7/11 - always open

[Bengalbug]

Do you think Chase got this from Chad? Do you think he even is aware Chad proclaimed this?

It’s amazing to look back over the last 20 years and realize, while not hall of Famers, we have had some greats at receiver - Chad, AJ, Chase.

Since 2003, those three account for the 9 best total season yards in bengals history.

Since 2003, the bengals have two of the top 26 career receiving leaders in Green and Chad (spending most of their careers here). They would be higher on the list had they been able to hold on to their primes for just a few more seasons, for completely different reasons.

[TecmoBengals]

Chad made such comments to have fun and promote himself. I listened to Chase say it in the presser and I interpreted his using the phrase as more matter of fact and business like. Chase is confident.

Zac's presser was also interesting when discussing Chase. He noted Chase has to process more information more than any player other than Burrow. Taylor said Chase excels at it which is what allows them to use him in different ways.

I did like Zac when he joked about "not getting any ideas" to the media after he directly stated Chase could play RB. Zac caught himself and knew the reporters might run with that a little too much.

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 10:52 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Chad made such comments to have fun and promote himself. I listened to Chase say it in the presser and I interpreted his using the phrase as more matter of fact and business like. Chase is confident.

Zac's presser was also interesting when discussing Chase. He noted Chase has to process more information more than any player other than Burrow. Taylor said Chase excels at it which is what allows them to use him in different ways.

I did like Zac when he joked about "not getting any ideas" to the media after he directly stated Chase could play RB. Zac caught himself and knew the reporters might run with that a little too much.

One thing I don’t understand, in regards to Zac’s comments. Why is it, in certain games, it seems so easy for the defense to take away chase?

[TecmoBengals]

(10-11-2023, 10:56 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: One thing I don’t understand, in regards to Zac’s comments.  Why is it, in certain games, it seems so easy for the defense to take away chase?

I had the same thought when listening to Zac. He noted that they need to find ways to get Chase the ball and use his skill set. Yet, it doesn't always happen? This year the answer lies with Burrow's injury.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-11-2023, 10:56 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: One thing I don’t understand, in regards to Zac’s comments.  Why is it, in certain games, it seems so easy for the defense to take away chase?

It happens to the best of receivers across teams at times. It's not just Chase.

Looking as Justin Jefferson's 2022 season, he had 6 games under 50 yards receiving.
Sometimes, teams find ways to block out a guy.
It's up to the coaches to be able to change up gameplan and go to others when the top guy gets blanketed.

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 10:57 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I had the same thought when listening to Zac. He noted that they need to find ways to get Chase the ball and use his skill set. Yet, it doesn't always happen? This year the answer lies with Burrow's injury.

I just compiled stats since 2021, for Chase, Jefferson, Kupp, Hill and Adam’s. I looked at this through the lens of

1. Difference maker/game wrecker (games with 100+ yards)
2. Contributor (games with 61-99 yards)
3. Meh to disappointing (games with 60 or less yards).

Chase has played 34 games:
1. 11 games over 100 yards (32% of games)
2. 9 games as a contributor (26%)
3. 14 games 60 yards or under (41%)

Jefferson - 39 games:
1. 20 (51%)
2. 9 (23%)
3. 10 (26%)

Kupp - 27 games:
1. 18 (67%)
2. 7 (26%)
3. 2 (7%)

Hill - 39 games (closest comp to chase)
1. 13 (33%)
2. 11 (28%)
3. 15 (38%)

Adams - 39 games
1. 17 (44%)
2. 12 (31%)
3. 10 (26%)

My thoughts…

Kupp is ridiculous when healthy.
Chase needs to flip flop his boom and “meh” weeks. Minimally, let’s move the meh weeks to contributor weeks. Having 60 yards or less 41%, or 7 games out of the year, isn’t going to cut it.

I know there is a lot more to this (coaching, scheme, bad starts by the team), but every other player on this list has dealt with similar adversity.

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 11:33 AM)ochocincos Wrote: It happens to the best of receivers across teams at times. It's not just Chase.

Looking as Justin Jefferson's 2022 season, he had 6 games under 50 yards receiving.
Sometimes, teams find ways to block out a guy.
It's up to the coaches to be able to change up gameplan and go to others when the top guy gets blanketed.

See my most recent post, I used 60 yards and not 50, but Jefferson is far more consistent over a 2.25 year span.

