's been shown that he's ignored previous coaching at the very least.

Katie has a lot of involvement in the FA process. Same with Duke. She's basically the one who is in control of how much we're willing to spend on players. Sooner was acting like the only reason we have this roster is because of Zac. I was just pointing out Tobin is in charge of the draft and it's outcome is mostly because of him. FA is a combination of Tobin and Katie (for cap space, and probably somewhat the player). Obviously Zac has a say in both, but they can override them.

Both Katie and Duke were in place long before Zac… just saying!

[Brownshoe]

(10-03-2023, 05:02 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Both Katie and Duke were in place long before Zac… just saying!

Yeah and we've had plenty of good drafts before. We went to the playoffs 5 years in a row with Andy Dalton. If we had Burrow in those years I have no doubt that we would have won multiple SBs.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-03-2023, 05:04 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Yeah and we've had plenty of good drafts before. We went to the playoffs 5 years in a row with Andy Dalton. If we had Burrow in those years I have no doubt that we would have won multiple SBs.

I'm not sure we would've drafted a 10 year old kid to play QB for us. 

[*Synric*]

Everyone is wrong Darrin Simmons has been the man behind the curtain all along.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-03-2023, 05:07 PM)Synric Wrote: Everyone is wrong Darrin Simmons has been the man behind the curtain all along.

And he would've gotten away with it if it wasn't for those meddling kids. 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 04:59 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I’m talking about draft day.

That's pure speculation on your part.

Quote:Like Ceaser said.

That Katie has final say over prospects with red flags? Well, I remember you claiming Mike Brown has final say.

Quote:And I’ll add The position coaches are sent video of who the scouting department likes. They too are involved.

Yeah, no kidding. It's only been that way for decades. That's a long-standing criticism, neophyte. The Bengals heavy reliance upon their coaches to scout prospects due to the small size of the scouting department. The coaches are busy coaching during the season. They don't get involved with scouting until after the season ends. That puts them at a disadvantage. They usually aren't involved until the Senior Bowl. It is suggested as one of the reasons why the Bengals have not had great success at drafting Olinemen.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 03:34 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: That's pure BS because Tobin is involved with scouting for the draft right now while Taylor is busy coaching the team.

I’m talking about draft day. Like Ceaser said

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 05:02 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Both Katie and Duke were in place long before Zac… just saying!

Yeah, so was Mike Brown.  Guess who is less involved now? Mike Brown. And who has been handed the reigns? His daughter. That coincides with the Bengals turn around. Um, remind me who hired Zac Taylor, again?

Now Tobin and the coaches don't have to sign Kmart Blue Light Specials during free agency or try to convert a fringe talent DE into a TE to replace a started who was just concussed. Taylor has NEVER had to deal with that BS.


Taylor is involved, but Katie is responsible for allowing the staff to do their jobs after her father's reign of incompetence has come to an end.  Now, to a self-proclaimed Bengals neophyte you obviously don't understand.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 05:30 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I’m talking about draft day. Like Ceaser said

He basically said Katie has veto power over Tobin and Taylor. Is that what you're saying?

You tell me how it works in your own words.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 05:50 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Yeah, so was Mike Brown.  Guess who is less involved now? Mike Brown. And who has been handed the reigns? His daughter. That coincides with the Bengals turn around. Um, remind me who hired Zac Taylor, again?

Now Tobin and the coaches don't have to sign Kmart Blue Light Specials during free agency or try to convert a fringe talent DE into a TE to replace a started who was just concussed. Taylor has NEVER had to deal with that BS.


Taylor is involved, but Katie is responsible for allowing the staff to do their jobs after her father's reign of incompetence has come to an end.  Now, to a self-proclaimed Bengals neophyte you obviously don't understand.

No I agree about Katie and her daughters influence

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 05:52 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: He basically said Katie has veto power over Tobin and Taylor. Is that what you're saying?

You tell me how it works in your own words.

Mike Brown was always involved and early in Zac’s tenure it was the 3 of them on the top picks. I don’t think any of us know how it works now.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-03-2023, 08:56 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Mike Brown was always involved and early in Zac’s tenure it was the 3 of them on the top picks. I don’t think any of us know how it works now.

That may be the first believable comment you’ve made.

Guess what? If you and your many insiders don’t know how it works now, you sure af didn’t know before. I’ve dealt with too many privates and drug seekers to be naive enough to fall for this BS.

[Soonerpeace]

(10-03-2023, 09:11 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: That may be the first believable comment you’ve made.

Guess what? If you and your many insiders don’t know how it works now, you sure af didn’t know before. I’ve dealt with too many privates and drug seekers to be naive enough to fall for this BS.

You are an easy mark sir