Again, I don’t think this is all on chase. I think it’s a bengals thing and it has been for a while. The bengals let other teams dictate far to often.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-11-2023, 11:38 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: See my most recent post, I used 60 yards and not 50, but Jefferson is far more consistent over a 2.25 year span.  

Again, I don’t think this is all on chase. I think it’s a bengals thing and it has been for a while.  The bengals let other teams dictate far to often.

Fair, but I'm not worried if Chase gets blanketed occasionally.
I'm more concerned with the fact it seems like it has to be Chase or Higgins for the offense to do anything.
They should be able to utilize the TE, running game, and Boyd if Chase and Higgins are getting well covered.


It feels more like they try to stick to their gameplan whether it's working or not, not adapting on the fly very much/well.

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 11:46 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Fair, but I'm not worried if Chase gets blanketed occasionally.
I'm more concerned with the fact it seems like it has to be Chase or Higgins for the offense to do anything.
They should be able to utilize the TE, running game, and Boyd if Chase and Higgins are getting well covered.


It feels more like they try to stick to their gameplan whether it's working or not, not adapting on the fly very much/well.

Interestingly enough, although a smaller sample size, Chase IS more consistent in the playoffs.

7 games
2 over (29%, right on his target)
4 contributor games (57%)
1 meh (14%)

You would think that if there was ever a time to blanket him, it would
Be the playoffs. This actually tells me that the bengals CAN consistently put him into positions to win. Maybe the bengals are, for a lack of better words, lazier and in cruise control during the season. Idk, but you’re right about needing Higgins or chase.

Irwin was a pleasant surprise last week.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-11-2023, 11:51 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Interestingly enough, although a smaller sample size, Chase IS more consistent in the playoffs.

7 games
2 over (29%, right on his target)
4 contributor games (57%)
1 meh (14%)

You would think that if there was ever a time to blanket him, it would
Be the playoffs.  This actually tells me that the bengals CAN consistently put him into positions to win.  Maybe the bengals are, for a lack of better words, lazier and in cruise control during the season.  Idk, but you’re right about needing Higgins or chase.

Irwin was a pleasant surprise last week.

For sure.
I love seeing someone other than Higgins and Chase actually make an impact in games occasionally.
Imagine if the Bengals both A) had an impactful receiving TE, and B) knew how to utilize a receiving TE properly.
That could really open up the offense (IMO).

[SunsetBengal]

(10-11-2023, 11:38 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: See my most recent post, I used 60 yards and not 50, but Jefferson is far more consistent over a 2.25 year span.  

Again, I don’t think this is all on chase. I think it’s a bengals thing and it has been for a while.  The bengals let other teams dictate far to often.

Is that because Jefferson is that much better, or because his QB lacks the luxury of having  guys like Higgins and Boyd as his secondary options? 

[Nicomo Cosca]

Guys like Kupp and Adams didn’t truly break out until they were in their mid-late twenties.

Chase is still currently the youngest WR on the team (let that sink in). We haven’t even begun to see him at his best yet.

[KillerGoose]

(10-11-2023, 12:55 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Guys like Kupp and Adams didn’t truly break out until they were in their mid-late twenties.

Chase is still currently the youngest WR on the team (let that sink in). We haven’t even begun to see him at his best yet.

It's less about age and more about reps. That's where the old rule-of-thumb for receivers comes in, where it takes three years for a receiver to showcase who they are. Kupp was drafted at 24 and Adams at 22, so of course by the time they broke out they were in their mid-twenties. One of the arguments for drafting Chase was his age, as by the time he started becoming comfortable in the NFL he would still likely be in his early 20's. You can get a productive player who stays productive longer, as their physical prime is in tune with their understanding of the game. 

Chase will undoubtedly get better, but it's going to be more marginal improvements that make him more consistent. He's not far off from his peak but he will be able to stay at his peak for several years, which is the crazy part. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-11-2023, 01:17 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: It's less about age and more about reps. That's where the old rule-of-thumb for receivers comes in, where it takes three years for a receiver to showcase who they are. Kupp was drafted at 24 and Adams at 22, so of course by the time they broke out they were in their mid-twenties. One of the arguments for drafting Chase was his age, as by the time he started becoming comfortable in the NFL he would still likely be in his early 20's. You can get a productive player who stays productive longer, as their physical prime is in tune with their understanding of the game. 

Chase will undoubtedly get better, but it's going to be more marginal improvements that make him more consistent. He's not far off from his peak but he will be able to stay at his peak for several years, which is the crazy part. 

Well Chase and Jefferson broke out immediately. And in Adams case he had Aaron friggin Rodgers throwing to him, and not much competition for the ball on his team. So it only makes what Chase and JJ came right in and did all the more impressive.

[Sled21]

(10-11-2023, 10:23 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Do you think Chase got this from Chad?  Do you think he even is aware Chad proclaimed this?

It’s amazing to look back over the last 20 years and realize, while not hall of Famers, we have had some greats at receiver - Chad, AJ, Chase.

Since 2003, those three account for the 9 best total season yards in bengals history.

Since 2003, the bengals have two of the top 26 career receiving leaders in Green and Chad (spending most of their careers here).  They would be higher on the list had they been able to hold on to their primes for just a few more seasons, for completely different reasons.

Of course he did. How could he b a part of the Bengals and not know Chad proclaimed this back in his day. Even if Chase didn't know personally, Higgins grew up a Bengals fan and definitely knows and would have told him. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-11-2023, 12:31 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Is that because Jefferson is that much better, or because his QB lacks the luxury of having  guys like Higgins and Boyd as his secondary options? 

In Minny, it's basically Jefferson and everyone else. Here, we typically see what happens when it's Chase and everyone else (vs Cardinals) or when Higgins, Boyd and the TE are used more (Chase more modest numbers). 

It's one of the main reason's i'm not against letting Tee go and getting some picks for him. The Bengals can and have done just fine when it's Chase and Co. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-11-2023, 10:23 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Do you think Chase got this from Chad?  Do you think he even is aware Chad proclaimed this?

It’s amazing to look back over the last 20 years and realize, while not hall of Famers, we have had some greats at receiver - Chad, AJ, Chase.

Since 2003, those three account for the 9 best total season yards in bengals history.

Since 2003, the bengals have two of the top 26 career receiving leaders in Green and Chad (spending most of their careers here).  They would be higher on the list had they been able to hold on to their primes for just a few more seasons, for completely different reasons.

Sounds like something Chad would say honestly and it was very clever like Chad's antics. I actually take Ja'Marr much more seriously 
when he does it. It isn't just fun, it is truth and when Chase is playing his best along with Burrow I think they are the best WR/QB combo
in the NFL. Hope they can build on the Cards game against the Seahawks who aren't a very good Secondary at all from the numbers.

With our luck they are shutdown against us though and looking like the legion of boom of old lol

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 02:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: In Minny, it's basically Jefferson and everyone else. Here, we typically see what happens when it's Chase and everyone else (vs Cardinals) or when Higgins, Boyd and the TE are used more (Chase more modest numbers). 

It's one of the main reason's i'm not against letting Tee go and getting some picks for him. The Bengals can and have done just fine when it's Chase and Co. 

Go look at the Vikings target tree and compare it against ours, it’s eerily similar. They just have a TE as their number 2 option.

Chase 60
Higgins 34 (injured a game and a half)
Boyd 32
Everybody else

Jefferson 53
Hockenson 39
Addison 29
Everybody else

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 01:24 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Well Chase and Jefferson broke out immediately. And in Adams case he had Aaron friggin Rodgers throwing to him, and not much competition for the ball on his team. So it only makes what Chase and JJ came right in and did all the more impressive.

When Adam’s came into the league they had one of the best receivers in the game (jordy Nelson 151 targets) and one of the best slot receivers (Randall cobb 127 targets).

Davante “broke out” his 3rd year, and even still he was number 2 behind Jordy Nelson.

Yes, there was competition, significant competition. Adam’s also wasn’t a first round pick.

[Bengalbug]

(10-11-2023, 12:55 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Guys like Kupp and Adams didn’t truly break out until they were in their mid-late twenties.

Chase is still currently the youngest WR on the team (let that sink in). We haven’t even begun to see him at his best yet.

Guys like Kupp and Adam’s were not meant to be franchise saviors. They also got drafted to good teams with a lot of competition in front of them.

GB had in their primes Jordy Nelson and Randall Cobb
Rams had Robert Woods (say what you want, in 2018 he had 86 catches for 1,219 yards, 6 td, & 19 rushes for 157 yards and 1 td) and Brandin Cooks, who they just traded a first round pick for.